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Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice...

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Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Well the more of this thread that I see, the more I love it!

As I have said before in other posts, I think it would be great if some of these ideas were applied to TOS, for the DVD releases. I realise that this would be incredibly expensive, but maybe for a few "special episodes."

Ah well, until then we have this thread. Keep up the Excellent work.
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Here's an updated version of the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay located beneath the Hangar Deck. In this shot the p.o.v. is the aft wall over the fantail and looking forward towards the ship's bow. The turntable/elevator in the immediate forground is right at the back of the room with sufficient space between the ceiling beams to pass upwards through to the flight deck. Forward of the elevator there is sufficient room for two shuttlecraft with one parked on each side of the entrance door.

This is, of course, presently incomplete as I plan to add alcoves or entries to repair/machinery rooms on either side as well as other detail and people. It isn't worth putting a shuttlecraft on the turntable in the foreground because that would effectively block the view of everything else in the room. There is a small error in this pic--there's an extra beam in the foreground of the ceiling for artistic reasons, but it really shouldn't be there sincethere are only supposed to be three beams accross the ceiling.

MaBay1.jpg
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Yes, what's the deal with the panelled floor? Previous floor was quite good IMHO...
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

^^ :lol:

That needs to be tweaked. Actually it's not panelled, but when I put the floor in and started to manipulate its shape that streaking effect came out. Weird.

OTH maybe I could ice it up and the crew could be having a hockey tournamount. :lol:
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Okay, folks, here's an update to the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay. I've added two worktables one of which has a desk intercom (barely noticeable) and the other has a desk viewer, two diagnostic consoles, air vents near the ceiling and doors leading to machine shops on either side of the bay.

MaBay2.jpg
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Excellent work! Where does the red center door lead to? Towards the front of the ship, such as a cooridor that leads to Engineering? Or towards the rear of the ship, to an airlock (with environment suits as seen in "Tholian Web")? Have you thought about submitting you work to Paramount Pictures (or Paramount Home Video) to bring these improved graphics to fruition? They would greatly enhance TOS episodes visually.

Navigator NCC 2120 USS Entente
=/\=
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

^^ Thanks for the compliment. Firstly, my rendering of the SMB is off in my opinion--something doesn't feel quite right yet. And also I cannot think of one place where this shot could be squeezed in. I'm not saying it's impossible but only that I cannot imagine where it could be slipped in even for a couple of seconds. The red door in the centre leads forward into the heart of the secondary hull and other engineering facilities.

Also, it's one thing to manipulate a few images, but it would be an endeavour of a completely different magnitude to augment TOS' F/X. I will admit that part of me would be intrigued at having a shot at enhancing one episode, but then I'd likely be butting heads with someone who'd want to make the F/X look like 21st century Trek while I'd be insisting on making whatever went in look absolutely seamless and consistent with the original artistry.
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Thanks for the clarification regarding the center red door as I now understand the orientation of the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay with respect to the rest of the ship. It seems to me that this room could be seen in any TOS episode involving shuttlecraft.

Such as:

1. "The Menagerie" - Kirk orders Scotty to beam him and Commodore Mendez aboard the Enterprise and store the Starbase 11 shuttlecraft in the Enterprise's Hangar Deck. I would have liked to see the shuttlecraft being tractor beamed into the Enterprise's Hangar Deck and then lowered into the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay.

2. "The Galileo 7" - Show the Columbia Shuttlecraft in the Shuttle Maintenance Bay rising to the Flight Deck and launching from there.

3. "Metamorphosis" - Show CGI Kirk, Spock and McCoy leaving the Flight Deck and have the shuttlecraft lowered into the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay.

4. "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield" - Show the stolen Starbase Shuttlecraft lowered into the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay after Lokai has left the Flight Deck.

5. "The Way to Eden" - Show Dr. Sevrin and his followers enter the Shuttle Maintenance Bay, board the Galileo II Shuttlecraft via CGI. Raise the shuttlecraft to the Flight Deck and take off.

You are right it would be a massive endeavor in visually enhancing all of TOS episodes. However, someday, maybe 5 years or so you or someone as skilled as you will use computer software to visually enhance TOS episodes and post them on the internet for all of us to enjoy. Hope springs eternal.

Navigator NCC 2120 USS Entente
=/\=
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Warped9: You say you have a list of scenes already, but are you perhaps entertaining suggestions for scenes?
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

I have a list of scenes, but this is time consuming to do and I can only work so fast. :) Also I'm not really doing thm in any particular order, but I will get around to everything I have in mind.

Okay, I've done a little work here to get a better idea of what things could look like. Firstly I'm starting from Phil's idea of scaling the TOS E filming miniature up to a more credible 1/96 scale. Mind you some of this may still be off, but please bear with me. Upscaing makes the ship roughly 14% larger meaning perhps a roughly similar increase in size for the Hangar Deck area. I've taken the drawings from TMoST as a rough basis and upscaled them 14% while keeping the human figure in the drawings the same. I then upscaled the shuttlecraft about 40% to more closely reflect what Phil and FourMadMen are trying to do to get a more believeable shuttlecraft. I then added on my interpretation of the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay to get some idea of size and available space. The layout is based on my little photo manipulation job posted earlier upthread.

