Production Order Group Viewing 2018
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And the Children Shall Lead
What an interesting title. I bet this episode will be great.
Huh. Tommy looks just like Kirk's nephew, Peter. Kirk must be too preoccupied to notice.
I know I've seen the Mary actress, Pamelyn Ferdin on numerous shows including The Odd Couple and Sigmund and the Sea Monsters. Raise your hand if you remember Sigmund and the Sea Monsters.
"...ashes, ashes, we all fall down!" Rather creepy and meaningful lyric after we see the adults are all dead.
This episode starts out well enough with an interesting mystery. Who killed the parents and why don't the kids care? At some point it goes off the rails. I think it's when the kids start pumping their fists.
So they have a different data card for every possible combination of ice cream you could want? That sounds most inefficient from a real-life 21st century point of view.
This episode reminds me of Miri and my desire to wring some kids' necks. Because nothing is worse (or more annoying) than evil kids.
Gorgon:"No one will tell us where to go, when to sleep, where to eat." Is this episode like a metaphor (if that's the right word) of how kids view adults? Always telling kids what to do, always doing boring work stuff.
I wonder how long you could live unprotected in space. If Kirk could have immediately gotten the Enterprise turned around to search for them, could they have rescued this week's sacrificial red shirts?
As the lawyer in a muumuu lays out his entire plan in front of Kirk and crew.
Here's where this episode gets almost unbearably frustrating for me. Kirk saw the kids summon the lawyer. The lawyer laid out his whole plan for Kirk. Kirk sees Tommy pumping his fist, he sees the effect that it's having on his crew, but he spends WAAAAAAAY too much time interacting with them and letting Tommy continue to pump his fist and wreak havoc.
Later, in Auxiliary Control it's a replay of this as Kirk spends WAAAAAAAAY too much time arguing and fighting with Scotty and company when he sees a kid in the corner pumping his fist.
And yet again when Chekov and company come to arrest Kirk and Spock and Kirk spends WAAAAAAAAY too much time arguing with Chekov. Kirk just experienced the effect of the fist pumping himself when he had his extreme anxiety. He should know very well you can't just talk someone out of it, but he keeps trying to reason with affected crew members.
Hey! Here's an idea ! ATTACK THE KIDS!!!!!! I know on the bridge he eventually moves to go after Tommy only to get whammied, but after that, he's immune. Hey! How about pulling out a phaser and STUNNING THE KIDS!!!!! This total lack of action and dicking around with affected crewmen while the kids just stand there unmolested pumping their fists makes me NUTS.
I get so sick of Tommy pumping his fist. I really want to smack that smug look off of his face.
This gets talked about a lot here, but how does Kirk know to call the lawyer Gorgon?
How did Kirk know the Gorgon would turn ugly?
The children begin crying as they see the truth. "Why'd I have to be in this crappy episode?" I'd cry too.
As we continue our inexorable march toward Plato's Stepchildren, I know there are those who consider PS the worst episode of the series. To those people, I give And the Children Shall Lead as a more worthy candidate.
Alien Watch! Only the lawyer in the muumuu.
Season 1
Talosians
That big ugly Rigellian guy Pike fought in illusion
Vina as an Orion girl in illusion
Glimpse of other aliens captured by Talosians
Ron Howard's brother
That dog from Enemy Within
Salt monster
That hand plant...Gertrude
Spock (duh)
Charlie's parents (Thasians)*
Romulans!
(Ruk)
Miri's planet kids (bonk bonk)
Giant ape creatures of Taurus II
Shore Leave Caretaker guy
Trelaine and his folks*
Gorn
Metrons*
The Lazerii
The remarkably human-looking aliens of Beta 3. (RotA)
The remarkably human-looking aliens of Emineminar VII (AToA)
The Triffids of Omicron Ceti III (TSoP)
The refreshingly non-human-looking Horta
Organians*
Klingons! (Remarkably human looking).
(The Guardian of Forever)
Flying pancakes
Season 2
Sylvia and Korob
The Companion
The remarkably human looking (though tall) Cappellans.
Native Pollux IV-ians (Apollo and his gang)
Full-blooded Vulcans
The remarkably human looking citizens of Argelius II (WitF)
Redjac
The People of Vaal (Gamma Triangulians)
Crew of the ISS Enterprise
The remarkably human-looking** (except for maybe a dot on their forehead) Halkans
Tribbles (not at all human looking)
The remarkably human-looking citizens of...892-VI. Is that what they call this planet? (The Roman one.)
Tall guys, short guys, Andorians, Tellurites, purple lady, Orion made up like an Andorian. (JtB)
The remarkably human-looking people of Neural. (APLW)
The awesome Mugato!
Shahna, Lars, Tamoon, Kloog, Thrallmaster Galt, and the Providers
The Cloud from the Tycho system.
The BIG FREAKIN' AMEBA!!!!!
The remarkably human-looking Iotians. (Gangsters)
Kelvans! Who really look like big, cool squids but choose to look remarkably human.
