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Picard film in development
- Thread starter Danja
- Start date
No.
It sells.
We got that Mandalorian fellow, and the clones.
STAR TREK is fine.
Huh?
I mean, if instead of moving on to a brand new crew with TNG, totally removed from TOS, the new series had tied itself as strongly as the current shows do to what came before,I don't think it would have done as well.
TNG was the very first (live-action) Star Trek spinoff TV series since TOS. They could have done anything and people still would have watched it, because Star Trek was at the height of its popularity in 1987 and everyone was happy with the prospect of Trek back on the small screen.
And let’s not kid ourselves: for the first few years TNG was pretty lousy. Heck, even Patrick Stewart thought the show would get canceled and didn’t unpack his stuff from his trailer because he thought they were going to fire him.
I mean, just to give real world examples... When did World War II really start? The Japanese invasion of Manchuria? The Reichstag fire? The Spanish Civil War? The Italian Invasion of Ethiopia? And people could even play the "well, actually..." card and say World War II didn't really end until the Soviets withdrawal from Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania or the Treaty on the Final Settlement with Respect to Germany.
So if the Star Trek universe mid-21st century World War III involved actors using eugenics based technologies or ideology (ref: Col Green) etc, it could be easy to say well actually World War III really began in the early 1990s with Khan and then just took a break. If anything, the hardest part to reconcile is having a massive war in South Asia in the mid 90s but still having 9/11 happen in the Star Trek universe with the same real world personalities as seen in ENT.
Streaming bubble + too easy money + too big to fail.
It is at least the high water mark
And snicker all you want, but for me second place actually falls to PICARD season 2. Yeah, I find some of the other ones downright awful or unwatchable.Good caveat though to acknowledge PRODIGY punching far above its weight.
I hope they mean Paramount+ movie and not movie movie.
As long as they don’t kill off any of the TNG main characters, or any of the DS9 or VOY main characters if they make a cameo appearance in the movie, they’ll be fine.
They tried that with DIS. For a lot of fans, the series just does not work for them.
I don't know, I recently rewatched Logan and would be down for a very final end to TNG, if done well (and yes I know everyone came back/is coming back after Logan but still)
Agreed. But I worry that the producers will veer too hard into Memberberries territory a we go on. Yes, do legacy, but it should run concurrently with a series that moves forward with a completely new cast. They shouldn't be solely reliant on old fans going gaga over nostalgia hits.
Well, unfortunately, the louder older fans are talking up the nostalgia part, not the new stuff. So, what lesson are the producers to learn from that?
That it isn't a simple either/or.
Picard had a built in audience, but that has diminishing returns, as such things always do.
In ten years, there will be people getting nostalgic for Discovery. It might not seem that way now, but look at how excited people get over mentions of Voyager, or even Enterprise.
And in another twenty years we'll have people pining for Strange New Worlds (Although that's a bit of a unique example).
It's distressing to me that the only all-new, non-prequel series we've gotten in 30 years are both animated. Lower decks and Prodigy are fantastic, yes, but by nature of being animated they don't get the same kind of attention and consideration.
I think it's time for a new, live action series that moves the story forward, both on the timeline and in character. But we won't get that if the producers continue to chase the easy nostalgia fandom.
It is and it isn't simple all at the same time. For a production standpoint it is simple-they need to make money. What are fans and audience members currently purchasing? Well, the stuff with the highest ratings, which goes to SNW and Picard Season 3.
I agree that it won't happen but we're also not rewarding such efforts with the views. So, why take the risk as Paramount and other producers look at significant reduction in money being made?
Actually, I think we are rewarding efforts with views.
Prodigy has already become a big hit for Netflix. Lower Decks has become much, much bigger than I think anyone at the top predicted. Picard had nostalgia, yes, but didn't get huge acclaim until the writing actually improved.
If they're looking at Discovery, then they're taking the wrong lessons. Discovery has had an identity crisis from season 2 onward. It didn't know what it wants to be, it lurches from one idea to another, and it has never been able to maintain strong long-term character development for an ensemble cast. The difference between it and SNW is night and day, and it shows in the reception.
