Separate Defiant Crew vs the DS9 Crew

[Nathan]

I did like the addition of the Defiant to the station --- and read a big reason the ship was added as the Runabouts could only do so much and not well equipped for a Dominion/Gamma Quadrant type mission.

it always bugged me that whenever the Defiant was on the mission -- Sisko at command, Kira (or Worf) depending on your viewpoint who was the 1st officer, Bashir as the Doc, O'Brien as the engineer, and Dax at the helm.

I always felt there should have been a different crew for the Defiant (to include a separate Captain other than Sisko). For example, does Bashir tell his DS9 patients, "Sorry all, gotta mission on the Defiant, some random nurse will take care of you."

I also was annoyed when Tom Riker commandeered the ship, it appeared no one was on it. I mean, even when a US Navy ship is at port, there is always a skeleton crew. What happens if there is alert, how long would it take for the crew to be recalled to the ship.

I suppose the fans want to see the cast they love the best instead of some random crewmembers. And if the crewmembers were made permament, it'd take away from the DS9 Cast.

I always hoped that it would be retconned (for lack of a better word) in the books, a new crew would be for the Defiant, and a separate crew to run the station.

Your thoughts?

 

[BillJ]

Would've made the station seem bigger, at the same time, it would've been more expensive to crew the Defiant with a separate group of actors.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

It never bothered me. The Defiant was always shown as operating attached to a base or fleet, meaning it was a support vessel illsuited to long term voyages. More over , it seems appropriate that Sisko, who had extensive diplomatic duties, might have a ship at his disposal. It would have been nice if the crew of both ship and station were better filled out. And after DS9 was retaken, I think Sisko should have remained the admiral's attache.

 

[TheSeeker]

More over , it seems appropriate that Sisko, who had extensive diplomatic duties, might have a ship at his disposal.

A Captain''s Yacht with teeth!

 

[kkt]

I did like the addition of the Defiant to the station --- and read a big reason the ship was added as the Runabouts could only do so much and not well equipped for a Dominion/Gamma Quadrant type mission.

it always bugged me that whenever the Defiant was on the mission -- Sisko at command, Kira (or Worf) depending on your viewpoint who was the 1st officer, Bashir as the Doc, O'Brien as the engineer, and Dax at the helm.

I always felt there should have been a different crew for the Defiant (to include a separate Captain other than Sisko). For example, does Bashir tell his DS9 patients, "Sorry all, gotta mission on the Defiant, some random nurse will take care of you."

I also was annoyed when Tom Riker commandeered the ship, it appeared no one was on it. I mean, even when a US Navy ship is at port, there is always a skeleton crew. What happens if there is alert, how long would it take for the crew to be recalled to the ship.

I suppose the fans want to see the cast they love the best instead of some random crewmembers. And if the crewmembers were made permament, it'd take away from the DS9 Cast.

I always hoped that it would be retconned (for lack of a better word) in the books, a new crew would be for the Defiant, and a separate crew to run the station.

Your thoughts?

I agree that if Starfleet were real, the Defiant would certainly have had her own captain and crew. DS9 was responding to dramatic need to focus on a small number of staring actors. The permanent senior officers of the Defiant would be more characters than the show needs, and dillute the autority of Sisko and Kira and the DS9 crew the audience already know. And incidentally add more actors to the payroll.

 

[Butters]

I agree. Kira belonged on DS9. Sisko belonged on DS9.

Having the crew decamp to the Defiant was one of the more cartoony aspects of the show.

 

[c0rnedfr0g]

Your wish was fulfilled in First Contact.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

A Captain''s Yacht with teeth!

Mission commanders, like the head of MNF-I, are assigned command helicopters. Why would Sisko, who has obvious regional responsibilities, be different?

 

[DS9forever]

Any separate crew on the Defiant would have felt like a B squad. And they would have gone stir crazy, no holodecks to malfunction, no state rooms...

