Space Colonization Options (Orbiting Stations, planets/moons)

Discussion in 'Science and Technology' started by valkyrie013, Jan 28, 2021.

  1. Dryson

    Dryson Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2014
    Not wanting to be a Bennington Downer, I hope everyone understands that humanity has to colonize the Moon along with moving the Seed Vault to the Moon, to avoid extinction at the hands of the Super Volcano under Yellowstone National Park?

    The Super V under Yellowstone is a world ending eruption, in so much that most ,if not all life will perish on Earth, both on land and in the water.

    The Super V erupting isn't a maybe or Grimm's Fairy Tale Book that you can close. The eruption of the Yellowstone National Park Super V is going to happen. The only refuge, the Moon.
     
  2. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon I love Star Trek Discovery Premium Member

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    The problem with volcanos is predicting them..... Yes Yellowstone going up might be a planet killer.
     
  3. Paul Weaver

    Paul Weaver Vice Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
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    There are many more potential refuges including Mars, Asteroids, Orbital colonies, Venus clouds, but also more pedestrian options like under the sea (with power coming from geothermal vents)

    By the time we have self-sufficent colonies that can survive the loss of Earth, we'll have the ability and understanding to prevent the eruption anyway.
     
  4. Dryson

    Dryson Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2014
    Mars is too far to use as the primary refuge planet. Asteroids are the very last option. Venus wouldn't even be on the table due to the proximity to the Sun. Submerged colonies might work, but with all of the ash sinking into the water and becoming a sludge, I think the filters on the submerged habitats would become clogged very quickly.

    Orbital stations would work, but considering the eruptoce force of the Super V erupting, orbital colonies might get knocked out of orbit.

    One way to save a lot of human life would be to develop cryogenic stasis systems that would keep people in suspended animation for upto 300 years.

    The Cryo Units would be placed on the dark side of the Moon, away from any potential debris from the Earth that might collide with the Moon.

    Mars would be the secondary refuge planet to store seeds and people in cryo units on just in case something went wrong on the Moon.

    500,000 million cryo units on the Moon and 10,000 on Mars, would ensure diversity was maintained along with having enough people to begin digging out the Earth from under fallout of the Super V.

    Then again the eruption might cause the Moon's orbit to destabilize and cause it to come closer to or be pushed further away from the Earth.

    One exciting potential that could aria is the Moon might trap some on the ejecta from the eruption that could be collected and processed by the colonies on the Moon.

    Based on the documentary I watched, the surface of the Earth will look similar to the surface of the Moon, in so much that gray ash will cover all of the U.S., Canada and South America, with the rest of the world seeing maybe a half foot of ashen fallout.

    When the Earth does recover from the Super V eruption, the landscape will be entirely different. Most of the ashen fallout should become swamp like due to rains. As the swamps dry up, Trees and plants life should begin to break through the hard layers of ash and solidified lava.

    Who knows, maybe even life forms will emerge, just like new life emerged after the rock that killed the dinos off collided with the Earth, a scant example of what the Super Volcano under Yellowstone will be like when it does finally erupt.


    The Titanic comes to mind when I think about the Super V erupting. We know it's coming, we need to start adjusting course now so that when Super V does go up, all we will hear is a slight rubbing of the hull against the eruption instead of a sudden and full decompression of the human race.
     
  5. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon I love Star Trek Discovery Premium Member

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    Cryo units really? And how do we revive them considering cryonics today doesn't work like that?
    More important it will never work. The freezing process ruptures cells.
     
  6. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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    The ice crystals act as tiny molecular knives. Some work is being done on vitrification.

    There was an entire book called Suspended Animation by Mr. Prehoda, but it may be out of date. Torpor/biolation is about the most that can be expected.

