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Mass Effect 3

-Brett- said:
:confused: Wanting something isn't the same thing as thinking that it's owed to you.
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Of course it's not.

But there are many, many people who's reaction is not just "aww, I wanted this, but got that...". That would be the reaction of people who are disappointed.

There are people who felt they were owed a certain type of ending, and now that hasnt come, they are demanding DLC to "fix" the ending, they are saying how they will not buy Bioware again etc... That is a reaction of people who feel they are owed something.

There's nothing wrong with being disappointed in what we got, there is nothing wrong with wishing they would change it. But at the same time lets not pretend that no one, at all, is of the opinion that Bioware "owe" them.
 
^One might argue that Bioware owe it to themselves not to let what is otherwise one of their best games end like this. It's all subjective of course and to be honest whether certain parties are correct in their assertions that they are owed anything irrelevant, one way or the other. The fact is Bioware have already taken notice and have apparantly decided to do *something* to address it. What that something is, only time will tell.
 
Reverend,

I wasn't stating my position. I am stating the position that some in the gaming industry feel about this matter.

I agree with you 100%.
 
Well I gave the PC version of Galaxy at War at test run mostly just to make sure there weren't any issues with the PC version of the game.

I did better than I expected.
 
I don't know, I think he has a fair point. He's basically criticising the extreme lengths some fans have gone to. No argument here...and I'm firmly in the "did not like the ME3 endings" camp. A lot of people out there seriously lack perspective. That or the internet has a way of magnifying personalities and exaggerating opinions *way* out of proportion. Perhaps a little of both.
 
Well, this is also a man who claimed that Bioware's "caving in" and announcement of Ending DLC sets back gaming as an art form by "a decade."

If one decides to complain about over-reaction and starts said complaints with that, one's actions are the living embodiment of "made of stupid."

If someone has the moral and rational high ground, and decided to torpedo their argument with blatant trolling, that person earned the privilege to lose. This is what really pisses me off about Bob's attitude. He deliberately trolled gaming culture with the full understanding that he's doing so.

Not to win brownie points. Not to win popularity. Just because he can.

That is the reason he's earned the vitrol slung his way recently. Not because of his position, but because he's actually worked hard to frame his opinion to nullify every point he's ever made about gaming culture needing to "grow up".
 
You might want to watch this. He expresses his POV a little more explicitly and indepth than what you can gather from a random tweet.

I'm not saying I agree with everything the guy says, but I think his basic argument that the extreme backlash and sense of entitlement can only hurt the medium in the long run is a fair one. The real reason he's getting blasted is because a lot of people on the internet are kneejerk reactionaries who think he's saying "everyone who didn't like the ending are crybabies." He's not. He's saying the crybabies are being crybabies and that it not helpful to a medium currently struggling to be taken seriously.
 
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Wow, for someone who complained in the episode that he's soooooo busy with 4 web shows (actually 3, American Bob is more of a personal show that he's not actually PAID to make, and does not have a regular web schedule) that he can't bother to play any ME game, he did a damn good job filling an entire episode with potshots at low hanging fruit. I'll bet you 5 dollars it took him more time to throw his "story" scenes together than all the time he did "research" or writing.

Did he bother to mention that the very company that publishes and funds said games has a documented history of actively interfering and rushing projects before they can even pass alpha stage, which alone casts the defense of "storyteller's rights" into doubt when it's now more clear that Bioware's team was pushed aside by EA to rush the game into production before they could finish? Or how about the fact that key lore elements, and indeed the full content of the Collector's Edition are only available behind an additional pay-wall? Does be address ANYTHING beyond the topics that a 5 minute Google search would have brought up?

No. He's blatantly jumping on the "anti" bandwagon to make himself feel better about being only half-invested in modern gaming other than throwbacks to retro IPs. The reason people think they deserve something more is because they paid for content that EA only later decided to re-charge consumers for. The "ending" is actually the climax of stupid shit ME fans have put up with over three games, but for him to have learned that would take time away from Bob's weekends of bitching at Twitter trolls.

But that would be, oh how do I put this, adult of him?

God dammit Bob, you are capable of much better. It's really sad to watch someone who's earned your respect just out and admit he's bullshitting you.

