Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by bbjeg, Apr 6, 2014.

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What grade would you give the Marvel Cinematic Universe? (Ever-Changing Question)

  1. A+

    15.7%
  2. A

    40.4%
  3. A-

    13.5%
  4. B+

    5.6%
  5. B

    14.6%
  6. B-

    3.4%
  7. C+

    2.2%
  8. C

    3.4%
  9. C-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. D+

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. D

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  12. D-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. F

    1.1%
  1. Kemaiku

    Kemaiku Admiral Admiral

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    Especially when the metal is unremarkable in that it's just something formed in space like other heavy elements, just rarer.
     
  2. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    Here is an interesting idea. This thread was started waaaay back in Agents of SHIELD season one. Those of us who originally cast our vote only had the first 9 movies, an incomplete season of television and a trailer for GotG to base our votes on. Now that the MCU has completed the "Infinity Saga", does your vote still hold up in your mind?

    I am honestly going to drop my vote from A+ to A due to the later schism between the movies and TV (Oh, but the Winter Soldier era was so sweet, wasn't it?) and missed opportunities to introduce more diverse characters at earlier junctures. They waited until it was safe to do movies starring PoC and women, after Marvel movies were essentially guaranteed blockbuster hits, when they could've been more ground-breaking.

    Honestly, I almost went to A- due to the diversity factor, but didn't for two reasons-- First off, the whole saga has just been too much damn fun for me to be too harsh on it. Second, the OP instructs us to base our vote on both the TV and cinematic output, and the TV division has been more diverse. The Netflix shows featured a woman, black man and a physically handicapped man. Agents of SHIELD has two women of Asian descent as leads and the current director of SHIELD on the show is African-American. Cloak and Dagger has taken compelling looks at how black children are treated in society. Agent Carter unapologetically took on sexism. However, there is still work to be done.

    So, yeah, a little of the sheen and new car smell has worn away, but I still consider the MCU to be an amazing cinematic and story-telling achievement. How about you?
     
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  3. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    I thought I heard that the reason they didn't do it before was because Marvel Studios executive Ike Perlmutter (known for his right-wing political connections) was resisting it. Although I think he ended up in charge of the TV division after the split, and as you say, the TV division was more inclusive. So it's confusing.
     
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  4. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    If so

    Can Mark Hamill do a British accent? I know it doesn't really matter, but I'd like to get the accent right.
     
  5. OCD Geek

    OCD Geek Captain Captain

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    The really bizarre thing is that the lack of superhero movies based around women and people of color, and a similar lack on the action figure front, was due to Ike Perlmutter cheerfully preventing them before Bob Iger restructured the company (and cancelled the Inhumans movie that Feige and Iger offered in exchange for permission to make Black Panther and Captain Marvel). However, the TV division which is still stuck under Perlmutter crusty, shriveled fist has been leading the Marvel pack when it comes to diversity.

    My head-canon is that Perlmutter was so focused on getting his Inhumans project made ("The heroes are a bunch of empowered white people that force unempowered people to be their slaves. It'll be bigger than the X-Men!") that Jeph Loeb was left to his own devices on that front as long as the shows stayed cheap and on budget.
     
  6. Relayer1

    Relayer1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I've Stuck with A just because I'm still so engrossed in it all, despite Agents Of Shield falling back to it's background level of crushing mediocrity after briefly flickering into life with the Ghostrider arc.

    Endgame has been a fantastic climax to what we've seen so far, so I'm probably not at my most objective, but I enjoyed it as much as Winter Soldier, which I thought extremely unlikely.

    Probably not as good a movie, but as enjoyable. Excited for what comes next...

    Edit : Are we stuck with Perlmutter or is his position 'tenuous' ?
     
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  7. OCD Geek

    OCD Geek Captain Captain

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    Sadly, I'm pretty sure the comics and TV divisions are stuck with him until Satan comes to take him home.
     
  8. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I've heard Perlmutter as the reason for the lack of diversity in the movies for quite a while now. I didn't he was in charge of the TV division, guess there must be enough other pro-diversity people to counter his attitude.
     
  9. Relayer1

    Relayer1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Could be a while then...
     