    The folks frozen now are just the most advanced mummies ever :)

    Speaking of ice..it can bend
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-bendable-ice-single-crystal-microfibers.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-infrared-cameras-artificial-intelligence-uncover.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-igniting-plasmas-liquids.html

    Outward looking…
    https://www.space.com/galileo-project-uap-ufos-one-year-update

    Metal has come a long way:
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-phase-transitions-advanced-materials.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-metallic-wood-heights.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-2d-alloy-combines-metals-carbon.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-gold-foolish.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-06-nuclear-batteries-approach-carbon-free-energy.html

    Saturn V effects
    https://www.space.com/saturn-v-rocket-sound-myth-debunked

    3D printing
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-programmable-printer.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-team-3d-inks.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-07-3d-printable-phase-changing-composites-temperatures.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-scientists-3d-grown-material-production-technologies.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-plastic-foam-combat-pollution.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-a-new-look-at-color.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-nanotech-oled-electrode-liberates-slash.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-metasurface-unprecedented-laser.html
    https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-06-exploring-silk-full-potential.html

    Beams
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-scientists-source-rare-subatomic-particles.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-06-scientists-focus-cone-temperature-electron.html


    Odd
    https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-06-babies-adults.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-remote.html

    Kiriform structures
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-06-kiriform-harness-buckling-stable-deployable.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-06-ancient-art-kirigami-eyeball-like-camera.html

    Sensor coating
    https://www.spacedaily.com/m/report...enables_spacecraft_as_sensor_concept_999.html
    Return to Luna
    https://www.space.com/moon-far-side-radio-science-opportunity
    https://www.moondaily.com/m/reports...nto_a_gray_area_of_international_law_999.html
    https://www.moondaily.com/m/reports/An_overview_of_NASAs_Artemis_1_mission_to_the_Moon_999.html
    https://www.moondaily.com/m/reports...unch_of_Artemis_test_mission_to_moon_999.html
    https://www.space.com/nasa-artemis-1-moon-mission-lightning-strike
    https://www.space.com/ridiculously-detailed-moon-photo-artemis-1-tribute
    https://www.space.com/artemis-1-space-shuttle-hardware
    https://www.space.com/nasa-artemis-moon-megarocket-space-launch-system
    https://www.space.com/lego-nasa-artemis-1-exhibit-kennedy-space-center
    https://www.thespacereview.com/article/4439/1

    O
    n orbit combat?
    https://www.space.com/space-force-space-flag-simulated-orbit-combat

    Spaceflight
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2022
  7. Dryson

    Dryson Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2014
    So building stasis units really won't be effective at preserving large numbers of humans for a couple hundred years on Moon then, to repopulate the Earth with.

    What about storing male semen and female eggs in the Seed Vault to repopulate the Earth with?
    How long can male semen and female eggs be kept frozen before the DNA starts to degrade?
     
  8. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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    More things are possible at small scales than larger ones.

    Embryos can be frozen indefinitely. We might even one day assign a quantum state to something that size as with the case with tiny drums.

    But the strange quark nugget passage…that was quite real. But seismologists and astronomers just don’t talk to one another. I am sure the speed and trajectory could be determined by those with the right math chops. That…whatsit…might loop back…Teton from 1972 was supposed to make a resonant return in the 1990s…and the Great Daylight Fireball did not fragment like the Chelyabinsk bolide…

    It was estimated that the strange quark matter might pass through the earth at 400 km per second (250 miles per second), 40 times the speed of seismic waves...
    One event occurred on 22 October 1993, when, according to the researchers, something entered the Earth off Antarctica and left it south of India 0.73 of a second later....

    The other occurred on 24 November 1993, when an object entered south of Australia and exited the Earth near Antarctica 0.15 of a second later.

    Unfortunately, scientists may not be able to find any more events that suggest the passage of strange quark matter through the Earth.

    In 1993 the US Geological Survey stopped collecting data from "unassociated events."


    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/2502755.stm#:~:text=It was estimated that the,the speed of seismic waves.

