Menagerie, re-mastered on the Big Screen

[22 Stars]

RAMA said:

klingongoat said:

RAMA said:

22 Stars said:

Electric Coleslaw said:

RAMA said:
OK I've read several posts on here, that state: "laughter at the expected places", and laughter when Spock yells "the women!". OK why did people laugh at that? I don't get it! He's simply stating the obvious fact that only the two women were taken, and not the 4 men of the landing party.

RAMA

For me it's a combination of knowing the sexist attitudes of the 1960's and the fact that it's our supposedly non-emotion Spock getting upset because they took the babes!

I agree, how can anyone not react to that line? It's such a short, overy emoted (esp. for our non-emotional Mr. Spock)declaration/exclamation, and it does seem a bit dated and sexist in some wierd way.... Why would he yell, and why wouldn't he yell, Commander since the first officer and acting captain just got snatched?

Okayyy...let's pretend you have a transporter, and you are beaming 6 people down to a planet....well normally ALL who are intending to go down usually make it, but in this case, you know its wrong that only two people--both women--beam down and you don't. Wouldn't you be surprised?

RAMA

I don't know if the line gets laughs from the theater audience because A.) most people have seen the episode 375 times, B.) the line IS sexist, in a 60's kind of way, or 3.) Spock shouting on the big screen makes it even bigger than life.

How about if Spock let out a loud "WHAT?, the F**K!!".

OK name WHY it is sexist?

What is the quickest description of the two kidnapped landing party members in a moment of surprise? If there were 4 women and two men instead, would you describe them as anything else?

Oy, ok, I understand your point, but I don't think you are listening to spirit of the other posters replies. Yes, you could argue that in less than a second, Spock sized up the situation, recognized that the two crewmembers who were beamed were 'THE WOMEN'! lol, but that doesn't take away from the fact that the line, in the dramatic context of the show comes off as funny, possibly sexist like 'Oh no, they took THE WOMEN, how will they ever manage on thier own, because they are ONLY WOMEN, and we are MEN, there to PROTECT THEM, THE WOMEN are in trouble.... get it?

Also, even though Spock is not emotionless in The Cage, he is by the time Menagerie comes around, and the stark contrast is.... laughable? It's just a big change, get it? I sure hope so.

 

[22 Stars]

ssosmcin said:

RAMA said:

OK name WHY it is sexist?

What is the quickest description of the two kidnapped landing party members in a moment of surprise? If there were 4 women and two men instead, would you describe them as anything else?

It was not written to be sexist and I'm sure in 1964, it wasn't sexist. And it obviously wasn't an intended laugh line. But it is dated and and a laugh line intoday's society.

Look at it like this. Substitute "the women" with any one of these:
"the negroes!"
"the Asians!"
"the Mexicans!"
"the cripple!"
"the retard!"

What it does, as stated in an above post, is classify them by gender. Really, seriously, if this happened to you, would you really shout "the women!" Or would you say something like: "Leutenant! Yeoman!" or "they're gone!" Or even "what happened?" since, not for anything, only the gals did what was intended, which was to beam down. The panic shouldn't have been that they beamed out, but that the other 4 did not.

It's also kind of humorous because, even though THIS Spock was not unemotional, the character in most of the rest of the episodes and movies is. Looking at it that way, our unemotional Spock suddenly screams "the women!" like he's upset his last chance to get laid just vanished.

This all reminds me of talking with some fans at conventions and most of us would pick something to make fun of in an episode and one guy would always say "um, that wasn't meant as a joke, you have to take it in context," etc. That guy always spoiled our fun. But we hung out with him anyway, because he was cool and big as a house and could beat us all up.

Sorry, didn't see this.... What ^he^ said.

 

[Matt]

It sort of looked like the effects were redone, but kept the same. It was HD.

I should ask for a refund. My screen was NOT HD and this was advertised as HD.

 

[Ronald Held]

All I will say is that Spock's emotional control was not as good as by WNMHGB.

 

[The Old Mixer]

ssosmcin said:
Look at it like this. Substitute "the women" with any one of these:
"the negroes!"
"the Asians!"
"the Mexicans!"
"the cripple!"
"the retard!"

I'm afraid that if you have to have a joke like this explained to you, you're never going to get it. It's a bit of cheese that tickles a lot of funny-bones, and that's that.

 

[Kegek]

Spock is a logical man. He immediately concluded that the one thing the two persons who disappeared had in common which the three persons who did not disappear had was gender, and thus deduced that gender had something to do with why they were beamed down.

And, of course, Spock was right. He's just that precise.

You want sexism, go watch the original "The Cage". Pike is furious that he's got a female yeoman, he doesn't want any women on his bridge!

Number One is offended. He placates her: "You're different, of course." Still not amused.

 

[Garibaldi O'brien]

Hey it was the 2260's...

 

[Matt]

Number One was an android, probably.

1. Numerous references to her being very scientific, computational, prompt, correct, knowledgeable.

2. References to her being the most experienced on the ship.

3. Her name and only name is NUMBER ONE, a very robotic sounding name, not necessarily indicative of her place in the command chain, like Commander Riker's nickname implies.

