Plot hole city

[Set Harth]

How do we know that isn't the Hobus star?

How do you know it is? An appeal to ignorance doesn't make it the Hobus star. It's just a star. There are millions of them. The Hobus star was most likely in Romulan space.

 

[Broccoli]

Nero's plan would have worked if it weren't for some very unlikely coincidences and a lot of luck.

And for those meddling kids.

 

[number6]

Nero's plan would have worked if it weren't for some very unlikely coincidences and a lot of luck.

And for those meddling kids.

He definitely would have gotten away with it otherwise.

 

[Saquist]

Nero's plan would have worked if it weren't for some very unlikely coincidences and a lot of luck.

And for those meddling kids.

LOL...
NIICE...

An appeal to ignorance doesn't make it the Hobus star.

Stop using logic to be evasive.
They enter the black hole at the point where it swallowed the supernova from the Hobus star ergo where they exit in the past is the Hobus....

It's just a star. There are millions of them. The Hobus star was most likely in Romulan space.

YOU MEAN IN ORDER FOR IT TO THREATEN THE ENTIRE GALAXY IT HAD TO BE IN ROMULAN SPACE?

So agreeing with people who disagree with you isn't an argument and anything you disagree with is a plothole based on your fabricated definition and terms of interpretation and anyone who disagrees with you and calls you on your obvious bullshit and attempts to irritate people who like this film is dense?? Is that your only purpose? It must be frustrating for you that so many people understand the plot of this film and you just can't grasp it. I would attribute this to your higher standards of writing, but you can hardly construct a sentence and you don't know how to spell. You've got nothing.
Keep changing the goalposts of your debate and insult people who actually have a point. I am sure that gets you far in real life.

Spare me your not-so-righteous indignation and grammar police shenanigans...

You presume wrong. First, who says that's the Hobus star at the beginning?

OH NOW we're being sticklers to the dialogue and narative. Not drawing any conclusions or any more speculations now? Why the change?

It's a star on the Federation/Klingon border. Space is visibly different where Spock emerges. There is a nebula where there was a star when Nero emerged. Does "We've arrived at the coordinates your calculated" ring a bell? And your earlier obsession that Nero couldn't have worked out the when and where of Spock's return? Have you forgotten all of that?

What does this mean?
You're saying the Federation/Klingon border CAN'T be the Same as the Neutral Zone where 47 klingon ships were destroyed?
You're saying that a Supernova that threatened to destroy AN ENTIRE GALAXY and DESTROYED A STAR LIGHTYEARS away can't cover a regional area that would require calculating a exit aperture?

How did you come to all these conclusions?

This further proves your lack of understanding of the story.

You've piqued my interest...enlighten me...

1. They do not emerge next to the Hobus star. Nero emerges near the Federation-Klingon border.

False:
We can not determine that they DID not emerge next to the Hobus star.

2. Spock does not emerge in the same place as Nero. Spock emerges in the Romulan Neutral Zone.

FALSE:
It said Neutral Zone.

Chekov: May I have your attention please? At 2200 hours Starfleet detected an anomaly in the Neutral Zone, that appeared to be a lightning storm in space. Soon after Starfleet received a distress signal from the Vulcan High Command, that their planet was experiencing unusual seismic activity. Our mission: is to assess the condition of Vulcan and assist with evacuations if necessary. We should be arriving at Vulcan in 3 minutes, thank you for your time.

http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=127202&page=25

By this point the only Neutral Zone mentioned had Klingons in it and there is no other mention or any other Neutral Zone. Could it be that you are projecting your expectations for a Romulan Neutral Zone rather than taking the Film in it's OWN context?

Now I am reading the script on the Line-by-line here on the BBS, maybe you're going by memory but I have only seen the film twice so I'm inclined not to go by my memory. Tell me if you think this is me or you this time.

But he doesn't intend to get himself killed. I haven't lost any "flow of logic". He does indeed have 130 years to do it, that's a fact. The idea that a task which one has 130 years to accomplish must be done immediately is itself not logical.