    Steampunk bike
    https://interestingengineering.com/...-his-motorcycle-to-run-on-methane-from-a-pond

    Optical levitation
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-optical-levitation-glass-nanosphere-enables.html

    'excitonic insulator'
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-evidence-anomalous-phase-energy-efficient-technologies.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-07-hidden-culprit-lithium-metal-batteries.html
    https://www.materialstoday.com/additive-manufacturing/news/polymer-coating-3dprinted-ceramics/

    Moon rover book
    https://www.thespacereview.com/article/4210/1

    LEGO Mars ship!
    https://www.thespacereview.com/article/4208/1
    https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/...al_Propulsion_Reactor_Concept_Awards_999.html

    Russian nuke ship
    https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=37957.msg2243112#msg2243112


    Magnetic ramjet
    https://www.centauri-dreams.org/2021/07/09/notes-on-the-magnetic-ramjet-ii/

    Estes rockets
    https://www.space.com/best-model-rockets
    https://www.space.com/best-space-board-games
    https://www.space.com/space-forums-giveaway-shuttle-endeavour-model

    China's quest
    https://www.thespacereview.com/article/4212/1
    https://www.space.com/china-mars-rover-zhurong-parachute-photos
    https://www.space.com/china-rocket-fleet-divert-asteroid-bennu
    http://www.ennead.com/work/shanghai-astronomy-museum

    Women in the space field
    https://www.thespacereview.com/article/4437/1

    Dyna Soar
    http://www.arapress.com/dyna-soar-book/
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2022
  9. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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  10. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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    publiusr
    Mars Crops
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-crops-mars-naked-sun.html
    https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-08-case-plant-based-vaccines.html

    Through the rubble
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-faster-path-rubble-roving-robots.html

    The word for today: ectogenesis
    https://sciencex.com/news/2021-08-humans-recolonize-earth-mass-extinctions.html
    https://mysteriousuniverse.org/2021/07/warning-to-aliens-get-ready-for-the-space-marines/

    Another odd concept: anti-freezing
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-vibrations-cooling-anti-freezing.html
    What is completely unusual and had never been observed in this way before was that as the material cooled down further, the fluctuations became faster again, while the ordered areas shrank.

    Nice ink
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-artsea-ink-seaweed-based-3d.html

    Solar sail tech
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34925

    Heat shield https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34911
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34908 steel heat shield
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34918
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34883

    Flextronics for the cold
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-stretchable-sensor-material-power-wearable.html
    https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-08-app-relieve-pain.html
    https://interestingengineering.com/nasa-interns-design-a-space-washing-machine-for-astronauts
    https://interestingengineering.com/houses-built-into-the-earth-may-save-us-from-the-heat

    Looking at rocket tech
    https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2328...f-a-fatal-problem-in-rocket-engine-combustors
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-elusive-molecule-key-combustion-chemistry.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-polymer-coating-fuel-production.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-stinkweed-cleaner-bio-jet-fuel.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-molecular-soot-pollution.html
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34910 retropropulsion

    Rocket design
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34944

    Misc:
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-hydrogen-technologies-role-net.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-pulsed-lasers-liquids-effective-catalysts.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-ultrafast-x-ray-plasma-discharge-breakdown.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-holistic-approach-materials-electrical-insulation.html
    https://interestingengineering.com/...-cut-rail-construction-carbon-emissions-by-50
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-chemical-reactions.html chemical computation

    SUNCAT and other tech
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-catalyst-carbon-dioxide-fuel-ways.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-smart-off-grid-desalination.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-chemists-key-greener-food-production.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-non-line-of-sight-imaging-picosecond-temporal-resolution.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-comprehensive-technological.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-smart-necklace-track-facial.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-uncovers-atomic-waltz-atom.html
    https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-08-lung-drug-heart-failure-patients.html
    https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-08-scientists-blocking-opioid-receptors-specific.html
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...kes-history-completing-5K-run-53-minutes.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-framework-robot-path-unstructured-environments.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-robot-fresh-insight-locomotion-neuroscience.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-probe-exotic-aids-atomic-particle.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-flexible-wearable-x-ray-detector-doesnt.html
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34903 asteroid deflector
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-photovoltaic-indoors.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-2d-material-defects-enable-electronics.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-exploring-limits-light-matter-coupling-nanoscale.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-thermally-efficient-electrical-contacts.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-elect...rfaces-dual-epsilon-near-zero-resonances.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-shielding-ultracold-molecules-microwaves.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-semiconductor-device-possibilities-black-phosphorous.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-metamaterials-fundamental-limits-photonics.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-robots-goof.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-sunlight-contaminants.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-forests-cool-planet-thought.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-artificial-intelligence-extreme-weather-mysteries.html


