Picard: Is it really that dark?
- Thread starter Charles Phipps
- Start date
Picard is definitely NOT "dark". The major difference to classic Trek is the change of perspective which is also one of the show's merits, and the serialisation of course. Imagine the events around TNG "The Survivors" were stretched into a (short) season: Super entity falls in love with a woman, their colony gets destroyed by evil aliens, angry entity wipes out the entire species, 50 billion people. Such a season would feel grim, would make TNG as a whole grimmer despite the fact that it actually happens in the canonical ST prime continuity.
Besides, the main characters start at difficult times of their lives: Picard is "waiting to die", Raffi had lost her position and family and had become an addict, Rios had left Starfleet after a traumatic experience...
The Federation/ Starfleet is NOT evil either, their behaviour absolutely does fit in with old ST including the so-called utopian TNG. Remember when Starfleet reprimands Picard because he had refused to use Hugh, who had regained his individuality, as a suicide attacker? Remember Admiral "I have a lot of friends at Starfleet Command" Pressman willing to risk a war over a cloaking device? Or Admiral "I've brought down bigger men than you, Picard" Satie and her witch hunt? Layton's attempt to impose a military dictatorship on Earth? Tolerating and supporting Section 31 whose methods include genocide by using/ sacrificing a person who had been helping the Federation? Remember the whole Maquis debacle starting with the decision to relocate colonists on multiple planets without even consulting them? The Maquis themselves (essentially Fed. citizens) poisoning Cardassian worlds? Maxwell killing hundreds of Cardassians based on a gut feeling and bias? When one of those super evoloved Starfleet officers suspects Spock to be a traitor since he looks like a romulan? Remember the "it's easy to be a saint in paradise" theme? Kirk hating the entire Klingon species because one of them had killed his son, not to mention the Starfleet personnel participating in the Khitomer conspiracy?
I am not arguing it is in fact a club of a-holes in TNG etc., the general attitude is still positive, still a society to aspire to yet NOT PERFECT. They make mistakes, sometimes they go by negative emotions. When the crunch comes, the Federation puts its own interests first, but they are not incorrigible, at the end of the day, the synth ban gets lifted, and Starfleet saves Copellius. NuTrek has not changed anything.
I would even go so far as to say that PIC is a little more optimistic than usual. Firstly, it introduced the Fenris Rangers, a small but benevolent interstellar organisation. Secondly, Picard realises Borg drones are rather victims than threats, it was made to fix that shooting assimilated crewmembers were supposed to be a coup de grâce in First Contact. Thirdly, you get several quite diverse romulan characters, Laris and Zhaban are former Tal Shiar operatives who had changed, become close family-like friends with Picard. Even the villains at least believe they had been trying to save kind of everyone.
So, can we bury that crappy, stupid claim? Good.
The unrelated robot malfunction is the official explanation, they are probably not sure themselves.
The decision is not supposed to be defensible, PIC makes no secret of it being the wrong one. Take for instance Maxwell's plus to a lesser degree O'Brien's view on the Cardassians (TNG "The Wounded") or Jim "Let them (Klingons) die!" Kirk, take into account there must be lots of people with similar biases against Romulans as well, and you get why 14+ worlds are not eager to make some sort of sacrifices in order to help someone they unsurprisingly regard as enemies. Romulans do pull some serious shit in TOS and the Berman shows which is just the shit we know about.
A little OT but: Turkana IV is not a Federation but an Earth colony, for all we know they also may have always been independent not unlike the two colonies in TNG "Up The Long Ladder ". The planet only had "relations" with the Federation which had been severed.
Besides, the main characters start at difficult times of their lives: Picard is "waiting to die", Raffi had lost her position and family and had become an addict, Rios had left Starfleet after a traumatic experience...
The Federation/ Starfleet is NOT evil either, their behaviour absolutely does fit in with old ST including the so-called utopian TNG. Remember when Starfleet reprimands Picard because he had refused to use Hugh, who had regained his individuality, as a suicide attacker? Remember Admiral "I have a lot of friends at Starfleet Command" Pressman willing to risk a war over a cloaking device? Or Admiral "I've brought down bigger men than you, Picard" Satie and her witch hunt? Layton's attempt to impose a military dictatorship on Earth? Tolerating and supporting Section 31 whose methods include genocide by using/ sacrificing a person who had been helping the Federation? Remember the whole Maquis debacle starting with the decision to relocate colonists on multiple planets without even consulting them? The Maquis themselves (essentially Fed. citizens) poisoning Cardassian worlds? Maxwell killing hundreds of Cardassians based on a gut feeling and bias? When one of those super evoloved Starfleet officers suspects Spock to be a traitor since he looks like a romulan? Remember the "it's easy to be a saint in paradise" theme? Kirk hating the entire Klingon species because one of them had killed his son, not to mention the Starfleet personnel participating in the Khitomer conspiracy?
