So have things really changed

[Galactus]

Not going to make a long rant. I have been gone for awhile but I just came back recently. With the announcement of Hal Jordan Green Lantern and the movie that was Dragonball, I was wondering are we ever going to get a serious big budget superhero movie that shows us more diversity. I know there has been Blade, Spawn, Catwoman, and I guess Hancock but those people are all black and still so few. I mean it is better than the old days but it really saddens me that we have not move further along than we are.

P.S. I forgot Zorro. So I guess there is progress just not enough for my tastes.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

When the movies are based on characters that aren't that diverse, I'm not sure what you'd expect?

From Marvel and DC, are there THAT many diverse and interesting characters compared to not? Not even close. Most of the time, they were created first and foremost to be "look at me, I'm ethnic", not something the character just happened to be.

I mean, do you really think a movie based on Alpha Flight's Inuit "Snowbird" would bring in the cash?

 

[Hermiod]

I see no reason why there can't be other Green Lanterns in the movie - John Stewart included.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

I see no reason why there can't be other Green Lanterns in the movie - John Stewart included.

Exactly!

Iron Man had room for Jim. And everything I've read from the script writer of Green Lantern says there will be a lot of the Green Lantern universe used.

ie, you won't get more diverse than the aliens that are part of the corps.

Granted, the lead is still Hal Jordan. But you can't do much about that. He's numero uno when it comes to earth-born Lanterns.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

Let's face it, it's probably the easiest decision to cast white actors. Movies are about making money and not bringing about change. If the majority of the audience is white and there's a chance they might not be open to actors of different races why risk making less money? It's not a nice answer I know.

Beyond that though I think there are a couple of other factors. I think one part of it is that we keep reaching back to the past in the movies. When movies are made from properties 30-70 years old it's not suprising that we see a lot of white characters. We know Superman, Batman, James Kirk, James Bond and so forth are white.

Green Lantern is an interesting one though because I'd contend that there's a significant portion of the audience who know him as a black character from the cartoons. You really could go either way with this one but I think John Stewart is more well known as the JLA Green Lantern than GL on his own. I'm not that familiar with the comics so I don't know what the situation is there but it seems that Hal is the main focus there as well, if only because he was the original.

Another problem I see with black characters at least is that there seems to be a need for them to be portrayed as streetwise which doesn't always mesh with the stories that a filmmaker may want to show. I think that's part of an attempt to not ignore the culture of the characters but it sometimes goes too far lumping all such characters into that well.

Mind you this is just conjecture on my part, I don't know if it's fact or not, I don't know that anyone knows for sure why this is.

 

[nx1701g]

Green Lantern is an interesting one though because I'd contend that there's a significant portion of the audience who know him as a black character from the cartoons. You really could go either way with this one but I think John Stewart is more well known as the JLA Green Lantern than GL on his own. I'm not that familiar with the comics so I don't know what the situation is there but it seems that Hal is the main focus there as well, if only because he was the original.

I agree. I'm more familiar with John Stewart for that very reason (I didn't start reading GL until recently around the time of JL: Unlimited actually).

 

[Shawnster]

Would it upset too many apple carts if they'd have cast a black actor in the role of Hal Jordan?

Samuel L. Jackson made a good cameo for Nick Fury. I didn't personally have a problem with that. Of course, I want to see Jackson in that role now if they ever get around to a Nick Fury/S.H.I.E.L.D movie.

Of course these arguments always tend to go black vs. white. Why not Asian, Indian, Inuit/American Indian, etc...? Why exclude these other minorities?

 

[Mr. Adventure]

^^ You mean the same way people are upset about white people in Dragonball and Avatar?

 

[nx1701g]

Would it upset too many apple carts if they'd have cast a black actor in the role of Hal Jordan?

Samuel L. Jackson made a good cameo for Nick Fury. I didn't personally have a problem with that. Of course, I want to see Jackson in that role now if they ever get around to a Nick Fury/S.H.I.E.L.D movie.

Of course these arguments always tend to go black vs. white. Why not Asian, Indian, Inuit/American Indian, etc...? Why exclude these other minorities?

I'm not too sure about one thing: was it before or after they had selected Samuel L. Jackson as the physical template for the Marvel Ultimates series?

 

[Hermiod]

Would it upset too many apple carts if they'd have cast a black actor in the role of Hal Jordan?

Samuel L. Jackson made a good cameo for Nick Fury. I didn't personally have a problem with that. Of course, I want to see Jackson in that role now if they ever get around to a Nick Fury/S.H.I.E.L.D movie.

Of course these arguments always tend to go black vs. white. Why not Asian, Indian, Inuit/American Indian, etc...? Why exclude these other minorities?

I'm not too sure about one thing: was it before or after they had selected Samuel L. Jackson as the physical template for the Marvel Ultimates series?

Jackson gave Mark Millar and David Finch, the creators of The Ultimates, specific written permission to use his likeness in the series long before Iron Man was even conceived as a film.

It would upset this man's apple cart if they had cast a black man, or anyone who could does not look vaguely like Hal Jordan, in the role because it would be a very obvious case of stunt casting. We have a black Green Lantern, his name's John Stewart and as I said there is no reason why he cannot be present in the film.

Unfortunately, when you move down the list of each company's top characters, you have to go down quite a way before you get to any black characters at all. However, Luke Cage has become a very prominent character in the Marvel Universe now thanks to Brian Michael Bendis.

