most disappointing Trek movie?

[fireproof78]

What is the most prolific things fans were saying after 2009?
"Will Khan be in the next movie?" - "Who should play reboot Khan?" - "I hope they don't put Khan in the next movie"

Indeed. Fans treat Khan as the top shelf level villain, TWOK as the best film, and people are surprised that Hollywood would return to that well?

Maybe Marc Cushman will do a history of the making of the JJ's and we can find out why they went all Khan on us.

Well, the simple answer is that the writers, including Damon Lindelöf, wanted Khan for the beginning, and worked on a way to include Khan in a story that made sense. So they wrote up the draft and look to see that story would work with another villain in that place. Then they agreed that Khan worked and went from there.

 

[Falconer]

I am not surprised they used Khan, nor do I think it was a bad idea. They were copying the Nolan Batman trilogy. Origin, then big villain.

I just wish they would have pulled it off better.

 

[plynch]

Good point. Y'know I'd have almost no prob without that reactor scene and the yell. If we had lingered and had more.reaction to kirk's being gone, it wo uld have been good. I mean WE know he's coming back, but his pals don't (hence Spock's yell). Kinda like how they did w Ariam. I could feel the loss through others'. It all felt perfunctory in the movie.

I think I don't have a prob with magic blood, in light of warp drive and artificial gravity.

 

[fireproof78]

I will agree that the pacing of the films does not allow for time to breathe in the big emotional moments. I don't mind them, because I feel the loss through others, and their reactions but having more time to breathe would have been nice.

And Spock's yell, if it hadn't been Khan's name, would have been better. That deep, unbridled, rage reflecting Sarek's warning from the last film. It is very interesting way to explore the Spock character, showing that he can loose control and it will be destructive.

 

[suarezguy]

Indeed. Fans treat Khan as the top shelf level villain, TWOK as the best film, and people are surprised that Hollywood would return to that well?

The fans were also very hostile to Nemesis for trying too hard to have The Next Khan and otherwise be like TWoK.

 

[Vger23]

I used to hate his death line, which is, "It was fun," more or less. Now, I think, yeah, that's what Trek was, fun. I need to watch the JJ films again. CBS Trek is mighty serious and portentious, and I might appreciate the JJs more now. They were so loud. Like physically loud. I am not of this culture, sigh. But they did try to be fun, I think.

In fairness, a lot of Star Trek comes off as "mighty serious and pretentious." It's not a phenomenon limited to CBS Trek, by a long shot.

That's why I actually like TFF. It's a space episode with goofy shit, a God alien, love between the characters . . . trying to make a philosophic point about the human condition . . . it's very TOS to me.

100% agree. For all its faults, TFF is as close to the original series the film franchise ever got. I love it for that.

 

[fireproof78]

In fairness, a lot of Star Trek comes off as "mighty serious and pretentious." It's not a phenomenon limited to CBS Trek, by a long shot.

Indeed. I think TNG and TMP in particular fit that bill but it definitely comes across in Trek in all forms.

 

[BillJ]

In fairness, a lot of Star Trek comes off as "mighty serious and pretentious." It's not a phenomenon limited to CBS Trek, by a long shot.

I think that is the thing I miss most about TOS, the ability to wrap fun and adventure into the mix.

 

[Vger23]

I think that is the thing I miss most about TOS, the ability to wrap fun and adventure into the mix.

TOS had the balance perfectly figured out. The overall story could be very serious, but they found a way to infuse fun and charm without pulling you out of the drama. It was, admittedly, a pretty unique magic.

 

[Lord Garth]

Stretching slightly out of bounds, but it would've been the first TOS movie, had it been made. The more I hear about The God Thing, the more disappointed I am. I would've loved to imagine it was this masterpiece Gene Roddenberry wrote that Paramount shot down because it was too good, too controversial for them.

Instead, every time I hear more about the story details, I think, "Yup. Paramount was right to turn it down. They didn't make a mistake."

 

[Admiral Archer]

Nemesis is my pick, as I had been wanting my whole life to see a Star Trek film in the theaters. When I finally got the chance, Nemesis was the film I got to see first.

You can imagine how that went down.

 

[Oddish]

Nemesis. Not only was it a meh movie, but we FINALLY get to see Data up for the job he's deserved to have for years.

And then... yeah, you know what happens.

 

[Admiral Archer]

Nemesis. Not only was it a meh movie, but we FINALLY get to see Data up for the job he's deserved to have for years.

And then... yeah, you know what happens.

Actually he deserved to be Captain. But at least he would have been on his way up if things had gone differently.

 

[Vger23]

Data's death never bothered me in the slightest. Fans seem to get all wrapped around the axle regarding that type of thing.

Spock didn't bother me, Kirk, Jadzia, etc.

It's just part of the story.

 

[Falconer]

Wash, though, that one stung.

 

[fireproof78]

Fans seem to get all wrapped around the axle regarding that type of thing.

The only thing that bothers me is when people go "X character deserved better." Like, I get not liking a death but characters don't deserve one thing or another. Either it worked in the story or it didn't.

 

[BillJ]

Stretching slightly out of bounds, but it would've been the first TOS movie, had it been made. The more I hear about The God Thing, the more disappointed I am. I would've loved to imagine it was this masterpiece Gene Roddenberry wrote that Paramount shot down because it was too good, too controversial for them.

Instead, every time I hear more about the story details, I think, "Yup. Paramount was right to turn it down. They didn't make a mistake."

After seeing the string of pilots he was involved in, in the 70’s, I’m surprised he was let anywhere near Star Trek again.

 

[ChallengerHK]

After seeing the string of pilots he was involved in, in the 70’s, I’m surprised he was let anywhere near Star Trek again.

Having watched and listened to him work crowds on a few occasions, I chalk this up to Roddenberry's cult of personality. He was very good at telling them the rights things to get them worked up and supporting him. He would be introduced in cons as "The Great Bird of the Galaxy," of all things.

I have no doubt that there was at least an unspoken, if not explicitly spoken statement to the effect that "They follow me. If you want them to see the movie, it will have to be made by me."

 

[Lord Garth]

Having watched and listened to him work crowds on a few occasions, I chalk this up to Roddenberry's cult of personality. He was very good at telling them the rights things to get them worked up and supporting him. He would be introduced in cons as "The Great Bird of the Galaxy," of all things.

I have no doubt that there was at least an unspoken, if not explicitly spoken statement to the effect that "They follow me. If you want them to see the movie, it will have to be made by me."

Speaks volumes about how good TWOK is, given how well it was received, even though it was the first Star Trek production where Gene Roddenberry took a back seat involuntarily.

If he really wanted to stick to his guns, he shouldn't have accepted the Executive Consultant position or any pay from TWOK-TUC. They couldn't make Star Trek without him, so Executive Consultant was their way to play the system and work around him. He could've played hardball, slammed the breaks, and refused to even be an "Executive Consultant". But he went with the money and said the right things in public or kept quiet.

 

[ChallengerHK]

Speaks volumes about how good TWOK is, given how well it was received, even though it was the first Star Trek production where Gene Roddenberry took a back seat involuntarily.

If he really wanted to stick to his guns, he shouldn't have accepted the Executive Consultant position or any pay from TWOK-TUC. They couldn't make Star Trek without him, so Executive Consultant was their way to play the system and work around him. He could've played hardball, slammed the breaks, and refused to even be an "Executive Consultant". But he went with the money and said the right things in public or kept quiet.

Agreed. I think, though, that he had been told for TWOK, "We're making a movie, with you or without you." From a practical standpoint, he did the best thing, whatever people think of the decision or of TWOK. Like you say, he got paid, essentially for doing nothing.