I agree. Seasons 1 & 2 aren't exactly the best and they do have some clunky episoides but they ARE watchable a lot more so than most of the so-called television around today.
Seasons 1 & 2 Unwatchable?
- Thread starter ConRefit79
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I agree. Seasons 1 & 2 aren't exactly the best and they do have some clunky episoides but they ARE watchable a lot more so than most of the so-called television around today.
Hi everybody.
I sorry but I am not going to read the 7+ pages of replies right now. I will have to read them later.But I just want to say while there are many problems with the first 2 seasons, there are also problems with just about any of the other seasons as well.
While there was a revolving door of Chief Engineers and CMOs in the beginning of the TNG series, there was a revolving door of Navigators towards the end of the TNG series!
I am a fan of the music in TOS and The TOS Movies, and the first four seasons of TNG. Most of the episodes (except for Violations, Frame Of Mind, Imaginary Friend, A Fist Full Of Datas, Masks, The Pegasus, Aquiel, and Face Of The Enemy. ...and for a while, Rascals.) had very predictable music. It was just unfitting for the episode "Power Play".
The beginning of the first season looked very different from the end of the first season. Main Engineering was more prominent towards the beginning of the season, then towards the middle of the season it became laughable. Towards the end of the season Main Engineering was gone. Also the very unique 3 episodes of the end of the first season: It was a time after Tasha died but before Beverly left. Worf became Chief of Security but still wore red. The Isolinear Chips panels on the main bridge were made of Cherry Wood. The lighting, especially in the first season, was not improved. It was dark and badly positioned which caused glare on the LCARS computer monitors. (They had to put black construction paper to reduce the glare.)
There were very strange episodes for those two seasons, but this is true with every season. I believe that Rascals, even with the increased appearance of Guinan, is probably not a good episode.
But I do agree that it appears that everybody is much more where they are in Season 3. But when Wesley left, the revolving door began again. Keiko was going to be the new navigator, and then Ro Laren. And even Chief O'Brien left The Enterprise.
What are you talking about with regard to Main Engineering?Hi everybody.
But I just want to say while there are many problems with the first 2 seasons, there are also problems with just about any of the other seasons as well.
While there was a revolving door of Chief Engineers and CMOs in the beginning of the TNG series, there was a revolving door of Navigators towards the end of the TNG series!
I am a fan of the music in TOS and The TOS Movies, and the first four seasons of TNG. Most of the episodes (except for Violations, Frame Of Mind, Imaginary Friend, A Fist Full Of Datas, Masks, The Pegasus, Aquiel, and Face Of The Enemy. ...and for a while, Rascals.) had very predictable music. It was just unfitting for the episode "Power Play".
The beginning of the first season looked very different from the end of the first season. Main Engineering was more prominent towards the beginning of the season, then towards the middle of the season it became laughable. Towards the end of the season Main Engineering was gone. Also the very unique 3 episodes of the end of the first season: It was a time after Tasha died but before Beverly left. Worf became Chief of Security but still wore red. The Isolinear Chips panels on the main bridge were made of Cherry Wood. The lighting, especially in the first season, was not improved. It was dark and badly positioned which caused glare on the LCARS computer monitors. (They had to put black construction paper to reduce the glare.)
There were very strange episodes for those two seasons, but this is true with every season. I believe that Rascals, even with the increased appearance of Guinan, is probably not a good episode.
But I do agree that it appears that everybody is much more where they are in Season 3. But when Wesley left, the revolving door began again. Keiko was going to be the new navigator, and then Ro Laren. And even Chief O'Brien left The Enterprise.
Yeah, they're borderline unwatchable. But we rooted for the series at the time, because, hey, it was a new Star Trek series.
Time has been unkind to Seasons 1 & 2. Arguably, parts of the 1st season of DS9 too. I think Voyager had solid Seasons 1 & 2 and have aged very well.
Time has been unkind to Seasons 1 & 2. Arguably, parts of the 1st season of DS9 too. I think Voyager had solid Seasons 1 & 2 and have aged very well.
It's interesting that you bring up those last three episodes, In_Correct. Not a lot of people comment on this kind of 'in limbo' portion of TNG's development, but they're an interesting study within themselves. In some ways they foreshadow the feel of the second season, which was distinctly different to season one, but on the other you've got Beverly hanging around and Worf still wearing "Command Red". Those three eps are something of an anomaly in the scheme of things.
I think Season One and Season Two had their fair share of very good shows...