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

I agree that if Starfleet were real, the Defiant would certainly have had her own captain and crew. DS9 was responding to dramatic need to focus on a small number of staring actors. The permanent senior officers of the Defiant would be more characters than the show needs, and dillute the autority of Sisko and Kira and the DS9 crew the audience already know. And incidentally add more actors to the payroll.

RW implications were definately a factor in not having a regular crew for the Defiant.

Realistically, there should have been at least three new senior officers as of The Search and a few minor characters. Lt Cmdr Eddington, Sub Cdr T'Rul and a Lt Cmdr in red (that was perhaps killed during the s3 finalle to be replaced by Worf) who acts as the Defiant OOD/XO, and ideally a second Chief of Operations/Tactical Officer, at least one CONN, a doctor or medic and a couple of new gold shirts (at least one of engineering and security).

 

[Bad Thoughts]

RW implications were definately a factor in not having a regular crew for the Defiant.

Realistically, there should have been at least three new senior officers as of The Search and a few minor characters. Lt Cmdr Eddington, Sub Cdr T'Rul and a Lt Cmdr in red (that was perhaps killed during the s3 finalle to be replaced by Worf) who acts as the Defiant OOD/XO, and ideally a second Chief of Operations/Tactical Officer, at least one CONN, a doctor or medic and a couple of new gold shirts (at least one of engineering and security).

If we're talking real world, a US Navy ship of this size would have maybe half a dozen officers and the CO would be a Lieutenant Commander.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

The Defiant was really an extension of DS9 and not a posting in its own right, after all the ship was almost always docked at the station unless on a specific mission.

it always bugged me that whenever the Defiant was on the mission -- Sisko at command, Kira (or Worf) depending on your viewpoint who was the 1st officer, Bashir as the Doc, O'Brien as the engineer, and Dax at the helm.

I always felt there should have been a different crew for the Defiant (to include a separate Captain other than Sisko). For example, does Bashir tell his DS9 patients, "Sorry all, gotta mission on the Defiant, some random nurse will take care of you."

When on assignment whether into the GQ to explore or the frontlines to fight a battle, Sisko would want his best people alongside him to ensure success. Life onboard the station would continue, after all Sisko isn't in Ops 26 hours a day, there are others who can cover the senior officers duties as required for short terms.

I also was annoyed when Tom Riker commandeered the ship, it appeared no one was on it. I mean, even when a US Navy ship is at port, there is always a skeleton crew. What happens if there is alert, how long would it take for the crew to be recalled to the ship.

In "The Way of the Warrior" the ship was manned and ready by the time Sisko, Kira and Dax got from Ops to the docking port, so I'd assume that it would only take a matter of minutes, just as it seems to when a ship/station is ordered to red alert and the crew are ready. Also "Defiant" was early after the introduction of the ship, so it may not have had a full crew onboard due to ongoing upgrades and retrofitting to make the ship more suitable for expanded roles.

I suppose the fans want to see the cast they love the best instead of some random crewmembers. And if the crewmembers were made permament, it'd take away from the DS9 Cast.

You seem to have forgotten DS9's massive roster of recurring characters, all of whom were great additions and brought greater depth and life to the show. If there was one thing the writers knew how to do it was work with recurring characters, so they could've easily added others if needed and not detract from the main cast.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

If we're talking real world, a US Navy ship of this size would have maybe half a dozen officers and the CO would be a Lieutenant Commander.

Well yes, my last post was more about the likely added main or at least recurring characters.

As far as the total complement, I was thinking along the lines of the CO (as noted a LT CMDR), XO (LT), Tactical & Ops Officers (LT or ENS, one of which doubles as Security Officer) and a senior CONN or NAV (probably a ENS or even a CADET), a couple of senior NCOs each for Engineering, Security and/or Armoury and Ops (at least two Chiefs, the rest Petty Officers), and the rest a fairly even mix of security, technicians, medics, back-up/relief pilots and general deckhands.