Take a look and tell me what you think. The first image are the original drawings reproduced from TMoST. The second image is my rescaled rendering...

MJ_Hangar3b.jpg

MJ_Hangar3a.jpg
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Something is going on with my web host. Hope it clears up... :confused:
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

^ Its photobucket.com, right.

All the forums i have viewed that use photobucket are having problems. Even in TOS forum on this bbs.
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Posted by Classic Fan:
^ Its photobucket.com, right.

All the forums i have viewed that use photobucket are having problems. Even in TOS forum on this bbs.

If you can recommend a better web host then I'm listening... :)
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

I have no trouble what so ever with this host. Its the host i use to post all my stuff on, including about 12 avatars.

I used to use villagephotos, but theyre shit.

I dont know what most other people use, best thing to do is search for different image hosts.
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

Posted by Warped9:
I have a list of scenes, but this is time consuming to do and I can only work so fast. :) Also I'm not really doing thm in any particular order, but I will get around to everything I have in mind.

Okay, I've done a little work here to get a better idea of what things could look like. Firstly I'm starting from Phil's idea of scaling the TOS E filming miniature up to a more credible 1/96 scale. Mind you some of this may still be off, but please bear with me. Upscaing makes the ship roughly 14% larger meaning perhps a roughly similar increase in size for the Hangar Deck area. I've taken the drawings from TMoST as a rough basis and upscaled them 14% while keeping the human figure in the drawings the same. I then upscaled the shuttlecraft about 40% to more closely reflect what Phil and FourMadMen are trying to do to get a more believeable shuttlecraft. I then added on my interpretation of the Shuttlecraft Maintenance Bay to get some idea of size and available space. The layout is based on my little photo manipulation job posted earlier upthread.

Take a look and tell me what you think. The first image are the original drawings reproduced from TMoST. The second image is my rescaled rendering...

MJ_Hangar3b.jpg

MJ_Hangar3a.jpg

Question: Have you taken into account that the side view of the hangar deck is of the forced perspective miniature set?
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

^^ Yes, I noticed that. This was just an exercise in trying to get a lay of the land so to speak. My real question is: who am I to believe has the best schematics of the Hangar Deck? Reasonable chematics of the E herself are now available from at least three sources--Alan Sinclair being one, cannot at the moment recall the other fellows name (starts with a "C" I believe) and of course from CRA. How far can one now trust what FJ did as we've seen he diverged quite a bit from what we actually saw in many things. His shuttlecraft really bears only superficial resemblance to what we've seen onscreen as well as in comparison to the excellent renderings done by Phil Broad and FourMadMen.

A lot is made of Matt Jeffries' original intentions, but the best intentions can be compromised when they butt up against the realities of tv production. And then sometimes the realities necessitate better solutions and/or rationalizations.

The original filming miniature was to have been at 1/48 scale until GR decided they wanted a bigger ship and crew. But the idea that the filming miniature represents a very awkward and unwieldy 1/84 some scale doesn't work very well. Far better and more logical that the scale was simply doubled to 1/96 and then you have a very reasonable and spacious ship of 1080' l.o.a. And the beauty is that that figure cannot be contested anywhere onscreen since the ship's size was never stated at any time. But it does beg the question: where did MJ come up with that 947' figure? We know that drawings of the ship at around that time (as seen in TMoST0 were not accurate or consistent with the filming miniature (to be kind). We've also discovered that the early Phase II drawings are not very consistent with the TOS E. As was said elsewhere before, it is almost as if MJ couldn't redraw his own ship and just decided to fudge it(!).

Anyway, the gist of it is to first decide how big the ship "really" is--947' or 1080'--and then discern how much available space there is for the Flight Deck, Maintenance Bay and whatever sized shuttlecraft.

Note, CRA, that a larger ship facilitates many things such as allowing more credibly for some of the sized interiors we saw onscreen, a more credibly sized shuttlecraft, and of course a forward facing bridge.

Here's a copy of comparison I did. The smaller represents the ship at 947'. The larger image shows it 14% larger at 1080'. You can easily see the appreciable increase in size and available space overall.

SizeComp.jpg
 
Re: Never seen TOS scenes, but would've been nice.

^ Yeah, I've been following that discussion on Hobby Talk, and I am very sorely tempted to do some revising.

Unfortunately, in light of where my deck plans are aimed (Pocket Books), I may be stuck with the 947' figure, simply because so much of the material that they've put out regarding the ol' girl is in line with that figure. Plus, it's so deeply engrained in everyone's psyche that trying to dump it at this late date would be difficult at best.

Solving that bridge problem would be nice, though...
 
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