SEASON ONE STAND-OUTS:
Encounter at Farpoint
The Last Outpost
Where No One Has Gone Before
Hide and Q
The Big Goodbye
11001001
Heart of Glory
The Arsenal of Freedom
We'll Always Have Paris
Conspiracy
SEASON TWO STAND-OUTS:
Where Silence Has Lease
Elementary Dear Data
A Matter of Honor
The Measure of a Man
Contagion
The Royale
Time Squared
Q Who
These are obviously my personal picks, and everyone is different...but when you can say a season has 8-10 "good-to-great" episodes, I think that speaks fairly well.
To do a real analysis, you'd need to look at "stand outs" vs "average" vs "clunkers" for each season. Make "standouts" worth 2 points, "average episodes" worth 1 point and "clunkers" worth no points.Then, compare each season's total points. I bet, we might be surprised at the results of our own rankings if we did that!
SEASON ONE STAND-OUTS:
Encounter at Farpoint
The Last Outpost
Where No One Has Gone Before
Hide and Q
The Big Goodbye
11001001
Heart of Glory
The Arsenal of Freedom
We'll Always Have Paris
Conspiracy
SEASON TWO STAND-OUTS:
Where Silence Has Lease
Elementary Dear Data
A Matter of Honor
The Measure of a Man
Contagion
The Royale
Time Squared
Q Who
These are obviously my personal picks, and everyone is different...but when you can say a season has 8-10 "good-to-great" episodes, I think that speaks fairly well.
To do a real analysis, you'd need to look at "stand outs" vs "average" vs "clunkers" for each season. Make "standouts" worth 2 points, "average episodes" worth 1 point and "clunkers" worth no points.Then, compare each season's total points. I bet, we might be surprised at the results of our own rankings if we did that!
I would replace the episode "The Arsenal of Freedom" with "Too Short A Season". Very well acted (and the only one with Marsha Hunt) and very good music. (also the only episode scored by George Romanis.)
The Arsenal of Freedom lol is the perfect example of an episode that has Main Engineering in it (or rather somebody that claims to be Chief Engineer) but it shouldn't be there because that episode would have done fine without Main Engineering. Mr. Logan was only there to bully Geordi. Before anybody says that The Writer's Wanted A Challenge for Geordi's first command of The Enterprise, that's not true either. Geordi had command in the episode Angel One, which aired before it. No bully wanting to mutiny in that episode. The entire Main Engineering is just irrelevant for that episode. And later, they had the episode "Skin Of Evil" with Mr. Lynch, and that episode could have worked without any Main Engineering either, as the only thing anybody did from Main Engineering in that episode was to bother Picard with random unexpected tinkering of the Dilithium Chamber.
Compare with the very beginning of the series. Even though the formula of having a Chief Engineer and an Assistant Chief Engineer was duplicated (and even though each instances involved Wesley playing in Main Engineering) it was much more involved. The Engineers were working with the crew and The Enterprise instead of against them/it, and there were episodes that directly involved Main Engineering (fairly good episodes too) that couldn't have worked if they tried to rewrite the episode. Even in Datalore couldn't have worked without a competent Chief Engineer because the episode involved constructing an android.
So basically in the first episodes of the first season they directly included Main Engineering, while towards the end of the season it was just menacing.
The Arsenal of Freedom lol is the perfect example of an episode that has Main Engineering in it (or rather somebody that claims to be Chief Engineer) but it shouldn't be there because that episode would have done fine without Main Engineering. Mr. Logan was only there to bully Geordi. Before anybody says that The Writer's Wanted A Challenge for Geordi's first command of The Enterprise, that's not true either. Geordi had command in the episode Angel One, which aired before it. No bully wanting to mutiny in that episode. The entire Main Engineering is just irrelevant for that episode. And later, they had the episode "Skin Of Evil" with Mr. Lynch, and that episode could have worked without any Main Engineering either, as the only thing anybody did from Main Engineering in that episode was to bother Picard with random unexpected tinkering of the Dilithium Chamber.
Compare with the very beginning of the series. Even though the formula of having a Chief Engineer and an Assistant Chief Engineer was duplicated (and even though each instances involved Wesley playing in Main Engineering) it was much more involved. The Engineers were working with the crew and The Enterprise instead of against them/it, and there were episodes that directly involved Main Engineering (fairly good episodes too) that couldn't have worked if they tried to rewrite the episode. Even in Datalore couldn't have worked without a competent Chief Engineer because the episode involved constructing an android.
So basically in the first episodes of the first season they directly included Main Engineering, while towards the end of the season it was just menacing.
