Picard’s Tea Order Makes No Sense

[fireproof78]

Considering how happy she usually is to eat those replicated sundaes, not very likely.

I still think that this whole "non-replicated food tastes better" is a case of "hand-kneaded bread has more soul"

I never understood the objection to non-replicated food tasting better. Taste is a matter of, well, taste. Some things taste amazing to me than many regard as strange, i.e. I like teriyaki sauce on multiple food types, and pineapple on pizza. Whether real or imagined the replicator may simply not get some differences, or, more likely, it replicates the exact same pattern over and over again. While I like my chocolate to taste a certain way, my mom and my brother do not make chocolate ganache exactly the same. There are subtle differences in the taste can be detected. For some that difference makes little difference, similar to Captain Holt in Brooklyn 99 or Dozer in The Matrix. Nutritional value is all that matters.

 

[Takeru]

I still think that this whole "non-replicated food tastes better" is a case of "hand-kneaded bread has more soul"

The problem with replicated food might be that it's exactly the same every time, with real food there are differences even if you follow the same recipe, fruits and vegetables don't always taste identical, maybe you use a little bit more salt one week or the texture changes slightly because it's cooked slightly longer or shorter.

When a dish tastes exactly the same every time (because it is the same down to the last molecule) it will probably get boring after some time and replicated food gets the "meh" label.

 

[Swedish Borg]

The problem with replicated food might be that it's exactly the same every time...

actually, you could likely randomize some variations in the texture as well as the taste to make it seem completely real, it's easy enough to do now, let alone in the future. Just as Picard can't tell the difference between a holodeck program and reality he would probably not be able to tell the difference between replicated stuff and the real thing unless he knows it was replicated.

This reminds me of a relative of one of my friends who came on a visit from abroad. I lived in France back then. Anyway, my friend invited him to a fine restaurant where he ate frog legs and snails but didn't know it because it was served mixed in a dish not separate and my friend did the ordering. So after the meal, he was about to tell him what it was that he ate when the relative started telling him how he appreciated all of this and that he didn't try to make him eat these awful things he'd heard about... Needless to say that my friend didn't have the heart to tell him what he ate.

To this day that man most likely still doesn't know what he ate that day. That's some nice irony for you.

 

[Brennyren]

I've seen it suggested that a possible issue with replicated food is that it's prepared to suit the average taste: not too spicy, not too strong (or weak), not too sweet, and so on. But most people's tastes differ from that average at least in some respect. I, for example, like my coffee stronger than most people do, so I would find coffee made for average tastes incompletely satisfying.

That said, we've also seen that it's possible to program recipes into a replicator. So if you want plomeek soup just like Grandma used to make, get her recipe! @Orphalesion commented on how much Troi loves her replicated chocolate sundaes; is it possible that she's programmed in her favorite type of ice cream and her favorite chocolate sauce to make sure the sundae is exactly what she wants?

 

[Orphalesion]

IDK, maybe I'm doing something wrong, but when I cook or bake something, it usually taste the same each time, unless I deliberately vary the ingredients, and I wouldn't call a meal tasting the same each time a feature, not a bug.
Plus, again, since we have evidence that you can program the replicator, I'm sure you could create variants of recipes.

 

[fireproof78]

IDK, maybe I'm doing something wrong, but when I cook or bake something, it usually taste the same each time, unless I deliberately vary the ingredients, and I wouldn't call a meal tasting the same each time a feature, not a bug.
Plus, again, since we have evidence that you can program the replicator, I'm sure you could create variants of recipes.

I think it depends on what you want. Obviously comfort style food is (supposedly) supposed to be the same every time. Now, maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I love variety, but I don't measure it. So, it's a bit more "pinch of this, dash of that" style to mess with the flavor. Some times it works, and sometimes it doesn't. Now, many will treat this as sacrilegious but I think this is the closest equivalent for my money.

 

[Orphalesion]

I think it depends on what you want. Obviously comfort style food is (supposedly) supposed to be the same every time. Now, maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I love variety, but I don't measure it. So, it's a bit more "pinch of this, dash of that" style to mess with the flavor. Some times it works, and sometimes it doesn't. Now, many will treat this as sacrilegious but I think this is the closest equivalent for my money.