Sargon and the gang of not-quite-omnipotent aliens.
Remarkably human looking Zeons of Zeon and Ekosians of Ekos. (PoF)
The remarkably human looking Yangs and Coms of Omega IV.
Isis! Who looks remarkably like a cat until she wants to look remarkably human.
Season 3
The decidedly non-human looking Melkotians.
The remarkably human-looking Elasians and not so human looking Troyians.
Lawyer in a muumuu. Remarkably human-looking but maybe that was on purpose.
*Alien Watch sublist: omnipotent aliens!
**By request
Bonus Question: What is the difference between a Fleet Captain and a Commodore?
What an interesting title. I bet this episode will be great.
Huh. Tommy looks just like Kirk's nephew, Peter. Kirk must be too preoccupied to notice.
I know I've seen the Mary actress, Pamelyn Ferdin on numerous shows including The Odd Couple and Sigmund and the Sea Monsters. Raise your hand if you remember Sigmund and the Sea Monsters.
"...ashes, ashes, we all fall down!" Rather creepy and meaningful lyric after we see the adults are all dead.
This episode starts out well enough with an interesting mystery. Who killed the parents and why don't the kids care? At some point it goes off the rails. I think it's when the kids start pumping their fists.
So they have a different data card for every possible combination of ice cream you could want? That sounds most inefficient from a real-life 21st century point of view.
This episode reminds me of Miri and my desire to wring some kids' necks. Because nothing is worse (or more annoying) than evil kids.
Gorgon:"No one will tell us where to go, when to sleep, where to eat." Is this episode like a metaphor (if that's the right word) of how kids view adults? Always telling kids what to do, always doing boring work stuff.
I wonder how long you could live unprotected in space. If Kirk could have immediately gotten the Enterprise turned around to search for them, could they have rescued this week's sacrificial red shirts?
As the lawyer in a muumuu lays out his entire plan in front of Kirk and crew.
Here's where this episode gets almost unbearably frustrating for me. Kirk saw the kids summon the lawyer. The lawyer laid out his whole plan for Kirk. Kirk sees Tommy pumping his fist, he sees the effect that it's having on his crew, but he spends WAAAAAAAY too much time interacting with them and letting Tommy continue to pump his fist and wreak havoc.
Later, in Auxiliary Control it's a replay of this as Kirk spends WAAAAAAAAY too much time arguing and fighting with Scotty and company when he sees a kid in the corner pumping his fist.
And yet again when Chekov and company come to arrest Kirk and Spock and Kirk spends WAAAAAAAAY too much time arguing with Chekov. Kirk just experienced the effect of the fist pumping himself when he had his extreme anxiety. He should know very well you can't just talk someone out of it, but he keeps trying to reason with affected crew members.
Hey! Here's an idea ! ATTACK THE KIDS!!!!!! I know on the bridge he eventually moves to go after Tommy only to get whammied, but after that, he's immune. Hey! How about pulling out a phaser and STUNNING THE KIDS!!!!! This total lack of action and dicking around with affected crewmen while the kids just stand there unmolested pumping their fists makes me NUTS.
I get so sick of Tommy pumping his fist. I really want to smack that smug look off of his face.
This gets talked about a lot here, but how does Kirk know to call the lawyer Gorgon?
How did Kirk know the Gorgon would turn ugly?
The children begin crying as they see the truth. "Why'd I have to be in this crappy episode?" I'd cry too.
As we continue our inexorable march toward Plato's Stepchildren, I know there are those who consider PS the worst episode of the series. To those people, I give And the Children Shall Lead as a more worthy candidate.
Alien Watch! Only the lawyer in the muumuu.
Season 1
Talosians
That big ugly Rigellian guy Pike fought in illusion
Vina as an Orion girl in illusion
Glimpse of other aliens captured by Talosians
Ron Howard's brother
That dog from Enemy Within
Salt monster
That hand plant...Gertrude
Spock (duh)
Charlie's parents (Thasians)*
Romulans!
(Ruk)
Miri's planet kids (bonk bonk)
Giant ape creatures of Taurus II
Shore Leave Caretaker guy
Trelaine and his folks*
Gorn
Metrons*
The Lazerii
The remarkably human-looking aliens of Beta 3. (RotA)
The remarkably human-looking aliens of Emineminar VII (AToA)
The Triffids of Omicron Ceti III (TSoP)
The refreshingly non-human-looking Horta
Organians*
Klingons! (Remarkably human looking).
(The Guardian of Forever)
Flying pancakes
Season 2
Sylvia and Korob
The Companion
The remarkably human looking (though tall) Cappellans.
Native Pollux IV-ians (Apollo and his gang)
Full-blooded Vulcans
The remarkably human looking citizens of Argelius II (WitF)
Redjac
The People of Vaal (Gamma Triangulians)
Crew of the ISS Enterprise
The remarkably human-looking** (except for maybe a dot on their forehead) Halkans
Tribbles (not at all human looking)
The remarkably human-looking citizens of...892-VI. Is that what they call this planet? (The Roman one.)
