Sex: then and now

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by Logopolis, Oct 11, 2020.

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Was it good for you? Is it good now?

  1. It didn't bother me then and it doesn't bother me now

  2. I didn't like it at the time but i'm indifferent to it now

  3. It was crass then and it's crass now

  4. I enjoyed it at the time but it's definitely showing its age now

  5. Loved it then, love it now

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. NCC-73515

    NCC-73515 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    High heels should've been abandoned long before the 23rd and 24th centuries, but they're still there. I always found that very odd.
     
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  2. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I know people who do that now.:shifty:
     
  3. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    Most of the overt sexuality depicted in ENT was just about sexually objectifying women for cishet male titillation.

    I greatly prefer the depiction of sexuality in DIS and PIC, where love and sex are just parts of life and it's not about objectification.
     
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  4. TopperHenly

    TopperHenly Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I know it is not fashionable to say so in this post metoo/woke era but sex sells. Sci-fi is traditionally aimed at a male demographic which finds scantily clad woman appealing.

    As to Enterprise, I had watched a few episodes on it's original UK run and it didn't really draw me in. I have only watched it in it's entirety this year and got bored with the first two seasons and skipped it. Sure it had a woman with an skin tight uniform that showed her incredible figure and shenanigans of her and other scantily clad people but it didn't really do anything for me. In fact I was bored stiff with it.

    When it comes to TV or cinema, I love to ogle but if that is the only purpose of a character then I soon get bored with her and she becomes wallpaper to events. When it comes to sex on TV shows, there needs to be a chemistry between the characters and at least the actors getting into the spirit of it.

    I personally think that focusing on sex does get in the way of telling a story but sometimes it does work. I liked, one the first couple of watches anyway, the intensity of the sex scenes in nuBSG because it was a way of showing characters dealing with the stressful situations where were involved in it and there was a soap opera feel to it which I don't really go for. It worked for me because the characters where reasonably fleshed out and the actors who played them were good. Above all, it is probably one of the reasons which got the series renewed at the end of next season and if that it is what it takes to get Sci-fi on TV then that's what needs to be done.

    Of course, as I mentioned if you try to make a programme sexy by just putting scantily clad woman in it where it is essentially soft-porn and doesn't have good stories or acting then that is not going to work.
     
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  5. TopperHenly

    TopperHenly Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    If you look at these historical dramas like Poldark, Outlander, Pride and prejudice etc they have hunky mostly dark haired men. It is a different form of objectifying than seen on ENT but still the same. Ultimately, it is used to sell the series to the demographic it is aimed for.

    As per my previous note, I'm not defending the titilation on ENT because it wasn't wasn't good and as you said of the other series, it didn't fit in with the characters or the story.
     
  6. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon Admiral Premium Member

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    God dammit I can't change my vote... Not that the option I wanted matters I think I can live with the one I picked. It didn't bother me when the show was brand new, and now I just watch those scenes and not bother.
     
  7. Stephen!

    Stephen! Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Phlox does comment in one episode about not everyone being comfortable with disrobing in front of others.
     
  8. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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    never bothered me. it was a small ship. things were going to happen.
     
  9. bookworm8571

    bookworm8571 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I cringe at T’Pol’s catsuit and the leering nearly all of the male characters seem to do at her. Totally sophomoric, without point except to titillate. I don’t object to the decontamination scenes/argument with Trip and T’Pol because they were arguing over command at the same time they were applying the gel and exploring each other’s ears. Sexual tension added something to the characterization and advanced the plot.
     
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  10. sekundant

    sekundant Fleet Captain Premium Member

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    I think, I told once, as I watch for the first time pilot, exactly at decon scene, I should go another room (kitchen maybe) and I only heard their conversation. It was totally OK for me. After then I didn't understand why my Trek people went crazy, even not after watching the scene.
    I never ever get why people having some allergic reactions about ENT and sex. From TOS to VOY they all have more sparsely clothed beautiful women and men with their "unnatural" perfect bodies, we have more explicit scenes before, only purpose why we have someone like Counsellor Troi was the boys between 13- 99, Kira, Seven wore high-heels, during the fight scenes, all the main female characters have more than one lovers, they get raped, they onanized, Riker became freely sex slave, Picard muss run fast as possible to not the catch from all those hot models, and so on and mostly those scenes/episodes are very weak written. All are good for the "most" Trek people, no one takes pitchfork and torch and cry for "cringey", except it comes ENT .. At the time as ENT aired all other important series for the "general audience" have more sex scenes than ENT. (Remember Buffy, Desperate Housewives, Sopranos, The Wire, Six Feet Under..) Guys, I really don't get it, what is the point? :shrug:

    As a female person who get Trek with mother milk, I could never feel a female Trek character could be a "real" women. For me Janeway, Kira, Jadzia, Troi, Blena.. all of them written from men for men. First came Seven then T'Pol with their complexity, strengths and weaknesses, I realize that Trek can tell female stories, so I don't care what they are wearing. They look good. Although T'Pol became more and more anorexia suspect, it was parallel to story and didn't bother me too much.

    If I am honest, I wish they showed more sexual content as a part of normal life of crew on the board and there is also a scene implied that :


    Yes, there are cringey scenes at ENT but, which Trek has not such scenes? Don't forget they are all products to sell and if writers and producers think it sells better, because the audience is so stupid and not worthy for intelligent jokes.

    For me most unacceptable scene about kind of "sex" is the scene, as Trip became pregnant and they all laugh with Klingons about him. I couldn't imagine how audience reacts, if Hoshi/T'Pol have this faith. It was as horrible as TNG's The Child episode for me. Brrr.
     
  11. bookworm8571

    bookworm8571 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Yes, as a woman I hate the pregnant Trip episode too for the same reason and usually skip it when I rewatch the episodes. I grew up on Trek too, thanks to my dad who got me hooked. I realize when I rewatch the original series just how sexist some of those 60s episodes were and how unrealistic the female characters are. Some of them are impossible to watch. Enterprise is enlightened by comparison. I am fond of both Hoshi and T’Pol.
     
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  12. USS Excelsior

    USS Excelsior Commodore Commodore

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    On Enterprise they do it with bras on.
     
  13. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Admiral Admiral

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    When the show first started the issue for me wasn't that there was too much sexuality so much as it seemed exploitative, like the point of the nudity wasn't because it made sense in the story, the point was cheap ratings.

    The same principle as Seven's catsuit. It didn't make sense in the story for her to dress like that, but it's an easy way to get people to tune in.

    The same sexuality in a way that the story demands is just fine.
     
  14. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    All of that is completely awful, tone deaf and ridiculous.
     
  15. Paul Weaver

    Paul Weaver Rear Admiral Premium Member

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    justice143.jpg
     
  16. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon Admiral Premium Member

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  17. Tenacity

    Tenacity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Justice.
     
  18. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon Admiral Premium Member

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    Oh..... OK