Revisiting DS9...

[Warped9]

“The Nagus” *

Quark finds himself named successor as Grand Nagus of all Ferengi.

My God was this painful to watch. Ferengi as a rule are a freaking joke in Trek and only Quark made it bearable as a character, primarily because he had just a hint of menace to him...and that he didn't have an annoying voice. But load up an episode with Frenegi and it's just painful to watch all this stupidity.

The only decent moment was Jake teaching his friend how to read, but that lasted about a minute.

To paraphrase Quark: I'd like to jettison this out an airlock.


The essential flaw with the Ferengi is a similar one with many of the Klingons and many other Trek aliens: they became basically one note characters with little variety. They got something of a build up in very early TNG and then they proved to be a huge disappointment. You simply can't take them seriously in terms of conflict or drama or menace. They were conceived of badly from the start.

Quark was a big step in rectifying that, but then they don't follow through and let the rest of the Ferengi be played as badly as before. It's an opportunity they just don't seize.

 

[MacLeod]

Still no real ' O'Brien must suffer episode ' as they tend to be some interesting episodes.

 

[Warped9]

The Ferengi were supposed to be an example of capitalism/corporatism run amok...and yet the Ferengi themselves are played as a joke where it's very easy to dismiss them.

Yet for a moment as I saw all those Ferengi gathered around Zek at a conference table in Quark's bar I couldn't help but think of a syndicate, of a group doing business on a large scale and rationalizing their underhanded tactics. Again you dismiss the Ferengi because they're made to look stupid, but what if they'd been made to look more sinister? In the beginning Quark had something of that sinister hint to him, but then they don't follow it up.

Arrgh!

 

[DonIago]

I wonder how many Ferengi intentionally play up the stereotype to disarm their enemies...

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

The Ferengi were supposed to be an example of capitalism/corporatism run amok...and yet the Ferengi themselves are played as a joke where it's very easy to dismiss them.

I actually wouldn't call them true free-market capitalists. More like an oligarchy/cartel, when you look at it. The intense regulatory environment and the idiocy of cutting half the population from the marketplace makes it clear that's no true capitalist society. It's just someone's bad parody/bad misunderstanding of one.

I wonder how many Ferengi intentionally play up the stereotype to disarm their enemies...

That wouldn't surprise me. Still doesn't excuse the fact that ALL we saw was the stereotype.

I'm going to plug Gibraltar's fanfic writing for showing what a true Ferengi enemy (at least, assuming that's where he's going with this...the guy's in a definite grey area) might look like. DaiMon Junt is quite an interesting and shrewd character here...

http://www.adastrafanfic.com/viewstory.php?sid=875

 

[InklingStar]

Yes, early Bashir wasn't very good. Even O'Brien didn't like him

I don't know if it was the quality of his acting or his portrayal of a young naive irritant that grated on the nerves of Kira and O'Brien. In some respects, he was written that way.

But at least he has somewhere to come up from.
He ends on a considerably better note and it wouldn't really be possible for that growth if he didn't start from somewhere. All the DS9 characters really start from one place and grow through a lot to end up changed in major ways. One of the unique hallmarks of the series.

I believe Bashir was deliberately written as a young, immature jerk. The Companion talks about how the writers had a general arc for him, and always intended to pair him up with O'Brien. Bashir has one of the greatest beginning-to-end character arcs of anyone in Trek.

 

[Warped9]

Vortex ***

Odo meets an alien who may hold information about Odo's origins.

This wasn't bad, but it really wasn't anything special either. Its sole redeeming element is Odo beginning to get some clue as to his origins. And this resonates more if you already have some sense of what comes later in the series. I think it's also the first time we hear the word "changeling" to describe Odo's species.

I also thought the alien forehead designs in this were silly looking as well.

I am curious about one thing: when Odo loses consciousness it's interesting that he still maintains his humanoid form rather than simply reverting to his original state. This really seems rather off to me.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

I'm not sure about that last part, either. It doesn't make any sense, unless his cells somehow have some sort of "memory" as long as they're attached to him and he doesn't send a message to them to change (or reaches his regeneration cycle).

Of course, that's before you deal with the question of how he gets knocked out in the first place.

 

[Warped9]

I can accept Odo being able to change form and perhaps even modify his mass (within context of Trek's "reality"), but I have a hard time accepting he is going to be the same as the object or animal he is mimicking. For example when he takes the form of a glass: he is not only transparent, but he doesn't weigh any more than the glass as well? And he shattered when he hit the floor yet still manages to reassemble himself? And then later the fugitive states that Odo is heavier than he looks!!!

It all strikes me as rather inconsistent.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

The only other possibility...do you think there's any chance Odo was feigning unconsciousness (such as to test Croden and see how he'd react)?

 

[Warped9]

^^ That's not the impression I got from the scene.

 

[Warped9]

“Battle Lines” ****

Sisko and company are caught between factions locked in never ending combat.

