Season 1 as a Whole

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Picard' started by Lord Garth, Mar 26, 2020.

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How do you rate Season 1?

  1. 10 - "Engage!"

    14 vote(s)
    7.7%
  2. 9

    36 vote(s)
    19.7%
  3. 8

    55 vote(s)
    30.1%
  4. 7

    26 vote(s)
    14.2%
  5. 6

    16 vote(s)
    8.7%
  6. 5

    10 vote(s)
    5.5%
  7. 4

    6 vote(s)
    3.3%
  8. 3

    10 vote(s)
    5.5%
  9. 2

    5 vote(s)
    2.7%
  10. 1 - "Fucking Hubris!"

    5 vote(s)
    2.7%
  1. Cyrus

    Cyrus Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I know producers were hoping this series would get Emmy nominations in major categories instead of the usual tech ones Star Trek series get. I don't expect it to get best series or writing or directing nominations, but I hope sir Patrick gets an acting nomination. He was great.
     
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  2. Crewman6

    Crewman6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Those are generally reserved for shows that are, um....good.
     
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  3. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes and no. It, like everything else, is a political game. Not that I think Star Trek: Picard would get a "best series" nomination but the entire selection process is based on politics within the entertainment industry in general.

    TNG Season 7 got a "best series" nomination. Who honestly thinks the seventh season was TNG's best? You know the answer to that one as well as I do.

    Mad Men is my favorite series (sorry Star Trek). Mad Men won several awards. But even when the system was working in favor of something I like, I'd still admit that it's all a political process.
     
  4. Cyrus

    Cyrus Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Good thing you are not an Emmy voter. btw, TNG got a best series nomination in its last season.
     
  5. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    They will probably deal with Agnes's legal problems in the next season. I doubt they will just let the murder of Bruce Maddox just disappear.
     
  6. Nightdiamond

    Nightdiamond Commodore Commodore

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    I didn't give it a rating yet, because I don't know how to take Picard yet.

    I was on board for most of the journey, but the last two episodes were anti-climactic. OK, disappointing. Which I tend to blame on the pacing of the whole series. It was really, really confusing and convoluted. At times, things in the plot happened at a million miles a minute, which looked really hyper.

    It was too fast and had too much in it.

    Super Uber synths from another galaxy, some super secret police of the Ta Shiar, prophecies from 200,000 years ago, a single neuron from Data that could create a whole brain etc,

    It was supposed to be a planet of dangerous Synths, and yet the only ones there were in a small colony barely the size of a city. And now the Romulans settled on and colonized Vulcan,or was that an error?

    It just seemed like all the build up with all that information couldn't sustain the finale when it was time.

    This is one reason why I'm a fan of simpler plots. If they had found a way to keep the plot centered around the ban on Synths and the day to day lives and local politics of whats going on in the AQ currently, it would have been entertaining enough. Actually, I though it was going into that direction originally.

    On the plus side, I like things like the Romulan couple that lived with Picard. I found them charming. I actually like the gritty Seven. And characters like Raffi, Rios and Elnor, you can't help but to like. And I like the modern feel to Picard--people seemed normal and relatable compared to pre- DS9 trek.

    Until I see what direction Picard is going to take, the jury is still out.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2020
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  7. StarMan

    StarMan Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The show had pacing issues and a bit of a slow start (which I didn't mind), but I gave the series a pretty wide berth so far of perceived weaknesses. As the series progressed, it became clear they were setting the bar fairly high in terms of expectations with the mystery baked into the season - just as Discovery did with the Red Angel arc.

    I always had in the back of my mind that a lot was going to hinge on the reveal and how everything came together. What clever, inventive endgame had they come up with to tie all these threads together that they themselves had concocted?

    Turns out The Borg, The Big Secret ... red herrings. So, what does that leave us? If the show had delivered some solid writing, character development and really fleshed out these people, then it might've been an acceptable trade off to reach the end and appreciate and - even admire - the misdirection. But, we didn't get that. I don't think they found the right balance between character and plot, with most of the new players coming off as cliched and two dimensional.

    The nostalgia worked. It was great seeing Data, Riker and Troi again and I think they hit the right notes on that front. The final scenes with Data were extremely touching. But, it strikes me that the whole convoluted plot was designed solely to get Picard into a scene so he could speak with the 'real' Data, somehow - even if the cost of that was killing Picard and copying him into a golem. But, that's a minor quibble ...

    So, season 1 - had some great moments, but dragged down fairly abruptly at the end. Everything tied up little too neatly and conveniently. Disappointing, especially given I was on board for the first 8 episodes.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2020
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  8. donners22

    donners22 Commodore Commodore

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    Call it an 8. As Trek first seasons go, worse than TOS and Discovery, better than the rest.

