My thoughts on DS9

[JirinPanthosa]

I didn't like Kira when I watched it when I was younger but later when I rewatched the show and just saw fiction differently she became my favorite character.

I agree Bajoran episodes tend to be dull, but that's mostly because all the Bajoran males are terrible, not because of Kira. I thought Progress was a good episode. A lot of the early Kira episodes were about her healing herself from the trench mentality of fighting in the Occupation, and I think that's one of the stronger periods of her character.

I didn't have any problem with later seasons having episodes that weren't in the war arc, but the thing about those episodes is that they're really badly written. You have the cartoony Take Me Out To The Holosuite and Bada-Bing, then you have Ezri helm a bad CSI episode. Also most of the non-war S7 episodes were about the crew's weird fetishization of 1940's lounge music.

I think TNG season 6 is way better than the early DS9 seasons, but it's true S7 had way too many stinkers.

 

[2takesfrakes]

Heresy!!!

I don't think there's anything I don't love about TNG's interior designs. The engine room was the most kick ass room of all though IMO.

DS9's design hasn't really grown on me at all. I think the station outside is this hideous spider looking thing, and inside looks like some neon Tokyo/Blade Runner inspired sets. I let it slide because it's supposed to be "alien" (Cardassian design)

"Z" and Mike Okuda depended entirely too much on those damn LCARS!!! Drove me nuts how every computer, no matter what planet you're on, what ship you visit or house you're in, everything uses it - enough with the LCARS!!! And Deep Space Nine the station itself - is, surprisingly, not very well executed. It looks like a model kit from a hobby shop. It's not an interesting visual to me, at all. It's almost as hateful as that bulbous top they call Space Dock, starting with Search for Spock.

Herman Zimmerman is not untalented or unlikable. He's just not a visionary, as far as Interior Designers go. He lucked out having one cool idea that solved one show's design problem and would not stray from it - it got BORING!!!

 

[2takesfrakes]

I find DS9's set the more intriguing and dynamic than TNG's Winnebago beige look.

The Next Generation looks classy and elegant. The Enterprise, especially, looks sumptuous. It's lavishly appointed and doesn't scream "high tech," the way some sci-fi shows have a tendency to do. And the "D" looks very sleek and futuristic, without being an incredibly "busy" looking CGI nightmare, as later Enterprise vessels became. My only complaint about the "D," really, was the warp core. Neon rings encased in frosted plastic blinking up ... blinking down ... oooh ... power ...!!! Hateful, "Z" ... just hateful.

 

[dub]

Heresy!!!

I don't think there's anything I don't love about TNG's interior designs. The engine room was the most kick ass room of all though IMO.

DS9's design hasn't really grown on me at all. I think the station outside is this hideous spider looking thing, and inside looks like some neon Tokyo/Blade Runner inspired sets. I let it slide because it's supposed to be "alien" (Cardassian design)

"Z" and Mike Okuda depended entirely too much on those damn LCARS!!! Drove me nuts how every computer, no matter what planet you're on, what ship you visit or house you're in, everything uses it - enough with the LCARS!!! And Deep Space Nine the station itself - is, surprisingly, not very well executed. It looks like a model kit from a hobby shop. It's not an interesting visual to me, at all. It's almost as hateful as that bulbous top they call Space Dock, starting with Search for Spock.

Herman Zimmerman is not untalented or unlikable. He's just not a visionary, as far as Interior Designers go. He lucked out having one cool idea that solved one show's design problem and would not stray from it - it got BORING!!!

Can't say I agree with any of this. I thought the design of DS9 was beautiful and dark. A perfect fit for the show. I also loved the interiors. The only thing I didn't care for was the computer display design. And I absolutely love Spacedock. My first reaction when I saw it in TSFS was "wow!"

I do agree with your later post that the Enterprise D looks better and is more memorable and unique than the over-designed E.

 

[2takesfrakes]

I do agree with your later post that the Enterprise D looks better and is more memorable and unique than the over-designed E.

At least we can agree on something ...

 

[GalaxyX]

Heresy!!!

I don't think there's anything I don't love about TNG's interior designs. The engine room was the most kick ass room of all though IMO.

DS9's design hasn't really grown on me at all. I think the station outside is this hideous spider looking thing, and inside looks like some neon Tokyo/Blade Runner inspired sets. I let it slide because it's supposed to be "alien" (Cardassian design)

"Z" and Mike Okuda depended entirely too much on those damn LCARS!!! Drove me nuts how every computer, no matter what planet you're on, what ship you visit or house you're in, everything uses it - enough with the LCARS!!! And Deep Space Nine the station itself - is, surprisingly, not very well executed. It looks like a model kit from a hobby shop. It's not an interesting visual to me, at all. It's almost as hateful as that bulbous top they call Space Dock, starting with Search for Spock.