Yeah, see, I'm somebody who mostly fairly close sticks to specific recipes, I weigh stuff, when I cook I set a timer. And yesterday when I was making Ramen from scratch I was actually disappointed that I cooked the egg a little bit to long (i forgot the timer) and it was almost hardboiled instead of the soft-boiled egg I usually put into it.
That doesn't mean I don't like variety, but when I vary, then it's deliberate (for example, I make yellow curry once a week, and with that I vary what kind of vegetables or fruit I put into it) and, since you can program the replicator, it seems that should be very easily doable.

 

[fireproof78]

Yeah, see, I'm somebody who mostly fairly close sticks to specific recipes, I weigh stuff, when I cook I set a timer. And yesterday when I was making Ramen from scratch I was actually disappointed that I cooked the egg a little bit to long (i forgot the timer) and it was almost hardboiled instead of the soft-boiled egg I usually put into it.
That doesn't mean I don't like variety, but when I vary, then it's deliberate (for example, I make yellow curry once a week, and with that I vary what kind of vegetables or fruit I put into it) and, since you can program the replicator, it seems that should be very easily doable.

I would imagine with a replicator it could be easier but that doesn't mean everyone does it. Data talks about all the cat food for Spot and the Spot prefers a certain variant. I would imagine that there is a tendency to just say the phrase and not worry about "Number 22, less pepper."

 

[Takeru]

actually, you could likely randomize some variations in the texture as well as the taste to make it seem completely real, ...

You could but how likely is it that whoever programmed the Enterprise's replicators did? Those things don't even give you a glass of water without asking for the temperature so I don't expect any randomizing when it comes to food.

 

[Orphalesion]

I would imagine with a replicator it could be easier but that doesn't mean everyone does it. Data talks about all the cat food for Spot and the Spot prefers a certain variant. I would imagine that there is a tendency to just say the phrase and not worry about "Number 22, less pepper."

But then it's a case of them being lazy. Can't really fault the replicator to make the same meal every time if you don't take the time to vary it.
I don't think it would even happen during the time you order your meal, but rather you'd have to program the variation into the replicator by hand (like, for example decrease the amount of salt). If there are presets (and realistically there should be) then you could save that as "Number 22, variation B" or something and that'd be your order and the next week you'd ask for "Number 22, Variation E" or something like that.

 

[Swedish Borg]

You could but how likely is it that whoever programmed the Enterprise's replicators did? Those things don't even give you a glass of water without asking for the temperature so I don't expect any randomizing when it comes to food.

Yeah, it's like they've been designed by complete nimrods without the slightest notion of ergonomy whatsoever...

Just like on Archer's Enterprise where if you keep your hand on the HANDRAIL, you lose your fingers!!

 

[fireproof78]

But then it's a case of them being lazy. Can't really fault the replicator to make the same meal every time if you don't take the time to vary it.
I don't think it would even happen during the time you order your meal, but rather you'd have to program the variation into the replicator by hand (like, for example decrease the amount of salt). If there are presets (and realistically there should be) then you could save that as "Number 22, variation B" or something and that'd be your order and the next week you'd ask for "Number 22, Variation E" or something like that.

I don't really fault the replicator at all. I think it has just a rote design to make it as simple as possible. If you want the variety then it needs to be programmed in, as evidenced by Captain Picard's preferred beverage, shaken not stirred, not being present in All Good Things.

Yeah, it's like they've been designed by complete nimrods without the slightest notion of ergonomy whatsoever...

Just like on Archer's Enterprise where if you keep your hand on the HANDRAIL, you lose your fingers!!

That's not what hand rails are for?

 

[Orphalesion]

I don't really fault the replicator at all. I think it has just a rote design to make it as simple as possible. If you want the variety then it needs to be programmed in, as evidenced by Captain Picard's preferred beverage, shaken not stirred, not being present in All Good Things.

