Niners Unite...around Babylon 5!
- Thread starter PKTrekGirl
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... Will post as soon as I can.
^ You know, your avatar is very distracting. 
^^^ Ditto!! It has a kind of hypnotic effect!
Have just watched A Voice in the Wilderness parts 1 & 2, so will try to post on them tonight!
~~~
EDIT for the comments on this week's eps.
Legacies
A very interesting episode, especially for getting to know the Minbari just a little better. So far, we’ve seen them as peaceful people, yet we know there was a huge and terrible war between Earth and Minbar: it doesn’t really make sense. Now, we get to see the warrior caste (<span class="spoiler"><font class="small">Spoiler:</font><hr /><span>even though have heard there’s more than two castes…?</span><hr /></span>). Neroon’s militarism and abrasive nature make it all a bit more understandable. Of course, he is still a Minbari: he still puts a strong emphasis on tradition and respect, and obeys Delenn when he has to. John Vickery is pretty good – he has a real presence. (I couldn’t get over the fact that Gul Rusot was in this episode, though!)
My only problem with this ep was Delenn’s behaviour. It seemed out-of-character. Completely understand that she would want to give Bremer the religious funeral he wanted – but she really did make it hard for Sinclair, and endangered the station. It was only natural that the humans would be blamed and have to investigate, too – so I’m not sure why she didn’t just get it over with and tell Neroon what she’d done a little earlier. Still – this ep made the rift between the castes a lot more visible, and it’s surely gonna come back later! Surely!
The subplot (which again neatly ties in to the main plot with Alisa’s discovery) was alright, too. It was a little “convenient” that the mindburst happened just near Talia, but the ensuing battle of wills was really interesting and did highlight both sides of the issue well. Na’Toth’s brief cameo was a classic (“good idea about the teeth”), and Alisa’s final decision was surprising.
Anyway … as for the “little moments” in every ep, the moments that stand out …Once again, wanna hand it to O’Hare. The moment, at the very beginning, where the Minbari ship comes through the jumpgate and he flashes back to the Battle of the Line, again … his expression when he comes back to the present was just great, really subtle. Also – great to see the Pak’Mara! The concept and design are very cool! <span class="spoiler"><font class="small">Spoiler:</font><hr /><span>Although … is it true that there’s a Crusade ep called “Who’s My Little Pak’Mara?” If so – wtf??</span><hr /></span>
A Voice In The Wilderness (both parts)
I really liked this two-parter. It’s great that the planet they’re “parked next to” turns out to be important (from what I gather from Draal’s final statement, in the future it will play a crucial role)! And the Mars story that runs concurrently is quite shocking, in a way: the first real eruption of trouble amongst all the ominous signs.
The geological surveying team allow for a couple of great Ivanova moments (“Ivanova is God” and her lack of enthusiasm for a death in pursuit of science): I like the fact that against all precedent, they don’t die! As for Epsilon 3 itself: there’s something about it that really is evocative. Maybe it’s the titular “voice in the wilderness” – this barren planet with all this incredible machinery just chugging along with no known purpose as of yet, and one guy hooked up to it all, keeping it running. Something about that person, in a kind of crucifixion pose in the heart of the machine, was really striking. The alien design was good too: he had a very solemn look. And the special effects for Epsilon 3 and the space battle (whoa! B5 was actually hit!) were really good: not just for their quality but also for the sense of atmosphere they had.
The escalation of problems back on the station was handled quite convincingly, although the EarthForce guy was unnecessarily rude. I found it notable that Sinclair’s authority was ratified by Prez Santiago: <span class="spoiler"><font class="small">Spoiler:</font><hr /><span>considering Santiago’s death in “Chrysalis” and the succession of the rather dodgy VP, I’m wondering if this is going to impact on B5 in the future.</span><hr /></span> Sinclair proves himself to be a good leader once again: checking to see who’s really supposed to be in charge, looking out for his station at all costs but supporting Pierce when he has to.
There were some really good character pieces in this ep. Londo, as always, is brilliant: his scene with Garibaldi makes me laugh out loud, as did his “landing thrusters” question. This definitely highlights Londo’s lovable side, not to mention his nostalgia for the days when he used to do brave things. I didn’t entirely understand his motives for going down to the planet OTHER than that powerful need to recapture that sense of adventure: Delenn is no doubt a competent pilot and I’m sure they all knew that Draal was the one who really wanted to stay in the machine. As for Draal: really good. I hear that JMS is extremely influenced by Tolkien: this seemed really evident in the character of Draal, yearning for the sea and beckoned onwards by the road.