 

[stueyross]

Would it upset too many apple carts if they'd have cast a black actor in the role of Hal Jordan?

Actually yes. It'd have pissed me off royally. Why dont we have a black Superman? How about a Chinese Batman? Now we're rocking, what about a Gay Disabled Scottish Wolverine, awesome. Lets make Captain America black, with some hip jive talkin to we're down with the kids, oh and we can change his shield for some bling!

Hmm we need more female superheroines out there. Lets make Thor female, and lets make her a Lesbian too. Oh and a Whale Lover and a single mother. groovy.

Y'know what, it's fucking annoying enough that they piss about with minor characters like Kingpin etc. I dont mind that so much, but stop fucking messing with my childhood icons.

Would you get upset if Buddha was portrayed as a skinny white gay guy, and the christian god was a big fat woman from Germany?

Its not broke. Stop trying to fix it.

 

[miraclefan]

Would it upset too many apple carts if they'd have cast a black actor in the role of Hal Jordan?

Actually yes. It'd have pissed me off royally. Why dont we have a black Superman? How about a Chinese Batman? Now we're rocking, what about a Gay Disabled Scottish Wolverine, awesome. Lets make Captain America black, with some hip jive talkin to we're down with the kids, oh and we can change his shield for some bling!

Hmm we need more female superheroines out there. Lets make Thor female, and lets make her a Lesbian too. Oh and a Whale Lover and a single mother. groovy.

Y'know what, it's fucking annoying enough that they piss about with minor characters like Kingpin etc. I dont mind that so much, but stop fucking messing with my childhood icons.

Would you get upset if Buddha was portrayed as a skinny white gay guy, and the christian god was a big fat woman from Germany?

Its not broke. Stop trying to fix it.

AMEN!

 

[Hermiod]

If we need more female superhero characters for movies, I would like to suggest one who STILL hasn't had her own movie.

 

[Dar70]

Would it upset too many apple carts if they'd have cast a black actor in the role of Hal Jordan?

Actually yes. It'd have pissed me off royally. Why dont we have a black Superman? How about a Chinese Batman? Now we're rocking, what about a Gay Disabled Scottish Wolverine, awesome. Lets make Captain America black, with some hip jive talkin to we're down with the kids, oh and we can change his shield for some bling!

Hmm we need more female superheroines out there. Lets make Thor female, and lets make her a Lesbian too. Oh and a Whale Lover and a single mother. groovy.

Y'know what, it's fucking annoying enough that they piss about with minor characters like Kingpin etc. I dont mind that so much, but stop fucking messing with my childhood icons.

Would you get upset if Buddha was portrayed as a skinny white gay guy, and the christian god was a big fat woman from Germany?

Its not broke. Stop trying to fix it.

Well said. Now I have nothing to add to this conversation you said it all.

 

[wamdue]

what would be the point of casting a black Hal Jordan, they might as well have just cast "John Stewart" its not like he was not part of the successful Justice League cartoon series.

 

[Newski]

John Stewart on Justice League was essentially Hal Jordan anyway. Nothing about him, save his skin color, made him any different. In that sense, I think the cartoon failed, actually.I'm a bigger "Hal Jordan" fan, but if you are going to use John, actually make him John.


There just aren't enough popular black heroes to put to film. Sure, we have more than ever, but ultimately, they aren't as popular as the white heroes. That's just how it works. It's not because they don't want to bring diversity to the screen. They just have no reason to.


I'm sure Luke Cage will be added to that huge list of black heroes that have had movies, and you'll shrug it off like you did those, because you think nobody's trying. I think they've done their fair share, given their limitations considering what heroes will actually fill theaters.


Meanwhile, if you want diversity, here you go.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNEoP7TuEu8

 

[Hermiod]

A Luke Cage movie could work if they cast a decent actor and don't chicken out when they realise his wife is white.

 

[barnaclelapse]

I never understand why this is so complicated.

If an actor is right for the part, then cast them regardless of race, gender or preference. If not, then you probably shouldn't bother unless that actor is talented enough to bring something significant to what may be nothing more than a transparent PC move by a studio.

 

[Hermiod]

I never understand why this is so complicated.

If an actor is right for the part, then cast them regardless of race, gender or preference. If not, then you probably shouldn't bother unless that actor is talented enough to bring something significant to what may be nothing more than a transparent PC move by a studio.

It's really this simple. Hal Jordan. Not Hal Jordan.

 

[Galactus]

Its not broke. Stop trying to fix it.

So you don't think it is broke? I am glad that everyone does not share your point of view. It most certainly is broke because all of these characters are essentially a bunch of white guys running around. Even when the characters are suppose to be a different race, they still make them white. I didn't see you make any complaints about that. For the most part they were all created when the world was a lot different and being a racist bigot was ok and the norm. So to say they are not broke is just not correct.

I don't know why these discussions always break down to black and white. I personally never go that route. I want to see people from all cultures shown in the movies and I think that if you make a good movie with the same effort that is put into other movies people will go see it.

I am not saying progress has not been made, but we still have a long way to go. Unfortunately for me we keep going in the wrong direction. There is no need for Ripcord to be black, Karate Kid to be black, Goku to be white etc. If they simply use the characters they have then that would be enough. How can the characters get popular if they are never actually used?