Opinions on Chakotay & Seven

[Brit]

Except that the dampener is part of the cortical node.

Seven doesn't have the same cortical node she came aboard the ship with.

Except that the Cordial Node is technology that is generated in the drone’s body not placed there. It is a product of the original programming. In that case the node no matter where it come from, would adapt to the original programming. If Seven needed a emotion dampener for whatever reason, Icheb’s node whether it had one in the first place would generate one. The Borg are known to recycle parts so anything would have to revert to the drone’s intended programming.

I think that the case can be made that Icheb didn’t have a emotional dampener when one considers the episode “Child’s Play.” Would Icheb even be able to offer Seven his cordial node facing the possibly of his own death if he had had one in the first place? Or would his system simply shut down as we saw Seven’s in “Human Error?”

Brit

 

[teya]

Except that the dampener is part of the cortical node.

Seven doesn't have the same cortical node she came aboard the ship with.

Except that the Cordial Node is technology that is generated in the drone’s body not placed there.

That's an interesting theory.

However there are no "cordial" Borg. They don't have "cordial nodes," they have "cortical nodes."

It refers to the cerebral cortex. I'd just hate to see you put so much work into this story and turn off readers with a simple mistake.

 

[AuntKate]

It might be that such an emotional dampener is one of the last steps of the assimilation process, and Icheb wasn't completely "finished" being assimilated. That was why he could donate the cortical node in the first place. When it was placed in Seven's "head," it would conform to her programming.

 

[Brit]

LOL Thanks Teya, it's not a secret that I can't spell and am dependent on spell check. I do however have a beta that spells like a spelling champion, so the mistake wouldn't have made it to the end product.

One other thought before I have to go run Saturday errands, if Seven didn't have an emotional dampener before she got Icheb's cortical node, she probably would have noticed the difference. In fact she may have begun a frantic search for something to heighten her perceptions and it would have happened quickly.

If you think of Seven as a protoqueen, then the next question would be why Seven's original cortical node malfunctioned in the first place. Was there a flaw in the programming, or did the Borg need a "kill switch" for those that failed their test of loyalty?

Brit

 

[kimc]

One other thought before I have to go run Saturday errands, if Seven didn't have an emotional dampener before she got Icheb's cortical node, she probably would have noticed the difference. In fact she may have begun a frantic search for something to heighten her perceptions and it would have happened quickly.

That's why it makes sense to me that she had one all the time, however it happened.

 

[Saquist]

Never tried to open a front door with a chisel have you?

Everyone needs a universal tool.

I wonder what sort of permission Christie needed to "breakup" the happy couple? was there a nod, or was it such a non point that no one even considered it worth the red tape? On the other side of the spectrum, I'm guessing that there must have been some serious lawyer screaming while Killing the Captain, but could some writer just decide with as little regard or equanimity to say break up Tom and B'Elanna?

What is sacred?

they whole thing was just a ridiculous attempt by the producers to attach seven to...anybody....and explore sexuality.

 

[Guy Gardener]

No, they wanted to give the illusion of exploring her sexuality with out actually having to follow through, like when you tell your kids that YES you will play monopoly with them because you love them and want to spend time with them, 5 minutes before they have to brush their teeth for bedtime.

They knew the limits of their mandate. Titillate with out any follow through. Follow through is bad.

I wanted to explore the sexuality of all the characters, see what they had to offer, then screw with the status quo and wait for explosions and bed hopping and... I have been watching altogether too much One tree Hill.

 

[AuntKate]

^^You're right about them not wanting to explore this facet of Voyager's predicament. I was heartbroken to hear that they replaced Chakotay with Jaffen as Janeway's love interest in "Work Force." I wanted to see how the two of them coped with the repercussions of their involvement once their memories were restored. Oh, well. To continue the mantra--that's what fanfic is for!

 

[Guy Gardener]

You'd have to think that all turbolifts come with emergency doors and rope ladders, and maybe an airgrate made out of tinfoil on one side after the first few thousand stirring bonding campouts after the lifts go down.

 

[kimc]

You'd have to think that all turbolifts come with emergency doors and rope ladders, and maybe an airgrate made out of tinfoil on one side after the first few thousand stirring bonding campouts after the lifts go down.