    The Good
    + Seven!
    + Great character moments. Picard talking about what Data meant to him with Soji was breathtaking, but the final conversation between Data and Picard, Seven and Picard speaking about the legacy of assimilation and the interactions with Riker and Troi (two characters I always disliked) were all up there.
    + The cast. Cabrera in particular is outstanding of the newcomers, and of course Stewart is incomparable.
    + The Rios holograms, especially the scene where Raffi got them all together.
    + Nepenthe. One of my favourite Trek episodes.
    + Laris and Zhaban
    + Jurati, at least until the...incident
    + The relatively limited fanwank - no Captain Worf, Beverley Picard, Enterprise or the like.

    The Bad
    - Space Legolas. Awful character, and the weakest member of the cast.
    - The murder of Maddox, and its subsequent handwaving.
    - Lannister siblings.
    - Gratuitous gore
    - "JL, JL, JL, JL, JL, JL, JL, JL, JL, JL, JL, JL"
    - Mawkish moments, especially the fanfare after Raffi's success
    - The pacing. Very slow build, got great toward the end, then got all tangled in the rush to the end. The big bad of the whole season just kinda fizzled out.

    Promising start, but certainly room to improve.
     
  9. Thomas Elliot

    Thomas Elliot Commander Red Shirt

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    Started out slow and uninteresting, peaked around episode 5, then

    Casting! The actors for Narek, Dahj/Soji, Elnor, Raffi, and Rios were all likable and/or intereting.
    The production quality was pretty good overall, and the for the most part, the whole thing had a very cinematic look and feel to it, something that was missing from most of the actual TNG films.
    Marina Sirtis was the one returning cast member whose performance I really enjoyed.
    The synths with the golden skin was a nice call back to the make-up effects of TOS.
    The fight choreography with Elnor was done really well.
    And bringing back menace to the Romulans and giving their culture some depth was needed.

    It was way too derivative. I've seen all the aspects of this story done better in The Terminator, T2: Judgment Day, Blade Runner, Blade Runner 2049, A.I., Ghost in the Shell and The Matrix among others.
    It's crazy that artificial intelligence/synthetic life was the focus for 10 hours and yet it played lip-service to the entire concept.
    Motoko Kusanagi questioned her own identity, after having so much of her body replaced with artificial parts. Picard dies, and they copy his mind onto a synthetic body and it's treated like, hey, I'm alive again! Just don't make me immortal! lulz
    Someone else asked a great question in the last episode thread: Does the golem just think he's Picard?

    They also made sure to have nerd Easter Eggs and references like the Kziniti, but no mention of Lal?

    The whole thing ends up feeling like a Marvel/Disney film.
    You got Professor X leading the group, with Han Solo/Jaime Maddox the Multiple Man flying The Milano/Millinium Falcon, along with Supergirl, the Punisher/Wolverine, and Peter Parker, with Raffi thrown in just to fuck with my analogy.

    The episode where Narek tried to kill Soji and she subsequently broke out was excellent! Nearly everything was good, right down to the music. The pulsating walls of the Borg ship were eerie.

    Just about every scene where Seven/Frank Castle is talking like an 80s vigilante/tough cop cliche. Or any of Jurati's stereotypical neurotic geek girl scenes, including when she declares she's through killing people. Raffi chastising Picard for having a big house with antique furniture.
    The writers having the old admiral lady say "fuck/fucking" so she can sound desperately edgy. And I like Ann Magnuson.

    I tried to keep an open mind, especially as the show got good in the middle, but overall, it pales in comparison to TNG.
    The episode where Data and Lal say goodbye to each other was more emotional than Dahj/Soji's connection to Data, or Picard/Data's death.
    Old Man Picard in "All Good Things..." is way better than Old Man Picard in PIC.
    "'Ow ju want your tea?"
    "Hot!"
    "O' course iss hot! What d'you want innit?"
    "NOTHING!!"

    Dahj and Elnor.
    Dahj's death was so abrupt and sad, that it got to me. She was also a little more likable than Soji for some reason.I believed in Elnor's emotions, especially when he mourned for Picard. They sold the hell out of Picard being his father figure.
    Oh yeah, Narek was great too. I liked when he was crying while Soji was about to die. Great actor, great Romulan.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2020
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  10. Seven of Five

    Seven of Five Stop. Hemmer time! Premium Member

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    I think an 8 is fair. I've more or less enjoyed the ride, with so much great character work.

    The plot is what doesn't help the show. We had two or three episodes where things were moving too slowly, and I think episode 9 moved into well-worn territory with rebellious AI, which was a disappointment.

