Spoilers Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

[Jayson1]

I doubt it. Character is not popular enough. If they were going to add a few characters that are sort of well received but maybe not big names I think they would go with Ms Marvel or Kate Bishop. It is curious as to who the lineup will even be and who is still a Avenger. My lineup would be

1 Spiderman
2 Hulk
3 Thor
4 Doctor Strange
5 Wolverine
6 Kate Bishop
7 Ms Marvel
8 Ant Man
9 Shang Chi
10 Okoye

With a cameo from Deadpool.

 

[Mage]

I doubt it. Character is not popular enough. If they were going to add a few characters that are sort of well received but maybe not big names I think they would go with Ms Marvel or Kate Bishop. It is curious as to who the lineup will even be and who is still a Avenger. My lineup would be

1 Spiderman
2 Hulk
3 Thor
4 Doctor Strange
5 Wolverine
6 Kate Bishop
7 Ms Marvel
8 Ant Man
9 Shang Chi
10 Okoye

With a cameo from Deadpool.

Yeah.... Several of the characters from the first two Phases were considered as not popular back then. And here the fudge we are. We can talk about a character's popularity after the show. Maybe you'll be right, and maybe you won't.
I will freely admit, I did not take away a lot from the character in Black Panther 2, have only see that movie once though. I'll see what I think of the character when there's a show to judge.

EDIT: It's going to be either Sam or Captain Marvel that will head up the next team of Avengers.
And that has nothing to do with popularity or what fans dream about. It's in-universe logic. Sam is Cap right now, and considering the amount of work he as most likely done in between Falcon And The Winter Soldier and CA:BNW, he has more experience leading a team. Captain Marvel, with more of her memory restored, is also a logical choice to lead.
Spider-Man is, right now, a kid that does street level crime fighting. There is no way he'll head up the Avengers. No one even remembers him.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

I doubt it. Character is not popular enough.

Based on what metric?

 

[Moviefan2k4]

I am so far behind with the MCU, its not even funny. I have all the main films released on Blu-Ray, but the last one I watched was Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness. I haven't seen any of the current streaming shows, but I'm very excited about Daredevil: Born Again.

 

[Mage]

Based on what metric?

None, but personal feelings on the matter. As if often the case with people who make statements like these.

 

[Jayson1]

Based on what metric?

She was a secondary character introduced in one of their mid-level movies. The fact that they have not being heavily promoting the show pretty much shows how much expectations that have for it being a success. Generally I don't think I have heard anybody talk about how much they love the character like you do with some of the more popular ones.

As for Sam Wilson as Captain America. I did kind of forget about him. I think his role will be defined by how popular the new Captain America movie is. The other issue is the number of Avengers they feel the movie should have, and also the fact that with Sam Rogers gone and Tony Stark are not in the movie Your basically making your first Avengers movie without those two core characters and also your also trying to make the MCU recover from Phase 4. The movie needs more to promote than just Downey Jr as Doctor Doom.

I think they are going to try and load it up with it's very best and most popular characters and in case of Thor and Hulk you going want them because they are your last real connection to the first Avengers movie. It's really just a matter of picking your biggest heavy hitters to fill out the lineup. I wouldn't have put Wolverine in the lineup a few months ago but after the success of the new "Deadpool" movie I think they will for sure want him in it. Spiderman movies also make huge money and Spidey is maybe one your most popular characters so for sure he is a lock as well.

Another big question is who is the main lead. I think it will be Spiderman. In part due to his connection to Tony Stark and having him face someone who might be another version Tony Stark as the baddie I think makes sense.

 

[Mage]

Another big question is who is the main lead. I think it will be Spiderman. In part due to his connection to Tony Stark and having him face someone who might be another version Tony Stark as the baddie I think makes sense.

In-universe that literally makes no sense.
I know fans are 'it would be like, so totally awesome and cool if like, my favorite kid is like the MAN of the Avengers now'.
But they don't remember him anymore. Right now, all they ever heard of is this dude dressed like a spider fighting crime in a neighborhood.
"I think I should lead you."
"We don't even know you."
"Oh! Well, I nearly destroyed this universe because I messed up a spell Dr Strange did to fix my personal life, and afterwards I made him make sure no one knows who I am. But Tony like really liked me and made me an Avenger on a spaceship once."
"Oh yeah, no that makes sense. He leads us now, guys!"


Sam stopped a terrorist group, is working with the government as Captain America and has many years of combat experience. Carol is basically the strongest out there, works with Nick Fury and fights godknowswhat in space to safeguard lives through out the galaxy.

But sure, the unknown Spiderkid should lead.