This episode has something of a TOS feel to it and I quite like it. For me it was marred only by jags of technobabble from O'Brien that made my eyes roll into the back of my head. I also found it a bit amusing that it's O'Brien who solves the techno-babble problem rather than the science officer, Dax.

It's interesting that at this point they effectively write Opaka out of the show---perhaps they just didn't know what to do with her? Then again she will appear later occasionally like some Obi-Wan like presence.

I really liked Bashir's line: "Excuse me, sir, but we can't afford to die here. Not even once."

And it's a relief to come across an episode like this after a string of basically mediocrity.

 

[Canadave]

I think the only real problem with "Battle Lines" for me is the fact that it's only Opaka's second appearance. We don't really get a sense of how important she was to Bajorans before this episode beyond what the characters tell us about her, so her "death" doesn't have quite the impact that it probably should have.

Still, it's an intriguing concept, and it was rather well-executed, so it's a solid episode, even if it falls short of brilliance.

 

[Warped9]

I thought it interesting when the Prime Directive issue popped up. Firstly Sisko takes the stand that they won't take sides or offer advice on how to fight even as Kira starts offering suggestions. Well Sisko is bound by Starfleet regulations, but Kira is Bajoran and not bound by those Starfleet regs. Or is she given that she's serving under Starfleet authority?

But then later Sisko offers to take everyone off-planet assuming they get rescued. Even Bashir raises the Prime Directive issue because the moon is in fact a penal facility. And at that point Sisko seems ready to cross the Prime Directive.

In the end the issue is out of his hands because of the biomechanical nanotech keeping the combating prisoners alive. But it's still interesting.

 

[Ubik]

“Battle Lines” ****

Sisko and company are caught between factions locked in never ending combat.

This episode has something of a TOS feel to it and I quite like it. For me it was marred only by jags of technobabble from O'Brien that made my eyes roll into the back of my head. I also found it a bit amusing that it's O'Brien who solves the techno-babble problem rather than the science officer, Dax.

It's interesting that at this point they effectively write Opaka out of the show---perhaps they just didn't know what to do with her? Then again she will appear later occasionally like some Obi-Wan like presence.

I really liked Bashir's line: "Excuse me, sir, but we can't afford to die here. Not even once."

And it's a relief to come across an episode like this after a string of basically mediocrity.

This is indeed one of the more memorable episodes from that first season. In answer to your question about why they wrote Opaka out of the show so early, I don't think it was because they didn't know what to do with her, but because they needed to put another character in the position of Kai....I don't know if you know what happens, so I won't state it explicitly...but her replacement becomes one of the best recurring villains on tv.

Oh, and also, images of Opaka do show up later in the show as visions sometimes, you're right about that, but it's not actually Opaka - Opaka herself is dead, and stays dead.

 

[Warped9]

^^ Opaka isn't actually dead. She's alive on that penal moon. And, yes, I'm well away of Kai Wyn, but I would hardly call her one of the best villains to grace television.

 

[Ubik]

^^ Opaka isn't actually dead. She's alive on that penal moon. And, yes, I'm well away of Kai Wyn, but I would hardly call her one of the best villains to grace television.

Then you haven't yet seen her best episodes.

Basically, Louise Fletcher is once again playing Nurse Ratched. And Winn works so well as a villain for the exact same reasons Nurse Ratched did - the calm, polite exterior with the gracious smile and the soothing voice very thinly disguising an angry, desperate, disgusting human being. Louise Fletcher may not have shown a wide variety of different kinds of roles in her career, but this type of woman she knows how to play extremely well, and her Kai Winn is every bit as frustrating and monstrous and memorable as Ratched was. (You're no doubt going to respond that you don't find Ratched that great a villain either, at which point I'll just throw my hands up in despair and give up on this particular debate.)

Oh, and yes, of course, you're right about Opaka. What I meant to say is that the actual Opaka never shows up in the show again. Only images of her that the Prophets use in visions.

 

[Warped9]

At this point I'm not prepared to debate it, not until I see more.

I know she'll be connected with some scheming guy (can't recall his name) in the three episode story at the beginning of Season 2. I know she'll be in competition with Kira's Vedek lover. I know she'll also clash with Kira over numerous things. And I know she gets involved with Dukat after he poses as a Bajoran and they seek to resurrect the Pah Wraiths.

 

[Ubik]

At this point I'm not prepared to debate it, not until I see more.

You're absolutely right - we'll wait at least until the end of the first season, the season finale, which is Kai Winn's first great episode.

 

[Warped9]

^^ Note that I initially watched the first two and a half seasons of DS9 before my viewing became sporadic and then I drifted away. After that I saw it infrequently, but just enough to get some sense of what was going on. But as I look over the seasons and episodes lists I realize I've seen much of Season 4 and into Season 5.

Anyway it was so long ago that my recall is spotty about a lot of it. Hence the revisit to reassess the series.