S1 was a complete joke. S2 is one of my favourites. I still don't understand why there were about 6 no-name chief engineers.
Revisionist history. Although the ratings got better as the show went on, the ratings started out very high for syndication, and therefore we have to assume was very watchable. I rewatch eps from season 1 quite a bit myself.
Being a new type of ship, they were probably rotating people through so they'd have plenty of field trained engineers for the other Galaxy class ships.
I recall from my reading in the magazines and official fan club subscription, that Gene didnt want an engineer on the series because he felt "technology unchained" made the tech more smoothly integrated with the everyday life on board, and along with less "electronic gingerbread" they didn't want to call attention to it. Eventually they found this was to be the exact opposite.
Season 2 turned around from Elementary my dear Data onwards I think.
I don't mind the first two seasons. They're not great, but each episode is different and it's less formulaic than later seasons where there is a set structure to a lot of the episodes.
I don't mind the first two seasons. They're not great, but each episode is different and it's less formulaic than later seasons where there is a set structure to a lot of the episodes.
Couldn't agree more about this ep. Conspiracies at the highest echelons of Starfleet, counterconspiracies and secret captains meetings, alien infiltration and invasion by nasty neck crawlies--how can you not love?
I wonder if that's where SG1 got the idea of the Goa'uld from
Absolutely agreed. While there's a marked increase in writing and production quality in season 3, that doesn't make seasons one and two particularly bad per se, just in comparison to the rest of the series. On their own merits, seasons one and two are actually pretty enjoyable.
I think this episode was such a good concept, and I really enjoyed it (even if there was substantial amount of season one cheeseball production and writing involved). I'm a little surprised Gene would go along with a storyline like this. I mean, it's pretty dark and twisted for TNG - a conspiracy in the highest ranks of Starfleet, a mutinous plot against the Admiralty, all that gore when the Queen is exposed and destroyed.
It's been a few years since I've watched TNG and I just started watching Season 1 again and I'm quite enjoying it. If you skip the bad episodes, it's actually pretty good. Not as good as some of the later seasons, but they are enjoyable.
From Season 1 I recommend skipping Justice, Haven, Angel One and Code Of Honor.
From Season 1 I recommend skipping Justice, Haven, Angel One and Code Of Honor.
Its been years since I watched the first two seasons and I don't remember that much about them, except from few episodes which I watch regularly.... and it feels like an interesting idea to watch them again.
It's a shame the Alien Parasites never came back. I read some novels that featured them and the story they came up with was just really great.
Conspiracy is probably a top 20 TNG episode for me.
Hello folks. I have started a TNG rewatch last week. It's not the new release, but I am playing it through some pretty good visual and audio filters in VLC media player, giving a mild color boost, a bit less noise, and a nice spatialization of the 2.0 mix (I don't have 5.1 hooked up)
I am paused around 10 minutes into "The Big Goodbye" at present. Although it is true that the show gets better, I feel that S1 is of excellent quality. The characters actually fall in pretty quickly, and it's natural that they're not as warm with each other in S1 as in later years.
I like seeing LaForge as a command officer, although within the first few episodes we already see him working in engineering, Worf assisting with security, and O'Brian doing O'Briany things.
I did skip "Code of Honor" - I tried, but bailed within a few minutes...
S1 is awesome, classic Trek, don't let anyone tell you any differently! TNG S1 (and S2) lives in the shadow of its own later success.
I look forward to seeing the Blu-Ray remaster one day, but I have to say, the original FX look pretty good with a little post-processing TLC.
My only gripe besides "Code of Honor" - within the first 4 episodes, if I'm not mistaken, Picard surrenders the Enterprise 3 times - !
I am paused around 10 minutes into "The Big Goodbye" at present. Although it is true that the show gets better, I feel that S1 is of excellent quality. The characters actually fall in pretty quickly, and it's natural that they're not as warm with each other in S1 as in later years.
I like seeing LaForge as a command officer, although within the first few episodes we already see him working in engineering, Worf assisting with security, and O'Brian doing O'Briany things.
I did skip "Code of Honor" - I tried, but bailed within a few minutes...
S1 is awesome, classic Trek, don't let anyone tell you any differently! TNG S1 (and S2) lives in the shadow of its own later success.
I look forward to seeing the Blu-Ray remaster one day, but I have to say, the original FX look pretty good with a little post-processing TLC.
My only gripe besides "Code of Honor" - within the first 4 episodes, if I'm not mistaken, Picard surrenders the Enterprise 3 times - !
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