I love Tom Holland's Spider-Man and the movies that featured his character. But again, in universe having him lead the Avengers makes no sense at all.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

My guess is they know it won't be a success so they are going to try and get out and forgotten as quick as possible. I bet every episode will be dropped on the same day like they did with "Echo." This show is something that was no doubt created when the people in charge were still in denial about how bad things were getting in the MCU. So they are stuck with it, while clearly putting more focus on the other stuff they got lined up. The fact that this show was even made is going to be news to lots of people, who even follow MCU news. Who even knew they even has a trailer at D23.

Or, and hear me out, there is a lot of post-production need for a show that involves iron suits and they're not ready to release any footage because they're taking their time. As a direct result to the massive backlash from the CGI community within Marvel and they're actually adjusting to those complaints.

Besides, we've known for awhile now that it won't be out until next year.

 

[Mage]

Or, and hear me out, there is a lot of post-production need for a show that involves iron suits and they're not ready to release any footage because they're taking their time. As a direct result to the massive backlash from the CGI community within Marvel and they're actually adjusting to those complaints.

Besides, we've known for awhile now that it won't be out until next year.

Very fair. The initial reactions to the 'Power Rangers' suit from BP2 was.... intense.

 

[Jayson1]

I don't think Spiderman would techincally be the leader of the Avengers so much he would be the main protagonist. I'm not even sure who would be the technical leader. Rhodey I think makes the most sense at taking over the Nick Fury role IMO. But I can already sort of see a movie were Spidey is the first to notice that this new villain on the scene is a Tony Stark variant or something weird because he looks just like him and thus he is the one that first warns the other Avengers. Also maybe he knows something that makes Doctor Doom target him and wants to kill him,

I mean their is a million ways the goal to make Spidey the main star. Of course their is also the idea that Doctor Doom is going to pretend like he is Tony Stark and he is here to save the world from a big threat. He has already killed Kang, But now something else worst is coming and only he can protect this earth. Spidey is to first to figure out he is a bad guy and he is the big threat to Earth.


How I would do it is the main thrust of the movie is Spidey and "Tony Stark" bonding. Spidey is feeling lonely since nobody knows who he is anymore and he has in essence gotten a father figure back. Only to be betrayed when "Tony Stark" is not Tony Stark or at least not like the one he knew. That would be the emotional core of the movie.

 

[Thestral]

You... want to remake Far From Home as an Avengers movie but mostly a Spider-Man movie again?

 

[Mage]

I don't think Spiderman would techincally be the leader of the Avengers so much he would be the main protagonist. I'm not even sure who would be the technical leader. Rhodey I think makes the most sense at taking over the Nick Fury role IMO. But I can already sort of see a movie were Spidey is the first to notice that this new villain on the scene is a Tony Stark variant or something weird because he looks just like him and thus he is the one that first warns the other Avengers. Also maybe he knows something that makes Doctor Doom target him and wants to kill him,

I mean their is a million ways the goal to make Spidey the main star. Of course their is also the idea that Doctor Doom is going to pretend like he is Tony Stark and he is here to save the world from a big threat. He has already killed Kang, But now something else worst is coming and only he can protect this earth. Spidey is to first to figure out he is a bad guy and he is the big threat to Earth.


How I would do it is the main thrust of the movie is Spidey and "Tony Stark" bonding. Spidey is feeling lonely since nobody knows who he is anymore and he has in essence gotten a father figure back. Only to be betrayed when "Tony Stark" is not Tony Stark or at least not like the one he knew. That would be the emotional core of the movie.

Avengers movies don't have a main protagonist. Never had. It's all about the team. It's like what @Thestral just said, it's a Spider-Man movie. And the next Spider-Man movie (if there is another one with Tom Holland) really needs to not be about him saving the world. Basically from day one, Spidey got thrown into some pretty big stuff. And he never learned the one thing that is at the core of Spider-Man. "With great power..."
This is literally what No Way Home was about. Him fucking around and finding out. He has great power himself, and knows a lot of people that do. Or well, he did. And he mis-used that power. He needs to be humble, he needs to learn how to use his power in small ways first. THAT's what the next Spider-Man should be about. Not him being the center of saving an interdimensional baddie.

 

[Grendelsbayne]

She was a secondary character introduced in one of their mid-level movies.

Wakanda Forever is one of the best movies in the mcu, it's their fourth most succesful movie since Endgame, it's arguably their best reviewed movie since Endgame (and pretty much indisputably in the top 4), and its financial/critical results match or exceed most mcu solo films, including every Thor movie and every Guardians movie.

It is not mid level in any way.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

The fact that they have not being heavily promoting the show pretty much shows how much expectations that have for it being a success.

What promotions are you comparing to? Agatha All Along which comes out next month yet saw its first teaser trailer only last month?

There's a LOT of personal bias into every one of these claims is all I'm reading.