Because I’ve taken on G’Kar as my character to comment on: despite his lack of presence in this episode, Delenn’s comment about him (angry rather than unreasonable) was intriguing and rather insightful, as always for her. As for Delenn: the whole “third principle of sentient life” and the fact that it’s part of the basic training for a (religious?) Minbari … well, it was beautiful. Her idea that without hope for a better world, “evolution is highly overrated”, seems to me to be the basis upon which B5 and Trek both work, and what a lot of sci-fi strives for. We get more exposition about Minbar in this episode too: their world is showing signs of dissatisfaction, losing its way.
The Mars colony plotline is interesting, though could have been expanded on more: I suppose that the other plot took precedence. Garibaldi’s search for his former girlfriend gives it a narrative thread, but the plot twist was a bit predictable from the moment she appeared onscreen. The callous attitude of the guy in the bar re: “Marsies” was a bit overplayed but nonetheless, interesting and dare I say topical, again. The readiness for violence on both sides seems to expand on a running theme in B5: of intolerance and ignorance, exactly what the station is there to counteract.
It has a kind of hypnotic effect!Have just watched A Voice in the Wilderness parts 1 & 2, so will try to post on them tonight!
~~~
EDIT for the comments on this week's eps.
Legacies
A very interesting episode, especially for getting to know the Minbari just a little better. So far, we’ve seen them as peaceful people, yet we know there was a huge and terrible war between Earth and Minbar: it doesn’t really make sense. Now, we get to see the warrior caste (<span class="spoiler"><font class="small">Spoiler:</font><hr /><span>even though have heard there’s more than two castes…?</span><hr /></span>). Neroon’s militarism and abrasive nature make it all a bit more understandable. Of course, he is still a Minbari: he still puts a strong emphasis on tradition and respect, and obeys Delenn when he has to. John Vickery is pretty good – he has a real presence. (I couldn’t get over the fact that Gul Rusot was in this episode, though!)
My only problem with this ep was Delenn’s behaviour. It seemed out-of-character. Completely understand that she would want to give Bremer the religious funeral he wanted – but she really did make it hard for Sinclair, and endangered the station. It was only natural that the humans would be blamed and have to investigate, too – so I’m not sure why she didn’t just get it over with and tell Neroon what she’d done a little earlier. Still – this ep made the rift between the castes a lot more visible, and it’s surely gonna come back later! Surely!
The subplot (which again neatly ties in to the main plot with Alisa’s discovery) was alright, too. It was a little “convenient” that the mindburst happened just near Talia, but the ensuing battle of wills was really interesting and did highlight both sides of the issue well. Na’Toth’s brief cameo was a classic (“good idea about the teeth”), and Alisa’s final decision was surprising.
Anyway … as for the “little moments” in every ep, the moments that stand out …Once again, wanna hand it to O’Hare. The moment, at the very beginning, where the Minbari ship comes through the jumpgate and he flashes back to the Battle of the Line, again … his expression when he comes back to the present was just great, really subtle. Also – great to see the Pak’Mara! The concept and design are very cool! <span class="spoiler"><font class="small">Spoiler:</font><hr /><span>Although … is it true that there’s a Crusade ep called “Who’s My Little Pak’Mara?” If so – wtf??</span><hr /></span>
A Voice In The Wilderness (both parts)
I really liked this two-parter. It’s great that the planet they’re “parked next to” turns out to be important (from what I gather from Draal’s final statement, in the future it will play a crucial role)! And the Mars story that runs concurrently is quite shocking, in a way: the first real eruption of trouble amongst all the ominous signs.
The geological surveying team allow for a couple of great Ivanova moments (“Ivanova is God” and her lack of enthusiasm for a death in pursuit of science): I like the fact that against all precedent, they don’t die! As for Epsilon 3 itself: there’s something about it that really is evocative. Maybe it’s the titular “voice in the wilderness” – this barren planet with all this incredible machinery just chugging along with no known purpose as of yet, and one guy hooked up to it all, keeping it running. Something about that person, in a kind of crucifixion pose in the heart of the machine, was really striking. The alien design was good too: he had a very solemn look. And the special effects for Epsilon 3 and the space battle (whoa! B5 was actually hit!) were really good: not just for their quality but also for the sense of atmosphere they had.
The escalation of problems back on the station was handled quite convincingly, although the EarthForce guy was unnecessarily rude. I found it notable that Sinclair’s authority was ratified by Prez Santiago: <span class="spoiler"><font class="small">Spoiler:</font><hr /><span>considering Santiago’s death in “Chrysalis” and the succession of the rather dodgy VP, I’m wondering if this is going to impact on B5 in the future.</span><hr /></span> Sinclair proves himself to be a good leader once again: checking to see who’s really supposed to be in charge, looking out for his station at all costs but supporting Pierce when he has to.