  10. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    I mean, Perlmutter almost certainly cared about a budget and I did think the Inhumans would be a property he could use, but I find it very hard to believe he cared as much about them as people think. I suspect there are a lot of explanations, including a lack of ability to make X-Men movies, that factored into the push, but it's not like Perlmutter's some secret Jack Kirby fan that just really loved Black Bolt, Medusa, and Crystal.
     
  11. OCD Geek

    OCD Geek Captain Captain

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    Dude's 76, and up until Trump ran for president this was legit the only known photo of him. Maybe he's paranoid of doctors.
    [​IMG]
     
  12. kirk55555

    kirk55555 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I dropped from A+ to A because the MCU has had, in my opinion, a few complete flops, with Iron Fist and Inhumans all being pretty much irredeemably shit, and agents of SHIELD going full bigoted bullshit (everyone is a Nazi) and then leveling back out to worthless garbage. There is also Jessica Jones and The defenders being mediocre garbage at best, Daredevil Season 2 being mixed while Season 3 totally destroyed the character and Punisher and Luke Cage season 2 were extremely tedious. Movie wise, Ant-Man & The Wasp and Spider-Man Homecoming only avoid being the same level of worthless crap as IF and Inhumans because their main characters (Scott/Hope and Peter specifically) are good, even if those movies have basically nothing else going for them.

    But that said, I've never really counted the Netflix/TV shows problems as MCU problems, since that piece of shit Perlmutter is the biggest reason that the MCU TV stuff is shit, if he wasn't there then we'd probably get stuff that is more up to the quality of the movies. So, just holding SM: Homecoming and AM&TW against the MCU drops it by one level for me, but overall the MCU is still great and one of the bvest franchises out there, its just not quite as spectacular as it used to be. But, going from the equivalent of a 10/10 to a 9/10 isn't that big a deal, and I'm still a huge MCU fan.
     
  13. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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  14. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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  15. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Not so fast. Nuclear density ≠ average density of crystalline structure. Just because the nuclei would be larger than those of lighter elements, that in and of itself doesn't mean that they can't be spaced out more in the crystalline structure.
     
  16. jbny67

    jbny67 Captain Captain

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    Spoken like a true Star Trek fan
     
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  17. OCD Geek

    OCD Geek Captain Captain

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    It's nice being a Doctor Who fan.

    "Why is [insert continuity error here]."

    "A time war did it."

    "Which one?"

    "Alan Moore's."
     
  18. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Old-school Doctor Who fans didn't need explanations for the continuity errors. Because they were mostly children who understood that fiction is play, and so it doesn't have to make realistic sense. Also because they were too young to remember most of the things that got contradicted.

    Although it took the show only 14 months to get from "History cannot be changed -- not one line!" to "The Meddling Monk will change history if we don't stop him!" So it was more the "play" thing. For adults too, in a different sense of the word "play." I mentioned yesterday in another thread that maybe modern audiences are less forgiving of fictional imperfections because we're used to modern, realistic production values and high-definition images, so we're out of practice at suspending disbelief. 1960s Doctor Who audiences were watching something that was just one step removed from live theater, with stagey sets and obvious backdrops and flubbed lines and primitive visual effects. They had to exercise their own imaginations to meet the production in the middle, to look beyond the imperfections in the artifice to the substance of the story, and shrugging off continuity problems was just one more part of that process.
     
  19. Kemaiku

    Kemaiku Admiral Admiral

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    It would have to be a largely empty d or f field lattice system, but against Mjolnir, the more space there is to compress, the more I'd expect matter compressed by stellar collapse to shatter it.
     
  20. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Obviously fictional materials with impossible, fantastical properties would have to have those properties defined either by forces that are unknown to real science, or by known forces manifesting themselves in ways that are unknown to real science, or both. Another possibility that's been alluded to is some effect that masks inertial mass.

    Whatever the mechanism, a) it's fictitious, b) it's physically impossible, or else it would be possible to make the substance in the real world, and c) it's just one thing in a long list of physically impossible things, including Mjolnir, regarding which we are tasked to suspend disbelief. Accepting the Infinity Stones but drawing the line at Cap's shield would be completely ridiculous, for example.

    There's simply no way that one can attempt to rationalize how these things work that isn't going to run into something objectionable, or otherwise this stuff would be real.
     
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