 

[Jayson1]

Wakanda Forever is one of the best movies in the mcu, it's their fourth most succesful movie since Endgame, it's arguably their best reviewed movie since Endgame (and pretty much indisputably in the top 4), and its financial/critical results match or exceed most mcu solo films, including every Thor movie and every Guardians movie.

It is not mid level in any way.

It doesn't feel that way. The first movie was a cultural event. It also felt kind of empty due to the death of Chadwick. It also doesn't have what one could argue as the best villain in the MCU in Killmonger. Also it is a post Endgame movie that was happening at time when MCU fatigue was starting to really become a thing. I think the main reason it made money was because it was a sequel to such a iconic movie but that in itself doesn't make it iconic. I would argue they only had two movies that reached the levels of being a event movie and that would be Spiderman 4 and of course the Deadpool movie. The third one would not even be a movie but the show WandaVision.

 

[Mage]

I would argue they only had two movies that reached the levels of being a event movie and that would be Spiderman 4 and of course the Deadpool movie.

Typo with Spiderman 4 I assume?

 

[Jayson1]

What promotions are you comparing to? Agatha All Along which comes out next month yet saw its first teaser trailer only last month?

There's a LOT of personal bias into every one of these claims is all I'm reading.

I wouldn't say their is lots of buzz for that series as well. The good thing it has going was a good trailer. Right now the things with most buzz is Daredevil.Fantastic Four, Downey Jr returning for Avengers. But could anyone say these shows excited the fan base as much as the prospect of X-Men 97? Seems like half of the talk now is also built around bringing half of the cameo characters from Deadpool into other movies. Also Red Hulk. Everyone seems to love the idea of seeing Red Hulk. "Ironheart" to me feels like another "Echo." A show that people didn't really have a strong desire to see that ended coming and going and being forgotten quickly, Even with "Echo" it seems like the only thing people were interested in was seeing Kingpin again. I will say that if the show well made I do think you will see the character again like Echo if people didn't care about the character all that much in their first appearance then what are the chances they will start caring now?

 

[Jayson1]

Avengers movies don't have a main protagonist. Never had. It's all about the team. It's like what @Thestral just said, it's a Spider-Man movie. And the next Spider-Man movie (if there is another one with Tom Holland) really needs to not be about him saving the world. Basically from day one, Spidey got thrown into some pretty big stuff. And he never learned the one thing that is at the core of Spider-Man. "With great power..."
This is literally what No Way Home was about. Him fucking around and finding out. He has great power himself, and knows a lot of people that do. Or well, he did. And he mis-used that power. He needs to be humble, he needs to learn how to use his power in small ways first. THAT's what the next Spider-Man should be about. Not him being the center of saving an interdimensional baddie.

The movies do have lots of characters but the last two Avengers movie very much center around Tony Stark. Also it would not be "No Way Home." For one thing Spiderman is no longer a young boy. Plus everyone's memories have been wiped and they don't know him. He has no more friends or family. Also this Tony Stark is not really Tony Stark. The dynamic is different and what the other Avengers bring to the movie would also be different.

 

[Mage]

The movies do have lots of characters but the last two Avengers movie very much center around Tony Stark. Also it would not be "No Way Home." For one thing Spiderman is no longer a young boy. Plus everyone's memories have been wiped and they don't know him. He has no more friends or family. Also this Tony Stark is not really Tony Stark. The dynamic is different and what the other Avengers bring to the movie would also be different.

I'm sorry but no. No. The last two Avengers movies were not centered around Tony. Every had a lot to do in those movies. Thor, Cap, Widow. Friggin Clint lost his family and went on murderdeathkill spree around the globe.
I don't like sounding like this but @M'rk son of Mogh is absolutely correct. You are pushing way too much 'I feel this way so it's true' into this. You like Tony and Spidey. So your main focus in these movies is on them. A more 'take a step back' approach clearly shows a big ensemble movie.

Really, if there as every a 'Tony takes over the show movie' it was Civil War. Fans like to call it Avengers 2.5, but it was more like the Captain Iron America Man We're Not Really Sure movie.

 

[Jayson1]

I know the other Avengers had things to do. I don't disagree with that. Everyone had their moments. But I would say the heart of the movie is around Tony Stark's relationship with his daughter, getting to say goodbye to his dad and then making the big sacrifice at the end. With the Spidey movie it would be the same. Hulk and Thor could be doing buddy stuff together. Deadpool shows up and drops off Wolverine for the big final battle. Which would be a small part but also a movie highlight. Doctor Strange could take some of the team to Doctor Dooms world and basically go see Latveria. Kate Bishop and Ms Marvel would be friends and they are recruited into the fight. At the end this helps setup a future Young Avengers movie. Ant Man provides comic relief. At the end of the movie Doctor Doom has something of a army. Well so do the Avengers because they have Okoye in charge of the Dora Milaje.