The turbolift fanfic - a classic!

 

[Guy Gardener]

If Worf was trapped long enough, he'd eat who ever he was trapped in the lift with, but B'Elanna is only half Klingon, do you think she'd wait till after her liftmates were dead, or only twice as long as the full blooded variety?

 

[Yeoman Randi]

I never cared for Chakotay and didnt buy the pairing for one second.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Maybe he did buy her?

The Dowry tradition is ancient among several cultures including (after a brief Google confirmation) some Native American Samplings... Um, who would Chuckles hand over the 9 chickens too? Janeway possibly or would he backtrack to Borgland to pay due custom for his blonde Borg Princess to the Queen?

 

[Saquist]

No, they wanted to give the illusion of exploring her sexuality with out actually having to follow through, like when you tell your kids that YES you will play monopoly with them because you love them and want to spend time with them, 5 minutes before they have to brush their teeth for bedtime.

They knew the limits of their mandate. Titillate with out any follow through. Follow through is bad.

I wanted to explore the sexuality of all the characters, see what they had to offer, then screw with the status quo and wait for explosions and bed hopping and... I have been watching altogether too much One tree Hill.

I was very happy that Voyager kept it clean.
Sex is already everywhere else and it tends to put women in a very degrading roles.

Perfect example is Seven and absolutely dominating force, sucking Chakotay's finger....(gross) I had my cousins skip that episode. There are plenty of shows out there for sex...

That sort of exposure was done for Enterprise and it essentially destroyed T'pol's character right from the begining. It said even if you're logical you can be a sex kitten. I don't want my girls growing up with that glass ceiling on top of them. I don't want my boys to grow up learning this is the purpose of women....not from a ...TV show.

I'll raise my own kids if I have them not a stupid TV show.
That's the big problem with Enterprise....that ...smutt should have been on late...like BSG. I stopped watching it because how much smutt was in the show. So it was Stargate SG-1 and Atlantis and then off to bed.

 

[AuntKate]

No, they wanted to give the illusion of exploring her sexuality with out actually having to follow through, like when you tell your kids that YES you will play monopoly with them because you love them and want to spend time with them, 5 minutes before they have to brush their teeth for bedtime.

They knew the limits of their mandate. Titillate with out any follow through. Follow through is bad.

I wanted to explore the sexuality of all the characters, see what they had to offer, then screw with the status quo and wait for explosions and bed hopping and... I have been watching altogether too much One tree Hill.

I was very happy that Voyager kept it clean.
Sex is already everywhere else and it tends to put women in a very degrading roles.

Perfect example is Seven and absolutely dominating force, sucking Chakotay's finger....(gross) I had my cousins skip that episode. There are plenty of shows out there for sex...

That sort of exposure was done for Enterprise and it essentially destroyed T'pol's character right from the begining. It said even if you're logical you can be a sex kitten. I don't want my girls growing up with that glass ceiling on top of them. I don't want my boys to grow up learning this is the purpose of women....not from a ...TV show.

I'll raise my own kids if I have them not a stupid TV show.
That's the big problem with Enterprise....that ...smutt should have been on late...like BSG. I stopped watching it because how much smutt was in the show. So it was Stargate SG-1 and Atlantis and then off to bed.

Thanks for posting this, Saquist. It's good to get a new perspective, one from someone with younger children who are also watching the show. Your comments seem to reinforce Mulgrew's adamant position that Janeway not be seen as promiscuous on the program. Unfortunately, you and your family were not part of the "target" audience for the writers late in the TV era. TPTB assumed that men between the ages of 18-35 (their primary audience) want curvaceous and somewhat "kittenish" women portrayed on the screen. Whether that attitude contributed to the downward spiral of Voyager/Enterprise is without a doubt open to speculation.

I agree that focusing on the "sexual exploration" in relationships would be to the detriment of the plot in many cases, but I feel that relationships have their proper place in TV programming, if done well. They can be displayed without resorting to "sucking fingers" or rubbing each other's bare skin in a detox tank. I thought the Seiko/Miles O'Brien relationship was good on DS9, and Paris/Torres decent on Voyager.