Herman Zimmerman is not untalented or unlikable. He's just not a visionary, as far as Interior Designers go. He lucked out having one cool idea that solved one show's design problem and would not stray from it - it got BORING!!!

Can't say I agree with any of this. I thought the design of DS9 was beautiful and dark. A perfect fit for the show. I also loved the interiors. The only thing I didn't care for was the computer display design. And I absolutely love Spacedock. My first reaction when I saw it in TSFS was "wow!"

I do agree with your later post that the Enterprise D looks better and is more memorable and unique than the over-designed E.

Even though Spacedock is just a big giant mushroom, I can't help to love it, it is a super structure of engineering, and truly helps to show just how Advanced the Federation is.

DS9 on the other hand is kinda lame looking. I understand the Cardassian tech is supposed to be behind the Federation's, but still, outside it's butt ugly.

The interior looks like what I would expect a Mall inside of Blade Runner to look like. I don't "hate" it, but it's kinda generic.

Enterprise D is a beauty! especially with the upgraded 3rd Nacelle and Mega mondo phaser cannon. THAT'S the ship I wanted to see on the big screen!

Enterprise E is this hideous looking insect like thing. The Nacelles reming me of a praying mantis. Godawful design!

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I always think that DS9 has the most interesting visual look of all the series', because it is so alien and different. The uniformity straight lines of Starfleet design is a little dull after a while, I find.

 

[borgboy]

I agree I like the very alien design of DS9. It brings a lot of atmosphere to the series, giving a darker, edgy backdrop to the more complicated and characters. I also see it as a constant visual reminder of the Cardassians and the atrocities they committed on the Bajoran people.

 

[I am not Spock]

The great thing for me about Kira's character development was that she begins the series despising everything Cardassian. As the show progresses, we see her develop a friendship and caring for Ziyal (almost like a surrogate mother figure), and she ends up fighting alongside the Cardasssian rebels in the final arc.

 

[Data girl]

DS9 characters had the most depth and layers compared to the other shows.

 

[GalaxyX]

Well I'm now in the middle of season 3, and while I like the show a lot more than I did originally, I still don't think it's more layered than other series.

What more detail and "layers" there are in the show were simply a offshoot benefit of the series being able to do things as an arc. But TNG and even Voyager had very similar arcs, and did keep continuity almost as well, even if they were more limited.

The actual series is decent, but you Niners actually hurt it by deifying it compared to other Trek series.

 

[drmick]

The layers really come from season 4 onwards though.

If I'm recommending DS9 to newbies today, I recommend starting with either season 4, or potentially partway through season 3.

 

[dub]

The actual series is decent, but you Niners actually hurt it by deifying it compared to other Trek series.

Well, I love DS9 and I do not apologize for sounding off about its awesomeness in a DS9 forum! You love it or you don't. Same for any other show. To each his own. The show is not hurt by individual opinions. Like any other work, it speaks for itself.

 

[DonIago]

I'm a little curious as to how we could "hurt" the show in any case. It hasn't been on the air for quite some time now.

 

[garaks the best]

Well I'm now in the middle of season 3, and while I like the show a lot more than I did originally, I still don't think it's more layered than other series.

What more detail and "layers" there are in the show were simply a offshoot benefit of the series being able to do things as an arc. But TNG and even Voyager had very similar arcs, and did keep continuity almost as well, even if they were more limited.

The actual series is decent, but you Niners actually hurt it by deifying it compared to other Trek series.

I think it the best trek series by a mile and don't see whats wrong with expressing that, also if some people are so petty to deliberately dislike something because it's fans love it the best well it's says more about them to be honest.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

^I also don't think it is simply a matter of expressing that DS9 is better, but that it was different from all other Trek series (at least until the last seasons of Enterprise).

 

[DonIago]

That would be a great slogan though- DS9: It's just better.

 

[Tosk]

I am unapologetic in my love for DS9. I am one episode from finishing yet another rewatch right now and if anything I love it more than last time.

That said, I think that DS9 is what it is because of what came before. DS9 benefits from TNG (and obviously TOS) building up a universe to play in.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I love DS9, but I think the people who say it's way better than all the others just because it's darker, more serialized and anti-Roddenberrian have the annoying habit of being belligerent about their personal preferences and deluding themselves into feeling said preferences are super-objective.

 

[Tosk]

I don't recall anyone claiming objectivity on those specific matters. Are you sure you're not just being subjective yourself?