So we, as an audience, are doing what we can to say what we like. The questing is, are the producers interpreting it properly?
Again, yes and no.
Prodigy did not get big views until Netflix. So, will that carry over for Netflix to request more? Well, Season 2 has to drop first and then we will see. Will people actually put their money where their mouth was when they talked it up and said "Save Prodigy!"
Picard did the same writing as Season 1 and 2, but it relied heavily on nostalgia. I strongly suspect the wrong lessons will be learned there.
Discovery is over, as it has its last season to air. What lessons will be taken will likely be minimal, since they changed showrunners so much until they found their way.
SNW is heavily on the nostalgia as well, despite my preference for Pike, the inclusion of Uhura, M'Benga, and Scotty all point towards the nostalgia factor.
So, we, as an audience, are sending the message that familiar brings money. Not new, not interesting characters, but those with the names and styles of Trek gone before. And when something new is suggested, like Section 31 and Starfleet Academy, it is dismissed with "No one asked for that."
Well, then I guess nostalgia it is.
Hard disagree on that. There's been a through-line in Burnham, Book, Saru, Tilly, and Culber's arcs. I'll even say there's been a through-line in Zora's arc. The show has had a pretty solid identity since Michelle Paradise took over, it's just that people who don't like the show don't like what that is. Tough shit for them. They can go watch something else (but that's crazy talk, I know).
You mentioned Season 2 and that's where you're stuck. Season 1 was definitely one way. Seasons 3-5 are another way. Season 2 was the transition point. Season 2 was a fork in the road where you could go from DSC S2 to SNW, the rest of DSC, or S31. It feels like three shows in one.
Each arc in DSC Season 3-5 is a different story and that should be exactly that, a different story. People are twisting that into something else. "Ah! Oh no! DSC doesn't know what it wants to do!" Actually yes, it does. It doesn't want to do the same exact thing every year. If they did, those same people would exclaim, "Oh no! Every year is the same! Do something else!" They do something else, then it's like, "They don't know what to do!" It's like the Congress of the United States whenever the opposite party holds the White House. Congress wants to do the exact opposite of whatever the President wants. "If he's for it, we're against it." The fans are like Congress.
Whereas SNW is their same "party", so it can do no wrong.
And all of this still has nothing to do with a Picard Movie. Except it goes against what the "political party" on TrekBBS wants.
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I'm not "against" a Picard movie except that it seems like wholly unnecessary thing. Will it makes money? Oh sure, cause nostalgia. But it's still the franchise spinning its wheels.
As far as Discovery, you obviously feel very differently about it than I do. Which is fine, but I think if Discovery hadn't been so married to their season-long arcs we'd have more seasons of it. Those arcs didn't leave room for the little bits that made the other shows feel like a home. And now they're saying season 5 will be different, but I guess it was too late. For me, my breaking point came when they took a whole episode to get thru the galactic barrier.
If Picard is a one and done, okay, great. But I wish they'd put sone resources into NEW stuff.
That's the problem with doing anything in the TNG era, even post-Voyager/post-Nemesis. The temptation to bring in legacy characters and concepts is too strong.
We actually don't know how Prodigy did on Paramount. It was apparently predicated at least partially on toy sales, so when Playmates canned their new Star Trek line, that made the idea of a children's trek series a lot less palatable to Paramount, regardless of ratings.
And as for SNW, that's what I meant when I said it was a unique case. They're taking legacy characters, yes, but ones that had little to no character development. MBenga, Chapel, Una, and Pike were barely fleshed out before SNW. Uhura was the last developed of the original series crew. She didn't even have a first name until 2009. So really the only fully fleshed out legacy character is Spock, and thank God the whole series isn't centered around him.
I was opposed to a Section 31 series because they are, frankly, villains. A one-off thing for them is fine, but an ongoing series? I just don't think it's sustainable. As for Starfleet Academy, I'd be a lot more interested in it if it wasn't a spinoff of 31st-century Discovery.
It isn't enough to JUST be new, after all. Good writing is the bedrock that all of these shows have to draw from. And if you're starting with a flawed premise, you're just handicapping yourself in the long run.
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