*sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcasm*

[Omega_Glory]

Re: *sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcas

TWOK had a ship full of cadets on their traning cruise or midshipman's cruise. It is unlikely that the entire ship's complement was middies. In fact, you do see older cremembers in that film. The Enterprise was never the flaship until TNG..except for JJTrek that is. The only reason the Enterprise went to Regula in TWOK was because the Admiral wanted to...period. The "only ship in the quadrant" was just a bullshit line he gave Spock..and he didn't buy it either.

This new film, however has cadets in major positions of command...it makes no sense that they're the only ones capable of being in charge. I mean, they left 17-year old Chekov in command at least twice...no one else on board was more experienced than he?!!! Ridiculous. It would even be unlikely that no other candidate for first officer was better than Spock at 4years out of the academy....he's still just a kid himself.

Did they mention rank for Kirk, McCoy, Uhura, Sulu, and Chekov? I don't seem to recall any mention of Lieutenant for any of them.

And in Star Trek V, the Admiral wanted Jim Kirk to handle the situation. And the Enterprise was finished in that film....just had a few electrical bugs to work out. Nothing like TMP situation.

 

[The Wormhole]

Re: *sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcas

And in Star Trek V, the Admiral wanted Jim Kirk to handle the situation. And the Enterprise was finished in that film....just had a few electrical bugs to work out. Nothing like TMP situation.

Indeed. Kirk even says "there have to be other ships in range." Harve Bennett than answers "Other ships yes. But they don't have Jim Kirk in command."

 

[Star Wolf]

Re: *sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcas

There is definitely a precedent for it, but at least it'll never have to happen again, hopefully, now that the crew is all together.

Although I always thought the Enterprise was the flagship. Did that really only first get mentioned in TNG?

It was a TNG innovation. Used to pump up that Picard was as great as Kirk in the early years of the TNG run. The ultimate moment was in First Contact where Picard assumes command of the fleet fighting the Borg cube as if all flag officers in a fleet that size had already been knocked out of action.

In the Original series Enterprise was one of thirteen of her class. Normally thought of as the best the Federation had. however in episodes where other starships where in play Kirk was subordinate to other starship captains. Commodore Decker even tried to exercise his authority to sdieze command of Enterprise. Meaning that in a two ship squadron the Enterprise wouldn't have even carried that pennant, much less the Starfleet flag.

 

[Classic Fan]

Re: *sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcas

Also, the whole instant rank thing. I took this as the fact that maybe, McCoy and Uhura are fully qualified officers, but are maybe studdying extra curicular subjects or adding to their CV or something. Thats maybe why they both hold lieutenant ranks when they get aboard the Enterprise just after wearing cadet uniforms.

Uhura's rank isn't a big deal. Kirk, in TOS, graduated with the rank of Lieutenant. Same story here.

As for McCoy: He shouldn't have needed to go to the Academy at all. It's common for military doctors to skip the academies and be commissioned directly. My dad, for example, joined the Army Medical Corps and was made an O-3 Captain, as is the norm for Army doctors, without having to go to West Point.

Yeah, fair point on the doctor ranking. Makes sense now that i think about. Maybe McCoy was in the academy brushing up on certain things like basic training on computer systems and space service training. Similar to army doctorrs being trained in combat and procedures etc. Could be any reason hes at the academy while being a comissioned officer.

Actually, thinking about it now, i suppose the rank of ensign could be seen as a kind of apprentice rank, especially in the case of whizz-kid Chekov, kind of finnishing the course in the field as he is so gifted/intelligent. Like doing 11th grade math at 12 years old.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

Re: *sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcas

How exactly do we know the ship was full of cadets?

Sulu is a lieutenant.
Uhura is a lieutenant.
Chekov is an ensign.

Mind you Pike also calls Uhura a cadet, so who knows.

Anyway half the ship could be full of cadets, we don't know it's 100% full.

I attributed that one to JJ's team's apparent lack of understanding for protocol.

You mean the protocol for a fictional space based organization that exists in the future that was probably cofounded by aliens so we have no idea how it would be run.

Yes cadets manned the ship, done in TWOk.
But they never send a whole fleet of cadets to face a crisis.
They have mobilized the whole cadet core.
Its like the US navy sending out their entire cadets in Annapolis to face a threat in the sea of Japan, while the entire 7th fleet was called away to deal with some unnamed middle east situation.
Even in that unlikely scenario the 7th fleet or a detachment of it would be called back to deal with the situation in the sea of Japan rather than sending out a fleet load of cadets.

So for the entire fleet being called away to the Laurentian(sp) system does seem a bit convenient. A better approach would be to have it said the fleet was called away to the Deveron(sp) system a little nod to TNG.

No that isn't what it was like THEY. WERE. NOT. EXPECTING. TO. RUN. INTO. A. FIGHT. They were helping the Vulcans with what was though to be a natural disaster.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Re: *sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcas

Did they mention rank for Kirk, McCoy, Uhura, Sulu, and Chekov? I don't seem to recall any mention of Lieutenant for any of them.

McCoy wears the rank stripes of a Lieutenant Commander. Sulu and Uhura are said to be Lieutenants. In the novelization, I believe Kirk actually has the rank of Lieutenant (or would have, if he hadn't been put on suspension). I don't remember Chekov's rank ever being mentioned in dialogue.

 

[RAMA]

Re: *sarcasm* I can't believe the flagship was full of cadets! *sarcas

That the Enterprise was full of cadets is one of the focuses of the anti-nuTrek folk's attack. I never understood this attack because there are clearly senior officers aboard. That aside, I watched Wrath of Khan last night and guess what! The Enterprise, flagship of the Federation, was full of cadets! In fact, Kirk tells Spock that he told Starfleet, "all we have is a boatload of children."

Looks like a ship full of cadets is not some outrageous thing, after all. In fact, it's the very same thing that happened in what many agree is the best ST film ever.

I already mentioned this before. Add to that, the cadets were supplementing the armada's already existing crews and it was an emergency situation, and there really is no criticism left on this point.

RAMA