    The finale really stuck the landing though, and I think I have cried three times this season. ;)

    Data finally had a good ending as well. Huzzah!
     
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  11. Hythlodeus

    Hythlodeus Commodore Commodore

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    I gave the first season an 8 yesterday. Now, that I had time to think about it, maybe a 9 would have been more appropriate for what it tried to do and what it achieved.
     
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  12. Lt.Smokey

    Lt.Smokey Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Solid 7 to 7.5 for me. Very different type of Trek; jarring in a way. Characters were strong, mostly, especially given the time constraint to develop them. I will agree with others that the pacing was iffy and the overall story was just okay for me. The final episode had some pretty contrived aspects, but was true to the spirit of Star Trek. Probably ranks as my 4th favorite Trek series, so far, ahead of VOY and ENT, behind DS9, TNG, TOS. (Have not seen DSC). A worthwhile addition to the Trek universe.
    I don't see much rewatch value, however.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2020
  13. The Rock

    The Rock Captain Captain

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    I think this first season dealt with the themes of mortality and death FAR better than Star Trek: Generations ever did. It dealt with Data's death far better than Nemesis ever did, as well.
     
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  14. donners22

    donners22 Commodore Commodore

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    Given that Trek has had one such nomination in the last 27 seasons, I guess the show we’re all here for isn’t much good.
     
  15. Cyrus

    Cyrus Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I think this season totally lifted up and redeemed Nemesis. It will be a lot easier watching and enjoying Nemesis after seeing Picard, Data's death will no longer sting as it would not be his last appearance. It also makes Nemesis something people should rewatch before seeing Picard (for Data, B4, Riker & Troi wedding, Blue Skies song, Romulans, Picard).
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2020
  16. SolarisOne

    SolarisOne Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    I AGREE WITH THIS SO GODDAMNED MUCH, IT HURTS.
    Indeed. The payoff was incredible.
    Yeah. If I have any real criticism of the series so far it's that one thing. I was hoping for more of a tight character study of Picard himself and Soji (actually Dahj, but she got killed off right away, so...). I kind of think the Achilles heel of having a novelist with his first foray into TV as showrunner showed through in how the overall arc played out.
    Absolutely! Although Data's opinion that things are only special because they end is kinda cliche and bothers me on a philosophical level, but in this case it gets a pass because it was very much in character for him to have that opinion.
    Like all speculative fiction, it's an acquired taste.
     
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  17. The Rock

    The Rock Captain Captain

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    Am I the only one who thinks that had they not used the Star Trek: Generations theme for that movie, it would've made a great theme for Star Trek: Picard?

     
  18. Hunter X

    Hunter X Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    ^One thing I really liked about the first three TNG movies were the musical themes. Well, Insurrection is a little sleepy, but still pretty.

    Overall I give the season a 5/10.