Tall guys, short guys, Andorians, Tellurites, purple lady, Orion made up like an Andorian. (JtB)
The remarkably human-looking people of Neural. (APLW)
The awesome Mugato!
Shahna, Lars, Tamoon, Kloog, Thrallmaster Galt, and the Providers
The Cloud from the Tycho system.
The BIG FREAKIN' AMEBA!!!!!
The remarkably human-looking Iotians. (Gangsters)
Kelvans! Who really look like big, cool squids but choose to look remarkably human.
Sargon and the gang of not-quite-omnipotent aliens.
Remarkably human looking Zeons of Zeon and Ekosians of Ekos. (PoF)
The remarkably human looking Yangs and Coms of Omega IV.
Isis! Who looks remarkably like a cat until she wants to look remarkably human.
Season 3
The decidedly non-human looking Melkotians.
The remarkably human-looking Elasians and not so human looking Troyians.
Lawyer in a muumuu. Remarkably human-looking but maybe that was on purpose.
*Alien Watch sublist: omnipotent aliens!
**By request
Bonus Question: What is the difference between a Fleet Captain and a Commodore?
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The Federation would know to make their Vulcan spies register as Romulans to sensors.
About a hundred credits a week.
The mental attacks are telepathic in nature. Spock, who has telepathic talents, was able to fight off the mind control. Kirk fights off his beast with the help of Spock in the turbolift. Did Spock covertly use Vulcan mind-meld assistance, after all Kirk and Spock have mind bounded several times over the last three years? Maybe the telepathic bound was sligthly two-way without the Gorgan/Gorgon realizing it. That could explain Kirk's spontaneous knowledge of his name and how to beat him. (Or something got lost in script writing/editing.)
Plato's Stepchildren is SO much worse than And The Children Shall Lead! 
I really don't get the hate for this episode while Plato is very unsettling and so out of character for the whole series! 
JB
I really don't get the hate for this episode while Plato is very unsettling and so out of character for the whole series! JB
Don't start on Plato.Plato's Stepchildren is SO much worse than And The Children Shall Lead!
JB
Maybe one of the main differences between Children and Plato is that the acting was so bad in Children. As someone had pointed out Children had so much potential. If they had only made the children more creepier instead of obnoxious. If Kirk had not broken down so early. It could have been a great semi-supernatural story. Instead we had a bunch of obnoxious kids that we had no sympathy for. And I could have delivered lines better than the Gorgon. It reminds me of the child actor playing young Anakin Skywalker
The kids were okay I thought, Commish! You can't expect top class acting and experience from children and Melvin Belli wasn't even a proper actor but I wasn't aware of that until many, many years later! Now what's your excuse for Plato's stepchildren may I ask? 
JB
JB
No it's not.
Fewer excuses are needed than for And the Children Shall Lead.Now what's your excuse for Plato's stepchildren may I ask?
JB
In fairness, I'm the one who brought it up.
The thing about Plato's Stepchildren for me was that I had to wait fourteen years to see it! It was one of three or four episodes banned in the UK. I first got the privilege in 1982 on one of two rental video tapes and I can tell you that I was not impressed at all! I didn't bother to copy it like I did The Empath, which wasn't much better or Whom Gods Destroy, but I did like Miri, and at the very least tried to keep a fizzy second generation tape!
JB
JB
I assume the title, "And The Children Shall Lead" is based off the Bible, Isaiah 11:6, even though the episode's topic does not seem to relate to the Bible reference. Then again, most of the Shakespeare reference titles didn't have anything in common with those themes either. I guess they sounded cool.
I think we should try to focus on some of the good points of the episode...hum, a couple of the kids were cute. Hum, I'm done. I hope next week's episode is better. Maybe there will be a pretty woman guest star for Kirk to schmooze.
I think we should try to focus on some of the good points of the episode...hum, a couple of the kids were cute. Hum, I'm done. I hope next week's episode is better. Maybe there will be a pretty woman guest star for Kirk to schmooze.
I think And the Children Shall Lead is one of Chapel's stronger episodes but they let her down again by having her dismiss her concerns and then having no involvement in Kirk's efforts to resolve the situation.
I do agree that less time spent on Kirk arguing and a bit more time spent on him problem solving without taking anyone on overtly would have been better.
The nursery rhymes and bee stinging was downright creepy so it's a shame their manipulation becomes so full on. If they stayed sweet yet sinister instead of annoying, saving Gorgon's appearance for the final scene, the episode could have been quite strong.
I do agree that less time spent on Kirk arguing and a bit more time spent on him problem solving without taking anyone on overtly would have been better.
The nursery rhymes and bee stinging was downright creepy so it's a shame their manipulation becomes so full on. If they stayed sweet yet sinister instead of annoying, saving Gorgon's appearance for the final scene, the episode could have been quite strong.
Yep, that could not be a more non-Star Trek message if it tried. Did the writer not see Devil In The Dark?
It's one of the last of their prejudices.
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