However, as an important demographic, your opinion matters. Many of us became Star Trek fans as children--and your children are truly the future for upcoming movies and TV series.

 

[Guy Gardener]

How hard did she have try really if you look at how much of a whore Archer wasn't. IN HIS RIGHT MIND he kissed maybe three women, one was a genetic test to see if he was lying, one was to distract a prewarp monkey when his translator went on the blink, and the other was an old girlfriend who decided to haunt him a little. Considering on Quantum Leap, Sam Beckit kisses a different girl every episode, 15 of which are displayed during the opening credits, he slept with a few of them and even made a child with one of them, Bakula's willingness to appear whorish was not exploited in the slightest, so ultimately I think it's a fortunate coincidence that Mulgrew didn't want to be written as a slapper and the TPTB didn't know how to write one.

 

[KimMH]

It was sometimes embarrassing watching Enterprise with my adult son in the room. Odd that Star Trek can get so many things right but still fumbles the sex/relationship ball. I liked seeing Tom and B'Elanna have a grown up relationship. It's sad that so many Trek characters are still stuck in Jr. High school dating cycles.

 

[Pemmer Harge]

Chakotay and Seven? They were no Worf and Troi!

 

[exodus]

No, they wanted to give the illusion of exploring her sexuality with out actually having to follow through, like when you tell your kids that YES you will play monopoly with them because you love them and want to spend time with them, 5 minutes before they have to brush their teeth for bedtime.

They knew the limits of their mandate. Titillate with out any follow through. Follow through is bad.

I wanted to explore the sexuality of all the characters, see what they had to offer, then screw with the status quo and wait for explosions and bed hopping and... I have been watching altogether too much One tree Hill.

I was very happy that Voyager kept it clean.
Sex is already everywhere else and it tends to put women in a very degrading roles.

Perfect example is Seven and absolutely dominating force, sucking Chakotay's finger....(gross) I had my cousins skip that episode. There are plenty of shows out there for sex...

That sort of exposure was done for Enterprise and it essentially destroyed T'pol's character right from the begining. It said even if you're logical you can be a sex kitten. I don't want my girls growing up with that glass ceiling on top of them. I don't want my boys to grow up learning this is the purpose of women....not from a ...TV show.

I'll raise my own kids if I have them not a stupid TV show.
That's the big problem with Enterprise....that ...smutt should have been on late...like BSG. I stopped watching it because how much smutt was in the show. So it was Stargate SG-1 and Atlantis and then off to bed.

Thanks for posting this, Saquist. It's good to get a new perspective, one from someone with younger children who are also watching the show. Your comments seem to reinforce Mulgrew's adamant position that Janeway not be seen as promiscuous on the program. Unfortunately, you and your family were not part of the "target" audience for the writers late in the TV era. TPTB assumed that men between the ages of 18-35 (their primary audience) want curvaceous and somewhat "kittenish" women portrayed on the screen. Whether that attitude contributed to the downward spiral of Voyager/Enterprise is without a doubt open to speculation.

I agree that focusing on the "sexual exploration" in relationships would be to the detriment of the plot in many cases, but I feel that relationships have their proper place in TV programming, if done well. They can be displayed without resorting to "sucking fingers" or rubbing each other's bare skin in a detox tank. I thought the Seiko/Miles O'Brien relationship was good on DS9, and Paris/Torres decent on Voyager.

However, as an important demographic, your opinion matters. Many of us became Star Trek fans as children--and your children are truly the future for upcoming movies and TV series.

TOS the Trek that started all of this, was full of sexual exploration and innuendo. There are jokes even about how Kirk slept with every women he met, even the green one. How about the fact that every child shown on TOS were evil! Uhrua was even raped in "Gamesmaster of Triskailion."(sp) Trek's underlying theme is to influence discussion of political & social injustices. Trek's demographic was never children.

 

[AuntKate]

^^ However, Trek never approaches these issues head on. They don't address race descrimination, they have a species with faces that are half white and half black. They don't address homosexuality, they look at a species where all sexuality is repressed and the expression of any sexuality is censored. That is what is charming about "traditional" Trek, and that is what disappeared in the later years, and especially on ENT IMHO.