Sexy or Creepy?

[Nerys Ghemor]

Just today I was at a car dealership and the woman (not unattractive) was talking to me in a friendly tone, and next thing I know she wrapped both her hands around mine and started pulling me slightly towards her..I was somewhat irked, but I didn't really say anything. My wife was 30 feet away but couldn't see. I wonder if this kind of thing would have been seen differently if a man had done it to a woman.

While I don't see a difference, unfortunately I think some people would. But to me, basic respect by any individual should mean not crossing boundaries like that without permission. I don't care if a man or a woman is initiating it.

I do suspect, however, that no one would be telling RAMA that he'd been manipulated and molested.

The equivalent of what happened in this situation would probably be an ass grab or possibly a crotch grab. I would expect that some men would--rightfully--find it very unpleasant to have that happen uninvited. A man in that situation would be entitled to tell the woman to stop or take legal action if he considered it necessary.

 

[RAMA]

While I don't see a difference, unfortunately I think some people would. But to me, basic respect by any individual should mean not crossing boundaries like that without permission. I don't care if a man or a woman is initiating it.

I do suspect, however, that no one would be telling RAMA that he'd been manipulated and molested.

The equivalent of what happened in this situation would probably be an ass grab or possibly a crotch grab. I would expect that some men would--rightfully--find it very unpleasant to have that happen uninvited. A man in that situation would be entitled to tell the woman to stop or take legal action if he considered it necessary.

I've had the crotch grab before. I can't say that was wanted, but it also hasn't threatened me either. I've also had public neck massages and such. Yes did ask them to stop.

 

[Kestra]

All this talk of touching is making me uncomfortable.

 

[Gryffindorian]

Aye, especially the ass grabbing and crotch grabbing talks.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

That was the point of bringing it up. I would definitely find it creepy if a woman did that to a man. To me, it's not a gender thing. It is a matter of keeping out of people's personal space when uninvited.

 

[Kestra]

Aye, especially the ass grabbing and crotch grabbing talks.

I was joking ...

 

[Alidar Jarok]

That was the point of bringing it up. I would definitely find it creepy if a woman did that to a man. To me, it's not a gender thing. It is a matter of keeping out of people's personal space when uninvited.

I still think that would depend on the context. I've been in a few situations where it would certainly not have been unwelcome or uninvited (well, maybe unwelcome for anyone else who might have been nearby, but that's a different story).

 

[Kestra]

That was the point of bringing it up. I would definitely find it creepy if a woman did that to a man. To me, it's not a gender thing. It is a matter of keeping out of people's personal space when uninvited.

I'm pretty sure that kissing someone back can be interpreted as an invitation of some sort.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I would consider a crotch/ass grab to be uncomfortable, at best. Whether it be from a lover, a date, or a stranger at a bar. Then again I try not to be the aggressive type.

 

[Gryffindorian]

Aye, especially the ass grabbing and crotch grabbing talks.

I was joking ...

Oh.

As for RAMA getting groped, you just like to brag, don't you, man? Kidding, kidding. Maybe ...

 

[Emher]

I fucked a stranger after knowing her for about an hour. It was awesome.

You're still getting a virtual high five for that

Oh, and again on the boob thing: if a man doesn't feel comfortable putting his hands on the woman he's frenching then he's not doing it right!

Gotta admit, that is a very good point.

If we ever meet in person I promise I'll give you a big hug and touch both your boobs!

God, you're so creepy!

It's part of what makes me so awesome.

Indeed

 

[The Castellan]

That was the point of bringing it up. I would definitely find it creepy if a woman did that to a man. To me, it's not a gender thing. It is a matter of keeping out of people's personal space when uninvited.

I'd LOVE to have a cute girl do that to me, to hell with personal space.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

I've no desire to start my own tangent here. All I have to say to all of that is... Society has made me cynical and bitter, I suspect that handsome Frenchmen get away with moves like that one a lot easier than someone like me could. Not to suggest you're shallow, not by any means, just that, well, some women are shallow and have allowed this guy's ego to get boosted over a life-time so that they can pull this sort of thing off.

Some of us have to work at this sort of stuff and cannot get by on our looks, our accents, our use of foreign languages and even then we still get cast aside and ignored.

It's the general inequality in dating and wooing that bitters me. The handsome jocks get the girl, the nerds get to tutor the girl on her homework.

