Man or Machine

[RobertScorpio]

I was debating my friend about Kirk and Picard, as we often do. He keeps hammering me that Picard, or any of the Modern Captains, would destroy Kirk simply because TOS's Enterprise would be out gunned in any battle...and I agree. Kirk's Enterprise wouldn't stand a chance.

But, I also contend that Muhamid Ali would have destroyed ANY of today's boxers had he trained with today's equipment as well. The guy was just a very smart boxer, and got into the heads of the other fighters. Just as Kirk would....

If Kirk found any of the other modern Captains (sisko-picard-janeway) and they all had the same ship, I maintain that Kirk and company would when against the other four....

So what do you think?

Is it the man who makes the ship? Or the ship that makes the man??

Rob
Scorpio

 

[NiteTrek]

I was debating my friend about Kirk and Picard, as we often do. He keeps hammering me that Picard, or any of the Modern Captains, would destroy Kirk simply because TOS's Enterprise would be out gunned in any battle..

So what do you think?

Shatner would force the writers to come up with a way for Kirk to defeat all the other captains.

 

[RobertScorpio]

I was debating my friend about Kirk and Picard, as we often do. He keeps hammering me that Picard, or any of the Modern Captains, would destroy Kirk simply because TOS's Enterprise would be out gunned in any battle..

So what do you think?

Shatner would force the writers to come up with a way for Kirk to defeat all the other captains.

Or..he'd demand to play all the parts, including Janeway...but kirk would still win

Rob
scorpio

 

[A beaker full of death]

Kirk would send Data spiralling into an infinite loop, show Troi what a real man can do in the sheets and negotiate Picard's surrender within a matter of hours (minutes if he skipped Troi).

 

[Mistral]

Kirk would send Data spiralling into an infinite loop, show Troi what a real man can do in the sheets and negotiate Picard's surrender within a matter of hours (minutes if he skipped Troi).

Well, that cut this thread short.

 

[Mister_Atoz]

Picard's dialog in "Peak Performance" would seem to indicate that at that time Starfleet felt it was more important for their captains to be be diplomats and scholars rather than military commanders. The events of the episode seem to indicate a shift in that policy.

In Kirk's era however, StarFleet Captains seem a little more militaristic. Kirk's attitude towards the Gorn attack in 'Arena' for example, though certainly justified seems to be a "fire first and ask questions later" mentality. I would say then that Kirk would generally have an edge in military tactics.

If a peaceful solution was on the table all at all I would trust Picard to find it but if it came down to combat I think that Kirk would prevail all things being equal.

 

[CaptainStoner]

I think any of those battles could result in a win either way. I'd put some latinum on Picard since everyone stacks it that way.
One battle wouldn't tell you much. I think they would have to do a series. Plus you're also matching up other crewmembers. I think Kirk's ship would have one clear advantage with having Sulu on the helm. But then Picard's ship has Data. Sisko and Picard would have to flip a coin for Worf.

 

[asdf1]

I'd root for Picard, but only cos he's my favourite.

 

[Anwar]

Patrick Stewart said it best: Picard wouldn't let things get so bad they'd end up fighting to begin with.

 

[Chuckling]

Kirk would send Data spiralling into an infinite loop, show Troi what a real man can do in the sheets and negotiate Picard's surrender within a matter of hours (minutes if he skipped Troi).

Assuming Troi didn't read his mind first and make her own determination about what constitutes a real man before drop kicking him out the nearest airlock!

Chuckling

 

[Anwar]

Data isn't the type to fall for the stuff Kirk did to other robots. He'd just say "you are trying to form an infinite loop. Fascinating."

 

[Anthony Sabre]

There would be no battle if Kirk met Sisko. Before they could start fighting, Jadzia would start jabbering on about how one of her previous hosts had met Kirk and how much that host admired him and knew he would become a great captain one day.



I loved Jadzia but she was so predictable at times.

 

[Navaros]

Man or machine is a moot point because there is a third entity in the Trek universe which always reigns over both: plot contrivance. Plot contrivance dictates that anything or anyone that the writers want to win, will win, regardless of how little sense it makes or the technical capabilities of the ships involved, or the skills of the Captain.

 

[3D Master]

Kirk doesn't have a tactical maneuver named after him, Picard does, so he must have some tricks and tactics up his sleeve Kirk's never seen.

I'm guessing that even if Kirk won, it would be very, very, very close.

I maintain they are about equal in most things.

Patrick Stewart said it best: Picard wouldn't let things get so bad they'd end up fighting to begin with.

He would still participate in a friendly, simulation, mock battle!

 

[Forbin]

No, Kirk is just too smart to let his patented maneuvers become well known enough that his enemies will know what he's doing.

Knowledge of the Picard maneuver is what allowed Riker and Data to be able to counter it.

 

[Balthier the Great]

Well, Picard is a bit more of a wanker IMO, and would probably fall for just about any trick -- he'd fall for Carbomite most definately. He's a negotiator, not a fighter.

Janeway probably takes third overall. She's just as nieve as Picard in some ways, but she does have the ability to improvise solutions.

Sisko is a fighter almost to the degree of Kirk, but I think he's hampered a bit by being used to Defiant rather than a traditional ship. I think it would be close, however.

Kirk wins, because other than Sisko, he's the millitary guy.

 

[Tyberius]

Kirk doesn't have a tactical maneuver named after him, Picard does, so he must have some tricks and tactics up his sleeve Kirk's never seen.

Sure he does, it just results in a charge of sexual harassment

 

[RobertScorpio]

Kirk doesn't have a tactical maneuver named after him, Picard does, so he must have some tricks and tactics up his sleeve Kirk's never seen.

Sure he does, it just results in a charge of sexual harassment

Actually its called the "Picard gives up everyone's transponders and gets them all killed by the borg" maneuver...Traitor!

Rob
Scorpio

 

[Anwar]

He was given a direct order to stop Maxwell when he did that, and Maxwell was acting like a warmongering wacko too. So it was justified.

 

[Starhawk]

Having been a Trek fan since the beginning I am, and will always be of the belief that Captain James Tiberius Kirk would kick the butt of just about any of the other captains from the other series. Why? Mainly because I believe he was willing to do whatever it took, he would do it in the last way you would think he would (ie he was unpredictable) and lastly he trusted his crew implicitly. Additionally, he had the best Science Officer (Spock), Chief Engineer (Scotty). While his ship was not as advanced as the other vessels, however, not having the most advanced ship does not always mean they will win. Personally, I think the captain and crew make the ship function as one. Of the other captains I think Picard would give the best showing with Sisko coming in a close third. Janeway would have been trounced and Archer would have been outclassed.

Give Kirk a Galaxy or Ambassador class starship and god help any other captain and crew in Starfleet.