    Plastics and more
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-polymer-enables-tougher-recyclable-thermoplastics.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-method-fabricating-flexible-electronics.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-stereoselective-alkene-synthesis-non-precious-nickel.html


    Polarize light at will
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-metasurfaces-polarized.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-tunable-metasurface-akin-optical-swiss.html

    Apollo module still in orbit?
    https://phys.org/news/2021-07-apollo-ascent-stage-orbiting-moon.html

    NTR/NEP
    https://kb.osu.edu/bitstream/handle/1811/87426/1/Justin_Clark_Undergraduate_Thesis.pdf

    Landers
    http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/excursion.php
    http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/embarking.php
    https://arc.aiaa.org/doi/10.2514/1.A34833

    Heat coating with ytterbium disilicate
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-material-coating-ceramic.html

    Fun exhibit
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-interactive-gravitational-wave-detector-museums-fairs.html

    Dyson spheres
    https://interestingengineering.com/scientists-claim-space-megastructures-could-resurrect-the-dead
    https://interestingengineering.com/google-claims-creating-a-new-phase-of-matter-in-perpetual-motion

    Orion
    https://interestingengineering.com/project-orion-the-atomic-starship-that-never-got-off-the-ground

    Anti-matter...cool image
    https://interestingengineering.com/physicists-outlined-a-simple-new-way-to-create-antimatter

    The Wendelstein 7-X fusion device
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-wendelstein-x-concept-efficiency.html

    Lastly...a breakthrough
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-material-ecofriendly-solution-energy.html

    The polycrystalline tin selenide could be developed for use in solid-state thermoelectric devices in a variety of industries, with potentially enormous energy savings. A key application target is capturing industrial waste heat—such as from power plants, the automobile industry and glass- and brick-making factories—and converting it to electricity. More than 65% of the energy produced globally from fossil fuels is lost as waste heat.

    Metamaterials crafting:
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-algorithm-cellular-materials.html


    Hide....bite
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-soft-robot-chameleon-real-time-background.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-sea-lampreys-natural-instincts.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-snakes-fangs.html
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2021
  11. valkyrie013

    valkyrie013 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2009
    If it ever came to an ele best option for Humanity would be frozen embryos underground in either has small team of people living or just give it all to robots and at the time when Earth has healed and we will be unfrozen raised and new set of human to walk out
     
  12. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon I love Star Trek Discovery Premium Member

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    In other words real life Horizon Zero Dawn cradles, or I Am Mother, or whatever brand of frozen babies in the new world you'd like to go with.
     
  13. valkyrie013

    valkyrie013 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2009
    Even if the above happened, Yellowstone goes Big Badda Boom, it is an ELE, but its not a End of Earth Event, sure Billions would die, but not everybody, the air would clear eventually, but colder. alot of species would die, but given time, the Earth would rebalance itself, and continue on, with or without us.
     
  14. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon I love Star Trek Discovery Premium Member

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    At least it isn't an AI rebellion or rogue swarm of robots.. Nature just doing her thing
     
  15. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
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    publiusr
    SPACE STORMS
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-earth-space-storms.html
    The Michigan Sun-to-Earth Model, including the SWMF Geospace and the new GPU port, is available as open-source at https://github.com/MSTEM-QUDA.
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-small-scale-magnetic-canopies-globally-splicing.html

    Drones and the spider's web
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-drones-obstacles-high.html
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-decade-interdisciplinary-collaboration-3d-spider.html

    Uranium eater
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-sponge-bacteria-geobacter-uranium.html

    Protective barrier tech
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-invisible-barrier-breakthrough-boon-electronics.html


    ENERGY NEWS---------

    Blue Hydrogen has been called worse than coal:
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-touted-blue-hydrogen-worse-gas.html

    But there may be some hope.....with ammonia:
    https://www.ozy.com/the-new-and-the...ut-of-thin-air-for-85-cents-per-gallon/92686/

    Now it is best used for ships:
    https://cen.acs.org/energy/renewables/Ammonia-route-fuel-ships-planes/98/i31

    CO2 capture and vortex engine
    https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2019/...ould-be-captured-and-liquified-into-fuel.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-marine-bacteria-canadian-arctic-capable.html
    https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2019/...ex-would-boost-engine-efficiency-by-5-10.html


    But now--there is this SECOND ammonia advance!