There were some really good character pieces in this ep. Londo, as always, is brilliant: his scene with Garibaldi makes me laugh out loud, as did his “landing thrusters” question. This definitely highlights Londo’s lovable side, not to mention his nostalgia for the days when he used to do brave things. I didn’t entirely understand his motives for going down to the planet OTHER than that powerful need to recapture that sense of adventure: Delenn is no doubt a competent pilot and I’m sure they all knew that Draal was the one who really wanted to stay in the machine. As for Draal: really good. I hear that JMS is extremely influenced by Tolkien: this seemed really evident in the character of Draal, yearning for the sea and beckoned onwards by the road.
Because I’ve taken on G’Kar as my character to comment on: despite his lack of presence in this episode, Delenn’s comment about him (angry rather than unreasonable) was intriguing and rather insightful, as always for her. As for Delenn: the whole “third principle of sentient life” and the fact that it’s part of the basic training for a (religious?) Minbari … well, it was beautiful. Her idea that without hope for a better world, “evolution is highly overrated”, seems to me to be the basis upon which B5 and Trek both work, and what a lot of sci-fi strives for. We get more exposition about Minbar in this episode too: their world is showing signs of dissatisfaction, losing its way.
The Mars colony plotline is interesting, though could have been expanded on more: I suppose that the other plot took precedence. Garibaldi’s search for his former girlfriend gives it a narrative thread, but the plot twist was a bit predictable from the moment she appeared onscreen. The callous attitude of the guy in the bar re: “Marsies” was a bit overplayed but nonetheless, interesting and dare I say topical, again. The readiness for violence on both sides seems to expand on a running theme in B5: of intolerance and ignorance, exactly what the station is there to counteract.
Andreas' passing certainly made watching this show sobering--his acting was powerful and he commanded attention when he was on screen. It's really sad he chose to smoke and thus cut his life tragically short.
"Legacies"--I like much of this episode, but I hate the acting of the girl who played Alisa. She was painful to watch at times. This episode did a great job of revealing much about the Minbari, how there is still bad blood between the warrior and religious castes about the end of the war with the humans. I agree that Delenn's behavior did seem a bit out of character. She sacrifices much to be on B5; I find it hard to believe she would risk its safety over a disagreement with the warrior caste. Lastly, I'm growing weary with the Ivanova vs. the PsiCorp plotline. A solid episode overall.
"Voice in the Wilderness"--Great two-parter. A few highlights:
--The Mars/Earth conflict brings B5 closer to home and forces Garibaldi and others to face the prejudice of others.
--Draal forshadows much: Caste conflict for one
--I love the irony of Londo saying, "I go to spread happiness . . ." It's great watching Londo be a hero and having fun, but sad knowing what's to come.
--Epsilon 3 provides a wonderful mystery, and opportunity for great B5 command vs. the military conflict. I love how on every show the second there is the promise of great advancement of technology or science the military swoops in to take over. A bit cliche, but it's done well here.
--One nitpick: the connection to the Epsilon 3 super machine is really cheesy. Here, just stick your arms in among these random hoses and things and then you're set.
--I had a "wow" moment when it's pointed out that there are a half a million people on B5.
--"Worst case of testosterone poisoning I've ever seen."
Great line. Claudia delivers these lines so well.
I so enjoyed this two-parter that I couldn't help but finish the season. I'll hold my comments on the last three for next week, but damn it's going to be hard waiting a week and a half to start season two!
Edited to add another review.
"Legacies"--I like much of this episode, but I hate the acting of the girl who played Alisa. She was painful to watch at times. This episode did a great job of revealing much about the Minbari, how there is still bad blood between the warrior and religious castes about the end of the war with the humans. I agree that Delenn's behavior did seem a bit out of character. She sacrifices much to be on B5; I find it hard to believe she would risk its safety over a disagreement with the warrior caste. Lastly, I'm growing weary with the Ivanova vs. the PsiCorp plotline. A solid episode overall.
"Voice in the Wilderness"--Great two-parter. A few highlights:
--The Mars/Earth conflict brings B5 closer to home and forces Garibaldi and others to face the prejudice of others.
--Draal forshadows much: Caste conflict for one
--I love the irony of Londo saying, "I go to spread happiness . . ." It's great watching Londo be a hero and having fun, but sad knowing what's to come.
--Epsilon 3 provides a wonderful mystery, and opportunity for great B5 command vs. the military conflict. I love how on every show the second there is the promise of great advancement of technology or science the military swoops in to take over. A bit cliche, but it's done well here.
