Opinion: the show has improved since Berg and Harberts left

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by ISS_Einstein, Mar 22, 2019.

  1. KennyB

    KennyB Rear Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2001
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany USAG
    I agree the show has improved, but it is Alex Kurtzman that deserves the praise for Season 2.
     
    Campe98, Gonzo and JoeP like this.
  2. SolarisOne

    SolarisOne Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2016
    I can't describe how much I love this.
     
    Gonzo and Locutus of Bored like this.
  3. Locutus of Bored

    Locutus of Bored THE GENE IS GOOD NON-TRUFANS ARE EVIL! Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2004
    Location:
    GODDENBERRY HAS SPOKEN!
    Done.
     
    Gonzo likes this.
  4. Serveaux

    Serveaux The Wind Premium Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2013
    Location:
    "So many people I haven't insulted..."
    I think the show's pretty bad, but even I'd agree that what I've seen of the thing this year is much better than the first season.
     
    Mechanoid1 likes this.
  5. Delta Vega

    Delta Vega Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2011
    Location:
    The Great Barrier
    Season 2 has been improving episode by episode, until "The Red Angel", when it stalled slightly
     
    Mechanoid1 likes this.
  6. skip bittman

    skip bittman Lieutenant Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Imagine the leap forward it would take without a tasteless hack like Kurtzman hanging around
     
  7. Vger23

    Vger23 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2014
    Location:
    New England
    I was actually thinking of formulating a thoughtful reply to this, as I think Kurtzman has his strengths and weaknesses, but then I went and looked at your last 15 posts dating back to July 2018, and they were all snarky and bitingly negative, and I realized that's probably not a productive use of my time.
     
  8. Longinus

    Longinus Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2008
    This certainly matches my impression, but it is a bit early to say for sure. I definitely hope that it is a trend rather than a fluke.
     
    Jadeb and BillJ like this.
  9. Serveaux

    Serveaux The Wind Premium Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2013
    Location:
    "So many people I haven't insulted..."
    To all appearances, Kurtzman disposing of Berg and Harberts and taking over the show himself is what improved it.
     
  10. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    After "The Red Angel", I'm not so sure. That episode really left a bad taste in my mouth after thinking it over.
     
    Gepard likes this.
  11. Unimatrix Q

    Unimatrix Q Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2015
    Location:
    Germany
    Shit happens from time to time. Even TOS, TNG and DS9 had some bad episodes, even during their best seasons.
    I wouldn't worry so much just because of one episode
     
  12. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    Not worried. Not going to dump the show at this point. Though it seems like they did a faceplant on what was the most pivotal episode of the season.
     
    SolarisOne likes this.
  13. Unimatrix Q

    Unimatrix Q Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2015
    Location:
    Germany
    Haven't come around to watch "The Red Angel". So i can't judge the episode yet. Will watch it today.

    Seems to be a "love it or hate it" episode.
     
  14. urbandefault

    urbandefault Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Location:
    Sickbay, dammit.
    "Borg and Herbert." :techman:
     
  15. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2001
    Location:
    Covington, Ky. USA
    I didn't hate it. It just doesn't feel like it gels with what came before earlier in the season.
     
  16. Gonzo

    Gonzo Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2017
    Location:
    England
    The pacing has indeed improved which is good but part of that could be due to the changes made to the overall plot arc once Berg and Herbert's were given the heave ho.

    It means they cant really hang about, for instance the start of Red Angel was pretty blunt, Spock just walking in and telling Michael he has worked out how to catch the traveller.

    All of them discussing how to catch a future version of Michael while she is standing there listening to them still makes me smile, if the current version knows their plan then the future version knows it to.

    I still enjoyed the episode though as I understand why they felt the need to move things along a bit faster.

    I don't mind Tilly either she is like a walking talking ice breaker and is always good value.

    It could also be to do with the potential for a Pike/Enterprise spinoff once they saw that both Pike and Spock had been well received by fans.
     
  17. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    Only in a fixed-timeline model. In the usual Trek model, the arrival of the time traveler has created a new timeline that changes what happened in her own past, so she wouldn't remember any new events that happen as a result of her presence. (Spock Prime doesn't remember Kelvin Spock's version of events, only his own.)
     
  18. Longinus

    Longinus Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2008
    And by 'usual Trek model' you mean the one made up for the reboot movies, instead of how it worked in the previous Star Trek...
     
  19. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    What??? Of course not! It's the normal way most Trek time travel has worked from the beginning, the same way most time travel in science fiction in general has usually worked for generations. Kirk and Spock remembered their own timeline after changing it in "Yesteryear." Sisko and Bashir remembered theirs after changing it in "Past Tense." I could also mention Marty McFly remembering his original timeline after he altered it in Back to the Future, or Russell Johnson remembering the original history after he changed it in The Twilight Zone: "Back There," or the dinosaur hunters remembering the original history when they got back in Bradbury's 1952 short story "A Sound of Thunder." And those are far from the only examples. It's the normal rule that time travelers retain the memory of the timeline they came from, not the new timeline their actions create. Yes, there are some works of fiction that show their memories changing (like Looper), and some that inconsistently do it both ways depending on the story (like Legends of Tomorrow), but those are less common.
     
    SolarisOne likes this.
  20. Gonzo

    Gonzo Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2017
    Location:
    England
    Except we have been told it's prime timeline so it is fixed.

    I suspect that we could see some kind of reset by the end of the season, if so then yeah we are currently in an alternate timeline.

    As it stands right now it's fixed from what we have been told.