    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-technique-seamlessly-ammonia-green-hydrogen.html

    A research team led by Professor Guntae Kim in the School of Energy and Chemical Engineering at UNIST has announced a breakthrough in technology that efficiently converts liquid ammonia into hydrogen....In this study, the research team succeeded in producing green hydrogen (H2) in large quantities with a purity of nearly 100 percent by decomposing liquid ammonia (NH3) into electricity. Besides, according to the research team, such method consumed three times less power than hydrogen made using electrolysis of water.

    Roger Gordon's tech plus this might be the big break we have all been waiting for.

    But I am thinking what this might mean for rocketry....namely very large rockets farther down the road for harvesting for gas giants say.

    The ammonia keeps the nozzle cool.....you convert to electricity and burn away to hydrogen....the electricity is used to convert the ammonia to more hydrogen....


    In materials news, we have a tough glass:

    The resulting material, AM-III carbon, is yellowish, with no defined structure, and is very strong—it scored 113 gigapascals on the Vickers hardness test, higher than some diamonds, which average just 100 gigapascals. The researchers note that AM-III is approximately ten times as hard as steel and should be quite a bit better at stopping bullets than most vest technology. To prove its toughness, they used one sample to cut a deep scratch into a diamond. The researchers note that the toughness comes about from the material's makeup—it has micro-structures that are orderly like crystals, along with unordered glass, which makes it part glass and part crystal. It also makes the material a semiconductor with a bandgap range similar to silicon. Because of that, the researchers suggest their new material could prove useful in solar panel products.
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-newly-synthesized-am-iii-carbon-hardest-strongest.html

    This should be combined with the tech here for spacesuits
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-chain-mail-fabric-stiffen-demand.html

    Known as 'wearable structured fabrics', the development could pave the way for next-generation smart fabrics that can harden to protect a user against an impact or when additional load-bearing capacity is needed.

    Light batteries
    https://techxplore.com/news/2021-08-packaging-free-quadruples-microbatteries-energy-density.html

    Riemann in the news
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-riemann-zeros-accurately.html

    Quantum playgrounds and building blocks
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-physicists-built-mathematical-playground-quantum.html
    https://phys.org/news/2021-08-three-dimensional-kirigami-blocks-dynamic-metamaterials.html
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2021
  16. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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    TLDR.
    honestly i don't know who can read all the link salad.
     
  17. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon I love Star Trek Discovery Premium Member

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    Link soup? The Great link?
     
  18. StarCruiser

    StarCruiser Commodore Commodore

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    Dec 26, 2002
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    Houston, we have a problem...
    Publiusr does that everywhere he goes...

    Sometimes, there's useful info in there; other times...notsomuch...
     
  19. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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    publiusr
    Connectivity is everything…cross-pollination. I can wear a bit at times but indulge me for a moment. There is no money in being a generalist… but as I see it the problem is over-specialization.

    There may be a soul on this very board who notices the perhaps forgotten Roger Gordon (it’s ammonia I want to focus on—surprisingly enough) and this newest ammonia to hydrogen breakthrough I simply can’t stress enough. I bet Guntae Kim never heard of Roger…but I hope someone here who is interested in green tech sees this connection and pursues it. Mars is going to need nitrogen same as oxygen.

    So while everyone is focused on methalox, these two new ammonia breakthroughs fit hand in glove…and I hope someone with money sees this here and pursues it. Maybe iron/air batteries where you want rust.

    Just stirring the cosmic soup here. I’ll try better recipes.

    Forget Moon/Mars…I want steel tankage on Titan…that is the richest industrial resource world there is.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2021
  20. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon I love Star Trek Discovery Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2015
    Location:
    The Other Realms
    Whaaaat the actual F did I just read?