Kind of like EA. Funny.
 
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^Again, you totally missed the point. What you just made is known as a straw man argument. He's not talking about the circumstances surrounding the controversy, or what did or did not influence the final product, he's *only* bemoaning the extreme and unwarranted actions of an intensely vocal minority and it's potential effects on the medium as a whole.
 
But those circumstances are part of the controversy. That's something Bob makes it a point to address about things he makes videos about. This is kind of a shocking departure from that.
 
^But none of that can justify some of the behaviour demonstrated by a lot of people over this, which is basically what he says. Indeed, he's very upfront about not being a huge fan or terribly well informed on the specifics. His position appears to be that it's irrelevant because what some people are doing crosses the line. As annoyed and disappointed as I was by the endings, I happen to agree with him on this point.

I don't care how much pressure EA put on Bioware, or how shady the whole day one DLC thing was. None of that makes it OK to personally hounding people involved with the game's development and filing complaints with government agencies or trading standards watchdogs over the ending of what is essentially a sodding 'choose your own adventure' book is pants-on-head grade bonkers. In this case, context is irrelevant.
 
Reverend said:
^But none of that can justify some of the behaviour demonstrated by a lot of people over this, which is basically what he says. Indeed, he's very upfront about not being a huge fan or terribly well informed on the specifics. His position appears to be that it's irrelevant because what some people are doing crosses the line. As annoyed and disappointed as I was by the endings, I happen to agree with him on this point.

I don't care how much pressure EA put on Bioware, or how shady the whole day one DLC thing was. None of that makes it OK to personally hounding people involved with the game's development and filing complaints with government agencies or trading standards watchdogs over the ending of what is essentially a sodding 'choose your own adventure' book is pants-on-head grade bonkers. In this case, context is irrelevant.
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You see, I agree with that. I just didn't get why Bob has to be a condescending dick to everyone about it.
 
I've been watching Bob's vlogs for a while now and I have to say he's *always* like that. It's just now you happen to find what you consider your position in direct opposition to what you perceive his position to be and it's stung.

But like I said, go back and look at what he says objectively and you'll see he's not attacking people who don't like the ending, or are complaining about it in a rational and reasonable way. He's complaining about the self entitled morons who're making us all look bad. And I think that's fair enough.
 
That's probably true, thought I honestly dont care for future ME3 or ME games atm, so it's not like I *want* anything.
 
I don't know anything about this Bob Chipman fellow, and I haven't watched the vlog in question, but I have to agree with Reverend. I'm very disappointed (and sometimes very annoyed) in the ME3 endings, but I think there are some fans who have taken things a bit too far in expressing their thoughts.

For a concrete example, I think the recent mailing of cupcakes to BioWare Edmonton is a much more "cute" expression than the FTC complaint, the fund-raising for Child's Play*, and the personal attacks on the BW staff via their forums, Twitter, and so on.

(* Fund-raising in and of itself is, of course, a good thing. But the way those fans organized essentially put the charity in the middle of the argument, and that was just plain wrong.)
 
I think what else is hurting this industry is that the game reviewers are not credible.

For example, Skyrim. Skyrim, when released, was a broken game, and should never have been released until the problems were fixed. We are now at the end of March. Since the game was released in November, there have been five patches to fix what should have been fixed before release. Game reviewers gave the game high ratings. I think that if this had been a game produced by a less well known name than Bethsaida that the critics would have torn the game apart.

The same goes for Mass Effect 3. The game is riddled with graphical errors, poor interface, and an ending that is terrible. If the game was rated more accurately, it wouldn't be getting the reviews it has received.

I feel that too often that game reviewers, for whatever reason, are far more forgiving of games than they should be. These same reviewers are attacking fans who are expressing their displeasure with the game. Independent and non-gaming industry media are rating the game more accurately and are offering detailed analysis of the game's flaws. This same level of scrutiny is lacking in the gaming industry which all too often rushes to the defense of the game developers and marginalizes the fans.

Frankly, I am getting very frustrated with paying money for a game that is broken. This is even worse with Mass Effect 3 since the game is clearly incomplete, and I will have to pay more money for the DLC which will complete the game..
 
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