Spoilers Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

[Saul]

Evans should play a villain like Downey is. Part of a team Doom has put together. I'd call it a Legion of Doom, but that's the other guys.

That was supposedly what Kang Dynasty was going to be about. Evil OG Avengers vs New Avengers. I guess Doomsday will follow a similar idea with Hydra Cap and Maestro Hulk.

 

[JoeZhang]

To be sure, but the second his Wilson received the shield instead of Bucky, the hostile reactions sprang to life, questioning both character and actor as if they were somehow "unfit" for the Captain America role, without specifying exactly why they held this suspiciously vague opinion. Then there's others who make it clear why they do not like Mackie in the role and why it "belongs" to Evans (ignoring what Evans once said about the part).

I'm not interested in the in-universe at that level, I just don't rate him and neither will Marvel after BNW bombs.

 

[Christopher]

Is that why they went back to reshoot CAP4 five times?

Reshoots are a normal part of big-budget filmmaking. Creation is always, always a process of trial, error, and revision, and any creator given the chance will keep on revising their work until it's released -- and sometimes afterward, as with directors' cuts and so forth. So when blockbuster filmmakers have vast amounts of money to throw around, it's no surprise that they'd go back and reshoot things -- especially since the Hollywood feature industry considers scripts an afterthought and thus often doesn't bother to get movies' stories in good shape before filming them.

So attempting to use reshoots as evidence that something has gone wrong with a film is deeply disingenuous.

Yes, he is a good actor, but he's not leading man material.

I have no idea why you think that. I would far rather see a movie led by Anthony Mackie than by, say, Jeremy Renner or Chris Pratt.

 

[Turtletrekker]

For the record, I don't think the idea that RDJ is playing Doom as a Stark variant is crazy, I just think it unlikely.

 

[theenglish]

Yes, he is a good actor, but he's not leading man material.

So which MCU actors who haven't had their own movie yet, are leading person material?

 

[CommanderTrip]

So which MCU actors who haven't had their own movie yet, are leading person material?

Technically, Mark Ruffalo as Hulk. Granted, he is an Avenger and was a big player in Thor: Ragnarok, he has not seen a single solo movie or series. Granted, this is largely due to the licensing/rights issues with Universal - they own the rights for solo Hulk movies similar to how Sony owns the rights to the Spiderman character.

My question is: When does Universal's rights expire? Follow up question would be do they not have a clause that they must make X amount of movies in Y amount of years using the Hulk characters or the rights revert back to Marvel? That being the case, IIRC the last Hulk movie we had was Edward Norton's Incredible Hulk, and that was 2009ish?

 

[Turtletrekker]

I'm pretty sure that Universal's distribution rights to the character expired on the same day that The Incredible Hulk showed up on Disney Plus.

 

[Turtletrekker]

I just saw someone make the interesting and very astute observation that when the Beyonder came to Earth in Secret Wars 2, the physical form that he chose was an exact physical duplicate of... Steve Rogers.

 

[JoeZhang]

I just saw someone make the interesting observation that when the Beyonder came to Earth in Secret Wars 2 the physical form that he chose was an exact physical duplicate of... Steve Rogers.

Yep - give him the dark perm !

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Is Mirror Spock the same character as Spock? Are Peter-1, 2, and 3 the same character? Is the Kal-El-turned-Soviet Superman from Red Son the same character as Clark Kent?

Did anyone observe obsession with the characters you named comparable to a certain part of the fanbase wanting RDJ to return as Stark? That kind of feeling did not exist for Mirror Spock, or any of the pre-Holland Spider-Men (at a time before there were no plans or hint that Maguire and Garfield would ever make a MCU appearance), et al. I do not believe its a stretch to suggest the calls for a return of Stark is more about a wish to see the characterization closer to prime Stark than some variant.

I know Sam and Bucky both became Captain America in the comics at different times but the issues is in the movies they were used as sidekicks to Steve Rogers

The point of Evans' final appearance was his reaching the point where he felt Sam was the natural inheritor to the Captain America position, which was explored in the streaming series. He's not a sidekick, and not viewed that way by anyone...with the exception of those who only see Captain America as their (not Marvel's) twisted ideal Blonde White Male Symbol of Might (one of the major issues of the streaming series, which addresses that extremist corner of MCU fandom).

The 4th Cap film will address some not accepting Sam because he's not a super soldier (Ross sort of tries to dress down Wilson about this in the trailer), but again, Sam--who flatly told Zemo he would not take the serum if it had been offered to him--proves himself, his ownership of the CA position, with no need for enhancements. If Sam's journey into a legitimate Captain America is not good enough for the extremist corner of MCU fandom (expected), then that is a problem they will need to swallow.


.

 

[Gaith]

Did anyone observe obsession with the characters you named comparable to a certain part of the fanbase wanting RDJ to return as Stark?

That wasn't the question I asked.

I'm personally neutral on Downey coming back to play Doom until I see the movie(s), but I do hope he'll be some kind go Tony Stark variant, even if in genes only, as I outlined above. (I'll keep an open mind, but I think it'd be much too weird if he were a Victor Von Doom whose identical appearance to Stark was purely coincidental.) And, if indeed he is a Tony-in-genes-only variant, I won't consider him to be the "same character" as the 616 Tony we all followed.


...