Of course it's LOGICAL. It's his stated IMPERATIVE that he mentions first before his revenge (IF you can believe him and what he says)

"My purpose Christopher, is to not simply avoid the destruction of the home i love, but to create a Romulus that exists....free of the Federation. You see, only then will she be truly safe. That is why i will destroy all the remaining Federation planets.....starting with yours. "

Yet he goes into battle without ever doing anything to save Romulus which dooms it to the same destruction.

Which is a pointless comment given that ( as you admit ) he didn't have the red matter.

REALLY...it's a pointless comment to SUGGEST he could have warned Romulus of the Star's future destructive potential and evacuate Romulus? That's what you call POINTLESS? REALLY? So to you...without the Red-matter 130 year might as well be 2 seconds? FOR YOUR "LOGIC" no Red Matter means absolutely NO ALTERNATIVES? Dude...that is some reinforced head you have there.... You can't possibly expect me to take that seriously...

 

[number6]

Don't worry. No one takes you seriously at all.

 

[M'Sharak]

number6 and Saquist, I'm sure you'll both recall when I posted this upthread:

Okay, enough. Too many people getting too personal.

It should be possible to keep topic separate from poster, and to carry on civil discussion without condescension, without insulting dismissiveness and without namecalling. It's up to you guys to make it happen.

And I'm equally sure that you both realized that it was directed primarily at the two of you. (I may also have said something to another person along the way about endeavoring to be more careful in choosing one's words.)

So what do we have? A sampling should illustrate:

<sni>

What is moronic is how you keep harping on this argument like you're winning, when everyone on this board has proven your argument to be completely invalid. Are you going to move the goal posts some more or are you going to finally and at long last concede your failure?

Your personal issues with character isn't a plothole, nor is your lack of understanding of the story.

You seem to have nothing but personal issues with this.
So basically anything you personally disagree with is a plothole.

<snip>

So agreeing with people who disagree with you isn't an argument and anything you disagree with is a plothole based on your fabricated definition and terms of interpretation and anyone who disagrees with you and calls you on your obvious bullshit and attempts to irritate people who like this film is dense?? Is that your only purpose? It must be frustrating for you that so many people understand the plot of this film and you just can't grasp it. I would attribute this to your higher standards of writing, but you can hardly construct a sentence and you don't know how to spell. You've got nothing.
Keep changing the goalposts of your debate and insult people who actually have a point. I am sure that gets you far in real life.

Don't worry. No one takes you seriously at all.

You had to keep making it personal, after I made a post specifically requesting that it stop. That earns you a warning for trolling. Comments to PM.

Now Saquist:

<snip>

<snip>

Yes...of course...I forgot that logic works by consensus here on the TrekBBS...my-bad....

------------

<snip>

<snip>
....and you don't think that's moronic?
I would love to play a game of chess with just 2 rooks and 2 bishops and see how far you get with your whole army....

<snip>

Arguments aren't really about winning at least not as far as I've seen on this forum...their about blustering and posturing and you've certainly have out done me in that department but when it comes to addressing the point you're evasive...you prefer ad homs to directly countering the argument and that's never a win...

[...]

<snip>

This isn't about Negative Proof.
You said he didn't need to do it now "kinda thing"
You've got to be kidding me. Your family and unborn child whose death sent you into a rage is not your FIRST Priority? You have abandon the flow of logic just as assuredly as the film.

<snip>

What a co-inky-dink....I was going to say the same thing about you since you can't back anything up directly... LOL

<snip>

Spare me your not-so-righteous indignation and grammar police shenanigans...

<snip>

REALLY...it's a pointless comment to SUGGEST he could have warned Romulus of the Star's future destructive potential and evacuate Romulus? That's what you call POINTLESS? REALLY? So to you...without the Red-matter 130 year might as well be 2 seconds? FOR YOUR "LOGIC" no Red Matter means absolutely NO ALTERNATIVES? Dude...that is some reinforced head you have there.... You can't possibly expect me to take that seriously...

Also repeated instances of getting personal after having been asked to stop. You've got quite a history of this.

You now have a trolling warning to go with. Comments to PM.

Now, I'm up way past my bedtime, and this thread is going to remain closed at least until after I've had my coffee in the morning. Say good night, thread.