I think she's an android.

 

[Lord Garth]

I thought the 13th would be my only chance to catch The Menagerie in the theater but there was an encore today. I just got back.

Unusual watching 4:3 in a cinema, but the experience was just as I remembered it. A tear came down my cheek at the end when Pike realizes why Vina wants to stay.

Great experience. There were maybe nine people there, I think. Different demographics too. No uniforms or any of the other stuff some of you might've been expecting, sorry. Just normal people.

All, in all, not bad. Nice preview for the second season on HDVD at the end, and the back-to-back credits for Parts I & II were a nice twist.

 

[Lord Garth]

Double post.

 

[Harvey]

Well, just got back from the screening tonight. Generally, I was pleased, but I can't say I was 100% happy with the experience. Whiny complaints:

(1) The new effects just don't look that great on the big screen. Maybe it was the projector (was it HD? Was it SD? I can't be sure, since it was so dark)

(2) A little expensive. 13.50 when it was all said and done...and not a poster, a coupon, and hardly any extra features that we hadn't already seen online for free

(3) The end credits... they should have put part one's credits at the end of part one. Playing both end credits sequences at the end was just awkward.

Otherwise, Shatner and co. on the big screen. What's not to like? I think the Pike/Boyce scene in Pike's cabin is one of my favorite scenes of television ever made. And Vina's feet aren't painted green. You'd never notice. Cool beans.

 

[FalTorPan]

I watched "The Menagerie" earlier today, and I was blown away by the crisp visuals. It's almost as if the episode were made last week rather than 40 years ago.

This was indeed a pricey infomercial, but unlike most infomercials, this was made a very convincing sales pitch.

Great stuff.

 

[Pensive]

I just got back from the encore screening - I noticed a few things people mentioned up-thread: Shatner's hairpiece line, Pike's tear, etc. Thankfully there were a few more people in the theater tonight, many of them under 25.

Also got to meet Nightfall to-Ennien

 

[Kryton]

RAMA said:

Electric Coleslaw said:

RAMA said:
OK I've read several posts on here, that state: "laughter at the expected places", and laughter when Spock yells "the women!". OK why did people laugh at that? I don't get it! He's simply stating the obvious fact that only the two women were taken, and not the 4 men of the landing party.

RAMA

For me it's a combination of knowing the sexist attitudes of the 1960's and the fact that it's our supposedly non-emotion Spock getting upset because they took the babes!

Well this is incorrect...Spock was not emotionless in the "Cage", Number One was. Spock was alien but emotionless was not part of his description. And I honestly don't think in this particular case, that the line was sexist. So really, I still don't understand the reaction. Some of the other laughter I understood.

RAMA

This is a salient point...when NBC insisted it was either the pointy-eared alien or the uppity woman officer, Roddenberry folded them both into the same first officer. It's pretty obvious to anyone with 1/3 a brain.

 

[thollian]

I got to say, I had a great experience watching the episode on the big screen, the video was really clear and not dark, and there was surround sound for me. I saw it at a Regal Cinema's in San Antonio....

 

[Maurice]

Please. Roddenberry's later assertions aside, there was nothing unemotional about Number One in "The Cage".

 

[Matt]

She looks perturbed and sad the whole time, because she's constantly being ripped on.

 

[CaptainStoner]

I saw it Tuesday in a theater packed to the gills. There was one lone soldier, a somewhat roundish fellow in a blue TOS shirt, standing around some folding tables in the entrance with some kind of propaganda laid out.
It was fun to see. It almost seemed the Cage bits looked even sharper than the later Kirk era footage, but very nice, and the ship of course looks fantastic - I would say the best compliment for the new Enterprise shots is that they almost look non-CGI.
And yes Spock's "The women!!!" got one of the biggest rounds of snickers, of course. The place was full of cheesy snickers, I mean we are talking about Star Trek here. Ass-headed aliens stealing women to breed with their captives, this is serious original cheese of the highest caliber. All ass-headed aliens to follow are pasty, lumpy imitations. Hail to the Bird.

 

[Mike Have-Not]

Just got back from watching both the 7:30 AND 10:30 screenings (had friends with different schedules, so decided to see it with all of them!) in Emeryville, CA.

It was fun! There were a few people in costume (there's something strange about seeing a woman in a 23rd century Lt. uniform smoking a cigarette...)

My nitpicks. The image onscreen was blurry. And WAY, WAY, WAY too dark. If I were at home, I would have jumped up and adjusted the brightness (all the way up), contrast (all the way up), and color (a little bit down).

Otherwise it was cool!

 

[FalTorPan]

CaptainStoner said:
And yes Spock's "The women!!!" got one of the biggest rounds of snickers, of course. The place was full of cheesy snickers, I mean we are talking about Star Trek here. Ass-headed aliens stealing women to breed with their captives, this is serious original cheese of the highest caliber. All ass-headed aliens to follow are pasty, lumpy imitations. Hail to the Bird.

Fortunately there were few snickers when I watched the episode. TOS has plenty of snicker-worthy moments, but very few are to be found in "The Menagerie."