As for Sam, I like that he has no interest in taking a super soldier serum, but I think maybe one should have been forced on him somehow in the D+ series. That could have been an interesting reflection of real-world history, and been dramatically interesting. But, I still like Mackie and the character, and look forward to seeing Brave New World with an open mind.

 

[Jayson1]

Reshoots are a normal part of big-budget filmmaking. Creation is always, always a process of trial, error, and revision, and any creator given the chance will keep on revising their work until it's released -- and sometimes afterward, as with directors' cuts and so forth. So when blockbuster filmmakers have vast amounts of money to throw around, it's no surprise that they'd go back and reshoot things -- especially since the Hollywood feature industry considers scripts an afterthought and thus often doesn't bother to get movies' stories in good shape before filming them.

So attempting to use reshoots as evidence that something has gone wrong with a film is deeply disingenuous.




I have no idea why you think that. I would far rather see a movie led by Anthony Mackie than by, say, Jeremy Renner or Chris Pratt.

I think it's the number of reshoots that have happened in the new Captain America movie that has made people take notice. Most people know reshoots are common but the impression is they have almost gone about making a whole brand new movie. Plus watching the budget explode because of that. The trailer though has looked good but of course who knows about the final product. My bet is the movie is going to be mostly solid but also a little disjointed were the things seem to be missing that will bring the grade down on the movie overall.

 

[Set Harth]

Speaking as someone who's not exactly a Doom expert, could they get away with never showing his face?

 

[JD]

Yes, in the comics I don't think he ever shows his face. The only reason I think there's a good chance we'll see his face here is because they cast Downey, if they'd cast a less popular actor or someone known just for their voice, then I'd assume he was going to have his mask on the whole time.

 

[Christopher]

The only reason I think there's a good chance we'll see his face here is because they cast Downey, if they'd cast a less popular actor or someone known just for their voice, then I'd assume he was going to have his mask on the whole time.

We never saw Bradley Cooper's or Vin Diesel's faces in Guardians of the Galaxy, and they're pretty big stars. We never saw Josh Brolin's face as Thanos, just a digital face based on it. You can find lots of name actors these days doing voice-only or performance-capture roles in big-budget films.

And I'm 99.9% certain we've had this conversation already.

 

[Jayson1]

I don't think you cast Downey and not let us see his face. In fact I think people would feel cheated if his role was basically just providing the voice.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I don't think you cast Downey and not let us see his face. In fact I think people would feel cheated if his role was basically just providing the voice.

I'm cool with just the voice.

 

[Turtletrekker]

Doom's face is supposed to be hideously scarred. Even if we see the character without the mask, he still might not resemble RDJ in the slightest.

 

[JD]

Right I forgot about that.

We never saw Bradley Cooper's or Vin Diesel's faces in Guardians of the Galaxy, and they're pretty big stars. We never saw Josh Brolin's face as Thanos, just a digital face based on it. You can find lots of name actors these days doing voice-only or performance-capture roles in big-budget films.

And I'm 99.9% certain we've had this conversation already.

That's a fair point.
I have a pretty bad memory, so I don't remember having this conversation.
Marvel.com has posted a complete MCU timeline, including all of the Marvel One Shot shorts, and the individual seasons of all of the shows all the way up Agatha All Along, with the Netflix shows.
https://www.marvel.com/articles/movies/mcu-timeline-order-disney-plus

• Captain America: The First Avenger
• Marvel Studios One Shot: Agent Carter
• Captain Marvel
• Iron Man
• Iron Man 2
• The Incredible Hulk
• Marvel Studios One Shot: A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to Thor’s Hammer
• Thor
• Marvel Studios One Shot: The Consultant
• The Avengers
• Marvel Studios One Shot: Item 47
• Thor: The Dark World
• Iron Man 3
• Marvel Studios One Shot: All Hail the King
• Captain America: The Winter Soldier
• Guardians of the Galaxy
• Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2
• I Am Groot S1
• I Am Groot S2
• Daredevil S1
• Jessica Jones S1
• Avengers: Age of Ultron
• Ant-Man
• Daredevil S2
• Luke Cage S1
• Iron Fist S1
• The Defenders
• Captain America: Civil War
• Black Widow
• Black Panther
• Spider-Man: Homecoming
• The Punisher S1
• Doctor Strange
• Jessica Jones S2
• Luke Cage S2
• Iron Fist S2
• Daredevil S3
• Thor: Ragnarok
• The Punisher S2
• Jessica Jones S3
• Ant-Man and the Wasp
• Avengers: Infinity War
• Avengers: Endgame
• Loki S1
• What If…? S1
• WandaVision
• Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
• The Falcon and the Winter Soldier
• Spider-Man: Far From Home
• Eternals
• Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness
• Hawkeye
• Moon Knight
• Black Panther: Wakanda Forever
• Echo
• She-Hulk: Attorney at Law
• Ms. Marvel
• Thor: Love and Thunder
• Werewolf By Night
• The Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special
• Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania
• Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3
• Secret Invasion
• The Marvels
• Loki S2
• What If…? S2
• Deadpool & Wolverine
• Agatha All Along

It's also included under it's own entry on Disney+'s Marvel section.

 

[Turtletrekker]

^ It's not really that big of a deal, but I really wish that the timeline on Disney Plus itself separated the Netflix shows by season as well.