Nah, I meant the characters can't complain about the lack of variety if they don't take the time to add it.
It's probably and easy enough process. Not as quick as just saying "Chicken Teriyaki", but probably still quicker than cooking it from scratch.

 

[Takeru]

Yeah, it's like they've been designed by complete nimrods without the slightest notion of ergonomy whatsoever...

Just like on Archer's Enterprise where if you keep your hand on the HANDRAIL, you lose your fingers!!

Or a holodeck that creates an AI capable of taking over the ship just because you said you want a villain who can Data.

 

[Swedish Borg]

...
That's not what hand rails are for?

handrail
/ˈhandreɪl/
noun
plural noun: handrails

1. a rail fixed to posts or a wall for people to hold on to for support.

 

[fireproof78]

Nah, I meant the characters can't complain about the lack of variety if they don't take the time to add it.
It's probably and easy enough process. Not as quick as just saying "Chicken Teriyaki", but probably still quicker than cooking it from scratch.

Fair point.

handrail
/ˈhandreɪl/
noun
plural noun: handrails

1. a rail fixed to posts or a wall for people to hold on to for support.

Nothing says you might not loose some limbs in the process. Trip was just being overprotective and clearly values his fingers way more than a 22nd century human should.

 

[Swedish Borg]

Fair point.

Nothing says you might not loose some limbs in the process. Trip was just being overprotective and clearly values his fingers way more than a 22nd century human should.

A handrail that makes you lose your fingers... That's called a guillotine.

 

[fireproof78]

A handrail that makes you lose your fingers... That's called a guillotine.

I thought that was for heads? Don't tell me it does fingers too?

 

[Orphalesion]

I thought that was for heads? Don't tell me it does fingers too?

Or maybe other roughly finger shaped extremities

 

[yotsuya]

I know it doesn’t really matter. I know it sounds cool for Picard to bark: ‘Tea. Earl Grey. Hot.’

But how does that make sense? Earl Grey is a type of tea. It wouldn’t realistically refer to anything except tea, so why does Picard feel the need to specify tea? Is he afraid of getting some Earl Grey wine or an Earl Grey donut? Ridiculous.

Then there’s the ‘hot’. Earl Grey is not served cold. It’s my tea of choice, and let me tell you that not once have I been asked whether I take it hot or cold. I suppose you might get iced Earl Grey, but people usually refer to ‘iced tea’ and ‘tea’ separately. You’d be pretty miffed if you asked for a cup of tea and got some iced tea instead. You shouldn’t need to specify your tea should be hot.

And what does ‘hot’ even mean? Like if you said this to someone at Starbucks, what would that tell them that a simple order of Earl Grey wouldn’t? Tea comes hot as standard. That’s information you can’t really do anything with. It’s too vague to act on. You’d either just tell the computer ‘Earl Grey’ or give some more exact instruction than ‘hot’.

So maybe it’s some kind of Picard preference where he’s set his ‘hot’ to an exact temperature? But if it’s a preference, I’d ask again why he needs to bother saying the ‘tea’ bit. And since it’s his standard cup, surely if he was setting a preference then he’d make the wording simpler. Just saying ‘tea’ or ‘Earl Grey’ would give his default order with no need to specify temperature. This makes me think it isn’t some kind of preference he’s set.

So, Picard should really just say ‘Earl Grey’. The ‘tea’ and ‘hot’ are completely useless. I suggest we all stop watching TNG until this madness is explained or a formal apology is penned by the writers.

Computers are stupid. And you get in the habit of giving instructions in a particular way. Tea first tells the computer what you are asking for, Earl Gray provides one parameter, not another. So the order comprises the item, flavor, and tempurature. And I bet there are plenty of people out there who like Earn Grey cold. I've never minded it when it cools off. No need to heat it, just drink it. So his order makes complete sense. Plus, he may know something you don't. Maybe if he doesn't order it that way the computer is programmed to ask questions. So his order might be the fastest way to address all the variables that computer might ask. It also could be for the computer on the Stargazer which might not have been quite as refined. When you develop a habit it can be hard to break.