    The Good
    • Picard, Seven, Data, Riker, Troi, Hugh all worked in their returning roles. Chabon's been clear in his Instagram Q&As that they wanted any returns to make sense story-wise. I think they managed that pretty well by sticking with characters who connect with an overarching story on synthetic life. Okay, Riker and Troi not so much and their own connection to the synth story was forced, but their episode was my favourite of the season.
    • Some really interesting ideas. It makes sense that we would be seeing advances in synthetic life post-Data. Tying that into degrees of synthetic life we've already seen in Star Trek (Data having offspring, the Borg and status of ex Borg like Picard, Seven, and Hugh, even the holograms) is a gesture towards some thematic unity.
    • Tying in the Romulan supernova and a refugee story line is also an interesting starting point. You can see how they're trying to bring out thematic complexity in having two different kinds of refugees, Romulan and synthetic lifeforms, and then degrees of complexity within both groups: Romulans on Picard's vineyard, on the backwater planet, undercover agents, a remaining military threat; and the Borg as either mostly rehabilitated, severely damaged, or a threat that could awaken.
    • I liked the cast fine.
    The Bad
    • Most of what I like is pretty qualified. The themes didn't actually hold together in the end. The ex Borg are just sort of dropped (literally by a giant orchid thingie). Romulan refugee status is pretty fuzzy (are they barely scraping by? Are they a major threat?). The synth planet is really under-developed.
    • The story tries way too hard to tie everything into the synth theme. The degrees of prejudice in the Romulan and Federation towards synths, the treatment of ex Borg, and Data stuff all work as ideas. But why did Rios need to have his big revelation be about encountering synths? Why did the Rikers' son have to die of a disease that could have been prevented by synth technology? Why do the Romulans suddenly need to have this secret society within the secret society that has pursued synths for thousands of years based on an eschatological myth? It's too much. It's really sweaty writing.
    • Likewise, character moments happen with almost no development. Who is this Raffi person and why is she so attached to Picard? All we get are a few cliches instead of actual character development, and her saying JL in every line of dialogue with him. Why does Rios suddenly take on this motley crew? Why does he fall in love with Agnus? Am I supposed to be moved by Elnor sobbing in Raffi's lap? I don't remember them having a particularly meaningful connection. And why should I care that Seven and Raffi are suddenly holding hands at the end? Why not develop an actual rapport and chemistry between the two earlier on if that's where you're going?
    • Aaaand the plot takes similar short-cuts. Someone else already pointed out that the beacon stuff makes no sense at the end. It's a beacon, not a gateway generator. If a beacon for help is activated, help is going to come. If the beacon is suddenly cut off, the help is going to come more urgently. And one synth changes her mind and the Romulans, after thousands of years of exterminating synth life apparently, are just like "cool, bye." And how exactly was Picard sacrificing his life, anyway? I get that he was putting it in danger, but the sacrifice seems to come from the fact that the effort of piloting makes his brain hurt more? He dies faster of his condition because he was stressed out? I mean, I guess it's convenient timing that his condition gave him enough time to make a speech before killing him....imagine if it kicked in when he was eating that bunny-corn pizza. It's all just quite silly and doesn't make a bit of logical sense.
    • Narek just kind of disappeared in the end, didn't he? Shows how little they really cared about his connection to Narissa, even though they made a few half-hearted attempts at giving them a genuine relationship.
    • Where is everyone going in the end anyways? Rios is a ship for hire. Seven is a Fenris Ranger. Agnes promised to turn herself in. Picard might want to live out the rest of his days in space, but why with this particular group? Why are they all hanging out past this mission? If it's because "we're a crew," they just didn't build the connections well enough for me to buy it.
    Anyway, I liked Nepenthe and some other moments, I liked Picard's ideals, I liked the refugee and synth ideas, I liked the cast and the use of old characters. In the end, the writing and world-building was pretty terrible.

    Oh, and I also like how divisive the show is. I can see why people would love it and why others would hate it, depending on what you appreciate in a story. And even when I think the show was bad, there was usually an interesting idea lurking in there somewhere. That's really how Star Trek has often been.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2020
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  19. FederationHistorian

    FederationHistorian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The Good:
    +Good to see Picard, Riker, Troi, Data and Seven, and to learn what became of them.
    +La Serina, the emergency holograms, and the nod to seatbelts (that was cut from the final scenes of Nemesis).
    +Zhaban and Laris.
    +The efforts to fill in the gaps in the years between Nemesis and PIC.
    +Romulan world building, which has long been needed for a major species like them that has been around since the TOS days
    +Different parts of Earth were shown (Daystrom Institute in Okinawa, Dahj’s apartment in Boston, Picard’s Vineyard). Shows that Earth is more than just Starfleet HQ and Federation HQ.
    +Freecloud. A setting that would have been generic in any other sci-fi show was fresh for Star Trek.
    +Nepenthe and and Kestra Troi-Riker.
    +So the Artifact, including the XBs and all of the Borg tech, is on the homeworld of the synths, along with AI Soong, Narek and a deceased Narissa Rizzo. I imagine this will matter in a future Trek down the line and will make for an interesting story.
    +The season finale credits was not the black screen that we’ve become accustomed to with the CBSAA era. It was far more Star Trek like instead with a shot in space, which was good.

    The In Between:
    +/-Efforts to show a changed and isolationist Federation, although they never went into depth in regards to the grievances of those 14 Federation worlds that didn’t want to work with the Romulans.
    +/-Soji and Dr. Jurarti had some character development. Raffi, Rios and Elnor need work.

    The Bad:
    -Characters got killed off too quick (Maddox, Icheb, Bjayzl, Hugh, and arguably Narissa Rizzo even though the odds of her dying in S1 was really high to begin with).
    -No USS Titan. Nor did the Galaxy class ship model get used for the showdown with Commodore Oh’s Zhat Vash forces. Just Curiosity-class ships.
    - The mind breaking secret basically boiled down to organics not being able to handle the message, but synths could. It originally sounded like something that could potentially upend the mythology of Star Trek.
    -Warp effects being the same as Discovery is kind of a problem. That’s not the fault of Discovery existing, since that show should have been post Nemesis like PIC to begin with. But the producers could have used a mix of Discovery’s warp effects and the warp effects from the B&B era of Trek.
     
  20. Lakenheath 72

    Lakenheath 72 Commodore Commodore

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    I am relieved the story is over. I will never return to the season again.
     
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