 

[USS Triumphant]

Three quick thoughts:

1. This seems like the same problem, more or less, as the problem of the main cast (crew of a station or ship, depending on the show) always being the ones on duty when something exciting happens, even though there should be either 3 or 4 duty shifts. But the real world reasons for that are obvious.

2. The authors actually DID flesh out a separate crew for the Defiant in the novels that took place after the show.

3. The CO billet might be a higher rank than you're accounting for due to Starfleet being commissioned-officer-heavy. Don't get me wrong - I think what you're saying makes sense. But when the majority of your ship is crewed by ensigns, lieutenants, and lieutenant commanders, rather than mostly by the non-coms you might expect, the CO needs to have the rank for it.

 

[Eman1986]

Ideally it should have been Worf and Eddington or his clumsy predecessor (if they had kept the character around longer) and maybe a stand in medical doctor .

 

[kkt]

U.S. Navy ships have a lot larger crew because they expect to take a lot of casualties in a battle and need to keep going regardless. Also training is a continuous job, they are always training the crew to be moving up through the ranks, so they'll have people who are not totally comfortable with their new job yet. If the Defiant never took heavy casualties and always had everyone come in fully trained and not hoping to advance any further, I guess they really could run the Defiant with about 5 people.

 

[Eman1986]

U.S. Navy ships have a lot larger crew because they expect to take a lot of casualties in a battle and need to keep going regardless. Also training is a continuous job, they are always training the crew to be moving up through the ranks, so they'll have people who are not totally comfortable with their new job yet. If the Defiant never took heavy casualties and always had everyone come in fully trained and not hoping to advance any further, I guess they really could run the Defiant with about 5 people.

If they had done that then the ship would have been lost in Battle of Sector 001. Pretty much most of the crew died in that fight. Luckily Worf was the only major character on board at the time, lol

 

[Infern0]

Yeah the Defiant didn't have its own mission it was an assigned ship to DS9 so if it had its own crew they would have had a LOT OF time sitting on their behinds doing nothing.

Originally the Defiant was basically a failed prototype that Sisko convinced Starfleet to let him have and try and do something with, so that's another reason it didn't have its own personell.

I thibk in terms of in universe thought it would have made sense for DS9 to have been home port for an exploration vessel which would regularly go through the wormhole. Prior to the dominion becoming an issue.

But in the end most of it comes down to paying a second cast.

 

[Grendelsbayne]

Dr. Bashir wasn't the only doctor on the station, he could and was easily replaced for various short-term periods. The same could be said for almost any other position on the station.

Also, regarding how long it would take to "call the crew back" to the Defiant, I see no reason it would take any longer than calling them to their posts on the station. In both cases they're using the station turbolifts from various specific points within the same station.

The only real issue that I have with the Defiant missions is the way that they sometimes seemed to have *every* main character aboard. Any one or even small groups of officers could be replaced by juniors short term, but to leave the entire station in command of junior officers? That seemed weird. At the very least, either Sisko or Kira should probably be on the station at all times (at least, before the war). Maybe it wouldn't be too bad to leave Dax or Worf in command for a short time, but if all four of them are gone, who the hell is even commanding the station? Odo?

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

The only real issue that I have with the Defiant missions is the way that they sometimes seemed to have *every* main character aboard. Any one or even small groups of officers could be replaced by juniors short term, but to leave the entire station in command of junior officers? That seemed weird. At the very least, either Sisko or Kira should probably be on the station at all times (at least, before the war). Maybe it wouldn't be too bad to leave Dax or Worf in command for a short time, but if all four of them are gone, who the hell is even commanding the station? Odo?

IMO Kira and Odo should have only gone on the Defiant's missions unless there are specific reasons. Likewise, they should have limited Sisko, Dax and Worf on the Defiant to two-out-of-three at most.

Conversly, O'Brien consistently going on the Defiant's missions does make sense, particularly as the small crew complement makes it plausable that the senior engineer would be a chief rather than an officer (IMO in Treklit they should have split Nog and O'Brien with Nog being the station's chief engineer and O'Brien being the Defiant's chief engineer.chief of operations).