--One nitpick: the connection to the Epsilon 3 super machine is really cheesy. Here, just stick your arms in among these random hoses and things and then you're set.
--I had a "wow" moment when it's pointed out that there are a half a million people on B5.
--"Worst case of testosterone poisoning I've ever seen."
Great line. Claudia delivers these lines so well.I so enjoyed this two-parter that I couldn't help but finish the season. I'll hold my comments on the last three for next week, but damn it's going to be hard waiting a week and a half to start season two!
Edited to add another review.
I agree that the Mars Rebellion isn't played up as much as it might be in "Voice".
The event is referenced several times later on in the show; but each time they talk about the "Mars Rebellion", I have to stop and say, "Oh yeah, we actually saw some of that." Obviously, that shouldn't happen; I should know instantly what I have and have not seen.
The event is referenced several times later on in the show; but each time they talk about the "Mars Rebellion", I have to stop and say, "Oh yeah, we actually saw some of that." Obviously, that shouldn't happen; I should know instantly what I have and have not seen.
lEGACIES The first appearance of Neroon and we learn more about the minbari here and the bad blood between the religious and warriors,the teep story was okay but the woman portraying ALisa was lame .Seeing Talia and Ivanova go at it was a treat.
A voice in the wilderness The Mars conflict was great but it doesn't quite stretch over two eps .The Epislon 3 provided a mystery that adds .Draal had an interesting intro.
A voice in the wilderness The Mars conflict was great but it doesn't quite stretch over two eps .The Epislon 3 provided a mystery that adds .Draal had an interesting intro.
Given that Llanita is the only newbie doing in-depth reviews, and she's moving ahead of where we are "officially" already----which will probably increase as the series picks up the pace----I recommend we move to four eps per week starting with season 2.
NO WAY three eps a week is more than enough.
Hey, I have also been watching B5 again. Watched it a long time ago and have forgotten most of it. Noticed you guys were watching it too. It has so far given me a different impression than I remember. Especially the first few episodes of Season two (I'm a little ahead). I liked season 1 for the most part but so far season two eps have been pretty hard to watch. Sorry hope I don't discourage anyone buts the truth for me at least. Anyway I see you guys are at Legacies and Voice in the wilderness so......
Legacies was good. I liked the Minbarie uniforms and liked the asshole attitude the warrior cast had in contrast to Delenn. Liked the Minbarie ship too, whats it called again? Was hoping it would blow B5 out of the sky (every time I see Minbarie ships actually) but I know that’s not going to happen.
I thought Delenn was biyach though. Hiding the truth all that time and letting whats his name Minbarie warrior think it was the Humans who were fucking with him. They could have shown someone other than just the Minbarie pissed at her she deserved it.
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Voice in the wilderness was ok. I read in one of those links provided that they would find giant machines in the planet. I was disappointed, didn't care much for the Asimov looking world. I liked the conflict between Sheridan and the Earth Force ship capton. I would of thought that B5 would have had thrusters to move it if necessary. I guess I'm thinking DS9.
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I didn't think the girl's acting was that bad at least compared to the rest of B5 crew. They are given some tuff lines. And I thought ST Techno Babel was bad. I remember liking B5….
But so far I've noticed cheesy lines left and right. Humor that doesn’t appeal to me for the most part. Londo is one of the cheesiest of all but at least he is funny usually. I think god that’s corny but some how is able to pull off the lines.
Ivonava, her damn sarcasm is getting annoying. Does she have to comment on everything? But most of my hate is because I don't like her character I can't really say she’s a bad actress. Can't say that about most of the rest.
Legacies was good. I liked the Minbarie uniforms and liked the asshole attitude the warrior cast had in contrast to Delenn. Liked the Minbarie ship too, whats it called again? Was hoping it would blow B5 out of the sky (every time I see Minbarie ships actually) but I know that’s not going to happen.
I thought Delenn was biyach though. Hiding the truth all that time and letting whats his name Minbarie warrior think it was the Humans who were fucking with him. They could have shown someone other than just the Minbarie pissed at her she deserved it.
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Voice in the wilderness was ok. I read in one of those links provided that they would find giant machines in the planet. I was disappointed, didn't care much for the Asimov looking world. I liked the conflict between Sheridan and the Earth Force ship capton. I would of thought that B5 would have had thrusters to move it if necessary. I guess I'm thinking DS9
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I didn't think the girl's acting was that bad at least compared to the rest of B5 crew. They are given some tuff lines. And I thought ST Techno Babel was bad. I remember liking B5….