I am not arguing it is in fact a club of a-holes in TNG etc., the general attitude is still positive, still a society to aspire to yet NOT PERFECT. They make mistakes, sometimes they go by negative emotions. When the crunch comes, the Federation puts its own interests first, but they are not incorrigible, at the end of the day, the synth ban gets lifted, and Starfleet saves Copellius. NuTrek has not changed anything.
I would even go so far as to say that PIC is a little more optimistic than usual. Firstly, it introduced the Fenris Rangers, a small but benevolent interstellar organisation. Secondly, Picard realises Borg drones are rather victims than threats, it was made to fix that shooting assimilated crewmembers were supposed to be a coup de grâce in First Contact. Thirdly, you get several quite diverse romulan characters, Laris and Zhaban are former Tal Shiar operatives who had changed, become close family-like friends with Picard. Even the villains at least believe they had been trying to save kind of everyone.
So, can we bury that crappy, stupid claim? Good.
The unrelated robot malfunction is the official explanation, they are probably not sure themselves.
The decision is not supposed to be defensible, PIC makes no secret of it being the wrong one. Take for instance Maxwell's plus to a lesser degree O'Brien's view on the Cardassians (TNG "The Wounded") or Jim "Let them (Klingons) die!" Kirk, take into account there must be lots of people with similar biases against Romulans as well, and you get why 14+ worlds are not eager to make some sort of sacrifices in order to help someone they unsurprisingly regard as enemies. Romulans do pull some serious shit in TOS and the Berman shows which is just the shit we know about.
A little OT but: Turkana IV is not a Federation but an Earth colony, for all we know they also may have always been independent not unlike the two colonies in TNG "Up The Long Ladder ". The planet only had "relations" with the Federation which had been severed.
However, is there any real or much difference between an Earth colony and Federation colony when Federation headquarters are on Earth and the president is also there. Feels like the difference is name only, which one is it called.
Yes, there's a difference because it might not be reflective of the Federation as a whole.
Ouch! I wandered into a Picard episode and stubbed my toe because it is indeed so so dark.
I mean, does "Earth colony" mean, "Settlement founded by people from Earth but politically independent," or does it mean, "Political subdivision of the Federation Member State known as United Earth?"
If the former, then Turkana IV is essentially a foreign sovereign state and the Federation has no responsibility for its governance. If the latter, the Federation has responsibility for its governance in the same way that, say, the United States has responsibility for the governance of a small island off the coast of Maine.
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I maintain that DS9 Seasons 6-7, ENT Season 3, and Disco Season 1 are all darker than Picard.
What do they all have in common that Picard doesn't? A war going on. Wars where characters, especially the lead characters, make terrible choices. Picard doesn't have a war, and all the tragedy happens in flashbacks, years before the main body of the series actually takes place.
What do they all have in common that Picard doesn't? A war going on. Wars where characters, especially the lead characters, make terrible choices. Picard doesn't have a war, and all the tragedy happens in flashbacks, years before the main body of the series actually takes place.
"Earth colony" means founded by people of Earth but not necesssarily part of the Federation. Turkana might have been governed by Earth for years or decades or they had done their own thing from the start just as the two "Up The Long Ladder" colonies I mentioned.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/SS_Mariposa
Also the secession of Terra Nova.
There is simply no proof Turkana had ever been some kind of Federation member.
What are we supposed to fight about?
"Too graphic" (the eye)
Killing off Hugh (don't lthink it was a good decision myself)
Swearing
Too woke
Not woke enough
Civilian clothing style
Copy-paste fleet
"Where's Captain Worf?"
Uniforms
"Picard should be God Emperor by that time or something"
Bridge windows
...
No shortage.
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My favorite one is that button-up shirts mean dystopia."Earth colony" means founded by people of Earth but not necesssarily part of the Federation. Turkana might have been governed by Earth for years or decades or they had done their own thing from the start just as the two "Up The Long Ladder" colonies I mentioned.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/SS_Mariposa
Also the secession of Terra Nova.
There is simply no proof Turkana had ever been some kind of Federation member.
"Too graphic" (the eye)
Killing off Hugh (don't lthink it was a good decision myself)
Swearing
Too woke
Not woke enough
Civilian clothing style
Copy-paste fleet
"Where's Captain Worf?"
Uniforms
"Picard should be God Emperor by that time or something"
Bridge windows
...
No shortage.
Not button-up shirts per se, but JC Penny.
LOL!
I guess Wal-Mart, where everyone wears pajamas, is Utopia...
... wait a minute. Now I know "Earth is a Paradise Utopia" is just Bullshit PR.
... wait a minute. Now I know "Earth is a Paradise Utopia" is just Bullshit PR.
"Too graphic" (the eye)
Killing off Hugh (don't lthink it was a good decision myself)
Swearing
Too woke
Not woke enough
Civilian clothing style
Copy-paste fleet
"Where's Captain Worf?"
Uniforms
"Picard should be God Emperor by that time or something"
Bridge windows
...
No shortage.
You forgot the cup holders.
Ill-fitting jumpsuits = Proper Utopian Future compatible with Gene's Vision. Or GTFO.
No, it's not that dark.
It's darker.
It's darker.
You forgot the cup holders.
That's new to me.
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