Riker should have been killed instead of Data in Nemesis

[A Chimpanzee & 2 Trainees]

While they could have killed off Riker, I don't think it really would have made much difference. Nemesis's problems were more systemic than a mere plot point like that. It wouldn't have solved the "we're watching TWOK again" syndrome. That was the biggest crime of the movie, to me anyway.

Who plays the Spock role is irrelevant, really.

 

[mahler5]

THIS MOVIE SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Peach Wookiee]

^Can we say why? Otherwise, I'd like to point you to the board rules, dear...

 

[WillsBabe]

I'm glad they didn't kill off Riker. Obviously he's my favourite TNG character and I would have been so bummed that he bit the dust at the last minute with little hope of resurrection. I guess the same can be said for Data and his fans, so I sympathise. I suppose if Tom Riker had been around that would have softened the blow. As others have said upthread, Riker isn't a distinct enough or popular enough character to be the one that bought the farm. It needed to be a character that the audience who aren't necessarily fans would be able to relate to.

 

[Guy Gardener]

"Shinzon could have found a way to kidnap Tom Riker and use him as bait to lore Picard to wherever he wanted"

That's just a splendid typo.

I can imagine Tom Hitting on Deanna at some point and then he says... "What? Too soon?"

Yeah, Spock will always be the First officer of the Enterprise which comes first to mind, no matter what happens.

 

[Mott the barber]

Nemesis was an insult to long time TNG fans. There's no way else to slice it if you're one of them. It took years of canon and threw it out the window, and killed off the best character. But the death wasn't even meaningful and just a waste.

 

[SlyCardie]

Alpha Romeo said:

PiperMaru22 said:
Believe me, Data's death wasn't the only thing wrong with that movie.

THanks!! Never heard that before!!

People need to lighten up on Nemesis. It wasn't perfect but it was never designed to be. Like it for what it is...star trek.

I really don't understand the hate for Nemesis. I liked the idea of a second Picard that turns bad, and analyzes what makes us who we are and what makes us different. Data's death was the ultimate act of being human: death. But not even a simple death, a heroic death that saved someone else's life. It was the perfect ending to his existence.

If you didn't like B4 and the possible plots that that might entail, I can understand that, but there weren't going to be any more TNG movies anyways, so I don't why anyone would be concerned about that.

 

[Cyke101]

There should've been six more movies after Nemesis, where in each film, one of the senior crew gets to die, but with hilarious results. Then, the last movie would just be Picard looking around his bridge musing, "I used to have a crew."

 

[SiorX]

To be honest, pretty much any of the movies could have ended with that line

Next Gen movies, not terribly good at playing with the ensemble cast. I mean, in all four movies, count up the non-technobabble lines that LaForge or especially Crusher have.

Though, your idea for a Next Gen movie franchise is intriguing. I imagine "Star Trek VII: Wesley Gets Eaten Alive by Space Ants" would be a particular fan favourite.

 

[Kpnuts]

santa biggles said:
It wasn't supposed to be their last adventure, though. (Remember the tagline on the posters? "A Generation's Final Journey Begins") There would have been a fifth TNG movie if Nemesis hadn't been such a tremendous disappointment.

You're kidding right?

 

[cardinal biggles]

That's the way they planned it. Go poke through the TrekToday archives. I believe both Stewart and Spiner have spoken at conventions and in the press about what John Logan's ideas for a Nemesis follow-up were.

 

[Kpnuts]

santa biggles said:
That's the way they planned it. Go poke through the TrekToday archives. I believe both Stewart and Spiner have spoken at conventions and in the press about what John Logan's ideas for a Nemesis follow-up were.

Saying that Nemesis was 'crying out for a sequel' isn't quite the same as saying a follow up film was planned, and I think you're looking far too closely at the film's tagline. Nemesis was their big send off, a final film for the cast to enjoy.

 

[ALF]

It should have been Worf.
Klingons, honor, sto-vo-kor, etc.

 

[flandry84]

Wny not kill off Riker?
The producers hadn't given him anything meaningful to do in years.

 

[SlyCardie]

I wondered if that had something to do with him taking on the directorial duties. At least he fought a Reman and tied the knot in Nemesis.

 

[Kegek]

Kpnuts said:
Saying that Nemesis was 'crying out for a sequel' isn't quite the same as saying a follow up film was planned, and I think you're looking far too closely at the film's tagline. Nemesis was their big send off, a final film for the cast to enjoy.

I've got to go with santa biggles here. Sure, now, retroactively, around half-a-decade later with the TNG film franchise dead in the water and a new Abrams-run one coming into being, Nemesis looks like the last film in the TNG franchise because that's exactly what it is.

But that's not what it was intended to be. Like Batman & Robin and Die Another Day, it was a film that intended a sequel but whose plans were scrapped. The B4 subplot in particular had SEEEE-QUEL written all over it. There was no doubt in my mind that they intended another when I left the theatre... nor was there much surprise when that further film never materialised.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

Kegek Kringle said: The B4 subplot in particular had SEEEE-QUEL written all over it.

That subplot didn't have sequel written at all. It was a "Just in case Spiner changes his mind and WANTS to be part of the next movie".

With every interview made at the time, another movie was what was hoped for. At that time, Spiner DID want out for good. Again, B4 was the Just In Case Clause. But by no means the definitive plot point leading to a sequel.

 

[Nebusj]

santa biggles said:
That's the way they planned it. Go poke through the TrekToday archives. I believe both Stewart and Spiner have spoken at conventions and in the press about what John Logan's ideas for a Nemesis follow-up were.

But, at that, wasn't there interview puffery about Insurrection about how there was great sequel potential for that in case anyone happened to accidentally see it and like what went on?

 

[Kegek]

M'rk, son of Mogh said:
That subplot didn't have sequel written at all. It was a "Just in case Spiner changes his mind and WANTS to be part of the next movie".

Essentially the same thing, but with difference emphasis. It was a back-door and I recognise it as such, I'm pretty certain that, had another TNG film been made, Data would be along for the ride.

But it wasn't and he isn't, and that's that.

 

[ALF]

flandry84 said:
Wny not kill off Riker?
The producers hadn't given him anything meaningful to do in years.

Star Trek 12: Riker Saves Christmas