But so far I've noticed cheesy lines left and right. Humor that doesn’t appeal to me for the most part. Londo is one of the cheesiest of all but at least he is funny usually. I think god that’s corny but some how is able to pull off the lines.
Ivonava, her damn sarcasm is getting annoying. Does she have to comment on everything? But most of my hate is because I don't like her character I can't really say she’s a bad actress. Can't say that about most of the rest.
Posted by romulus:I would of thought that B5 would have had thrusters to move it if necessary. I guess I'm thinking DS9
It was established in "The Gathering" that B5 *does* have thrusters, but they're to help maintain position and rotation, not to actually move the station.
Wow, that's why I could never follow along with you guys. I'd be watching 3 eps a day.
^^ Definitely!! However, as long as we all come back and rewatch those three/four eps a week and then review, I see no reason why we can't individually be watching future eps. *she says, guiltily* S'long as we come back to the same page to review and discuss, the spirit of this thread should be fine!! :thumbsup:
TKO
This is a strange episode. It's equal parts "yawn/boring crap" with "ANGST!/Poor Susan!"
Following up with a long-forgotten thread, we find that Susan has not sat "Shiva" for her father, who died at the beginning of the season.
A family friend, Rabbi Koslov, has come to help her do just that. However, this close friend, known to Susan as "Uncle Yosef", does not understand why Susan hasn't done this yet. In typical Uncle Yosef fashion, he meddles. Susan eventually comes around and accepts her father's passing. She is now alone - her mother died as a result of the Psi Corps drugs; her father, we already saw pass away; her brother died in the Earth-Minbari war.
But is she really alone? As she sees the friends she has gathered to help her sit Shiva, she comes to realize she isn't alone at all.
In the other half of the episode, we've got a former prize fighter, an old friend of Garibaldi's, comes to the station to take part in the Mutai. It's extremely boring and dull and just doesn't work for me at all, so that's all I'm going to say about it.
This is a strange episode. It's equal parts "yawn/boring crap" with "ANGST!/Poor Susan!"
Following up with a long-forgotten thread, we find that Susan has not sat "Shiva" for her father, who died at the beginning of the season.
A family friend, Rabbi Koslov, has come to help her do just that. However, this close friend, known to Susan as "Uncle Yosef", does not understand why Susan hasn't done this yet. In typical Uncle Yosef fashion, he meddles. Susan eventually comes around and accepts her father's passing. She is now alone - her mother died as a result of the Psi Corps drugs; her father, we already saw pass away; her brother died in the Earth-Minbari war.
But is she really alone? As she sees the friends she has gathered to help her sit Shiva, she comes to realize she isn't alone at all.
In the other half of the episode, we've got a former prize fighter, an old friend of Garibaldi's, comes to the station to take part in the Mutai. It's extremely boring and dull and just doesn't work for me at all, so that's all I'm going to say about it.
While I'm thinking about it ... For those of you interested in learning more about sitting Shiva, I found this website. It has a lot of really useful information in an easy-to-understand format.
Grail was better than I remembered it being, for some reason.
David Warner, of Trek and Titanic fame, appears as a man who is either nuttier than a fruitcake, or an Honored Seeker. Or both, depending on your point of view. He is a man searching for the Holy Grail. He and his order have searched everywhere on Earth, and now he - the last of his order - is exploring the stars, looking for it.
He comes to Babylon 5 to meet with each of the Ambassadors. While on the station, he runs into a man nicknamed Jinxo, for his unfortunate history aboard the Babylon stations. In each previous station, he was working construction, and as soon as he left each one, they went boom or disappeared. Now, he is convinced he cannot leave B5, or it will have the same fate.
While not a great episode, it has its moments and is pretty good. 3/5
David Warner, of Trek and Titanic fame, appears as a man who is either nuttier than a fruitcake, or an Honored Seeker. Or both, depending on your point of view. He is a man searching for the Holy Grail. He and his order have searched everywhere on Earth, and now he - the last of his order - is exploring the stars, looking for it.
He comes to Babylon 5 to meet with each of the Ambassadors. While on the station, he runs into a man nicknamed Jinxo, for his unfortunate history aboard the Babylon stations. In each previous station, he was working construction, and as soon as he left each one, they went boom or disappeared. Now, he is convinced he cannot leave B5, or it will have the same fate.
While not a great episode, it has its moments and is pretty good. 3/5
If I'm not mistaken, the next three episodes finish up season one with a bang - Babylon Squared, Quality of Mercy and Chrysalis... Three very strong shows, and I happen to have a free afternoon...
I might just have to join the Niners-Fivers alliance.
I might just have to join the Niners-Fivers alliance.
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