Sorry man, but you've got no sympathy here. Life is full of inequity, in every aspect, and everyone, everyone suffers. Try having 3 life threatening chronic illnesses to deal with...try living on the streets as a child...try having to talk your own mother out of committing suicide when you're only 14...and that's just the tip of my iceberg. And I know, I really do, that despite everything, I've got it a hell of a lot better than do many in this world. Some people have it easier than others: that's just the way it is. So, frankly, suck it up. Attitude is hard to change, but it can be done, and you'll feel a lot better for it.

(And for Christ's sake, everyone on this forum is a nerd, or else we wouldn't be here!)

I just had to comment on this as it sums up my attitude toward life in general.

Everybody has shit to deal with. Some have had more than others. It's not fair, but that's life. All that matters is how you approach it. When something bad happens to me, sure, I feel shitty. But do I sit and dwell on it and mentally beat up on myself about how bad my life is? Never. I've never found it productive to grouse about my problems unless I'm actively working on fixing them. That's all I care about. If I find a problem I can't do anything about, I do my best to work around it and just avoid it. If it's a problem I can fix, then I get to work on fixing it. And if I don't know how to fix it, I get help.

Life is just too precious and too short to waste lamenting the bad hand you were dealt. And the last thing you want is to be on your deathbed, thinking about all the things you never did because you were too busy feeling sorry for yourself.

 

[doubleohfive]

While I certainly don't want to, nor do I think it productive to pile on Trekker here (again), I would simply state that while I sympathize, its also very true that these kinds of things are best dealt with in how we approach the problem.

I know you're struggling with your own issues and trying to reconcile them and get "better." Its a hard thing to do, and even harder when people who are at different stages and mindsets in approaching their problems seemingly don't get it. I'll never forget a line from Ally McBeal where someone asked her once, "Why are your problems so important?" and her answer was a simple "Because they're my problems."

We're in the "me" generation. It would be too easy for me to join everyone and say "man up, get over it," and then recount the list of bad things that have happened to me or the people I love, but that won't really help you. So I think there is some value in what people are saying with regard to "its all in how you look at it."

Robert Maxwell is right: Life is too short for this kind of stuff, a fact which became crystal clear to me in 2010 after my friend Katie died at the age of 24. It would be easy for me to be bitter and angry about it and take it out on the world, but I've chosen not to because it would accomplish nothing and really, its not what she would want me to do.

In the same respect, I don't think you deserve to be putting yourself down so much Trekker. There are, I'm sure, many positive qualities about the person you are today that we don't know about but that are great qualities and things that you should focus on and nurture.

My dad has a bunch of crazy kooky Lebanese sayings he peppered us with while growing up. Life wisdom he'd learned along the way, that kind of thing. Some are really cliche, but they're cliches because we all know them. My favorite is very simple and very practical and one that I try to utilize every day, especially when I'm having a bad day:

doubleoh's dad said:
"Positive brings positive."

It's great advice and is universally accepted as a good thing (except, you know, if you're getting tested for STDs.)

I think though if you can try to embrace this philosophy, and try to employ it in the various areas of your life, you'll find that things will begin to improve for you.

Hang in there. Its not easy work. It won't happen overnight. And you won't be doing any favors for yourself by wallowing in self-pity, even if you legitimately have the right to do so. Remember, Positive brings Positive!

 

[RJDiogenes]

Like the song says, "Accentuate the positive, and eliminate the negative."

 

[Alrik]

^

Good plan.

 

[RAMA]

I would consider a crotch/ass grab to be uncomfortable, at best. Whether it be from a lover, a date, or a stranger at a bar. Then again I try not to be the aggressive type.

Last time it happened she wasn't a complete stranger, but I didn't really know her either. Aside from being married at the time, it probably did make a difference that she wasn't all that attractive. See I'm just as shallow as TSQ.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ I would certainly not expect a married person to be comfortable with a stranger grabbing them in the personal regions....no matter how hot the stranger was.

 

[O'Dib]

Soo, was there a follow-up?

 

[Alidar Jarok]

I would consider a crotch/ass grab to be uncomfortable, at best. Whether it be from a lover, a date, or a stranger at a bar. Then again I try not to be the aggressive type.

Last time it happened she wasn't a complete stranger, but I didn't really know her either. Aside from being married at the time, it probably did make a difference that she wasn't all that attractive. See I'm just as shallow as TSQ.

I don't know if I need to comment, but there's a difference between "attractive" and "attracted to." There's nothing shallow about being fine if someone who you are attracted to does something but bothered if someone does it when you have no attraction. It has nothing to do with appearance alone.