Luke Skywalker's Character Problem in Star Wars The Last Jedi

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Fandom does that, the movies don't.

I totally disagree. Luke stands love his nephew ready to kill him.. - They are trying to tell us that this is Luke we know, and if you don't agree that is your problem. Leia flying is space.. etc.. so much of this movie is trying to make us..accept some really stupid shit and if we don't than the filmmakers almost pat themselves on the back even more

 

[Campe]

I totally disagree. Luke stands love his nephew ready to kill him.. - They are trying to tell us that this is Luke we know, and if you don't agree that is your problem. Leia flying is space.. etc.. so much of this movie is trying to make us..accept some really stupid shit and if we don't than the filmmakers almost pat themselves on the back even more

You can choose to not accept it. It’s called moving on. You don’t like the movie. Fine. We’ve been through it a dozen times in the past few pages. The conversation is going in circles.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Aside form those issues, people don't seem to want to look at basic filmmaking and editing, and tone... TLJ screws the pooch on all of these things. Even more subtle things. Like at the end of TFA the Empire (I'll call them the Empire because the film doens't really build the world or tell us a difference) is about to use SUPERWEAPON to fire on the rebel base .. so that's why in the beginning of TLJ they just instantly find the planet within the first two minutes of the film and starts their attack. Technically it makes sense, because they knew where it was.. but it feels off. because moments like this are not built, they are not written,.. PJ has said that all the battles he did for LotR trilogy half of it is having the proper build up to the battle otherwise it means nothing. RJ has literally no understanding of pacing, tension, editing, etc

 

[Campe]

If it were as problematic as you suggest it is, they would have brought in someone to help. There is ample evidence to suggest if something isn’t working, Disney/LFL will call in an assist. In truth, there are aspects YOU don't like. You’re entitled to your opinion. Please stop treating said opinion as fact.

Thank you.

 

[jaime]

I mean, technically, by Hollywood accounting, ROTJ was reported to have continually lost money. I guess that film isn't successful either.

If Hollywood accountants had been involved, Midas would have lost money.

 

[jaime]

Fandom does that, the movies don't.

Star War? Sure. But only because Ridley Scott hasn’t had a crack at it. *eyes Prometheus sideways*

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

If it were as problematic as you suggest it is, they would have brought in someone to help. There is ample evidence to suggest if something isn’t working, Disney/LFL will call in an assist. In truth, there are aspects YOU don't like. You’re entitled to your opinion. Please stop treating said opinion as fact.

Thank you.

stating opinions as fact is all on the person reading it.. I can state that ice cream sucks. I don't have to state "in my opinion ice cream sucks" because the qualifier is not necessary. The whole point of an opinion in a forum like this is to state it frankly People shouldn't need the "it's only an opinion" qualifier

 

[fireproof78]

stating opinions as fact is all on the person reading it.. I can state that ice cream sucks. I don't have to state "in my opinion ice cream sucks" because the qualifier is not necessary. The whole point of an opinion in a forum like this is to state it frankly People shouldn't need the "it's only an opinion" qualifier

Declaring "No one likes Rey" or "people don't want to look at..." is stating opinion as fact. The qualifier is necessary because it is basically deciding to speak for fandom rather than speaking for oneself.

I do understand that people do not like TLJ. But, if I can sit with my wife and have her follow the films from beginning to end with no ancillary material then the film isn't as problematic as is being declared here.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

I see your point. I kind of disagree.. there is a nuance I cannot articulate .. but I respect that point!

 

[Campe]

I see your point. I kind of disagree.. there is a nuance I cannot articulate .. but I respect that point!

My opinion is that the problem comes that it’s difficult to pick up tone on the internet. It’s easy when you are face to face to suggest “no one likes Rey,” and have a specific emphasis but over the internet it becomes extremely literal.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

I agree with that completely

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Hyperbole is something I know I have to be more careful with here

 

[Campe]

Hyperbole is something I know I have to be more careful with here

Yeah, hyperbole and the internet don’t mix.

But being aware of the issue is a great first step. We could all be better communicating on the interwebs.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

i agree! I hadn't been on TrekBBS for years before a few months ago. It has been a while since I dealt with posting opinions on threads like this

 

[Mudd]

I rest my case when the most 'upboated 'comment here is someone using a terrible meme with the only """"argument"""" being "you are wrong".
The rewrite of the character not only doesn't make sense, even it had made sense, a neutral/almost evil "Resistance" makes the story pointless and banal.

In any case, their failure to top TFA and the re-hiring of Abrams speaks for itself.
Disney knows pretty well it was a total failure and it might be unsaveable now.

 

[Professor Zoom]

I totally disagree. Luke stands love his nephew ready to kill him.. -

??? "stands love?

They are trying to tell us that this is Luke we know, and if you don't agree that is your problem.

If I don't know what you're saying, I can't agree or disagree.

Leia flying is space.. etc.. so much of this movie is trying to make us..accept some really stupid shit and if we don't than the filmmakers almost pat themselves on the back even more

She wasn't flying in space. She was force pulling to the door.

Sorta like, untrained, Luke force pulled his saber to him in Empire, expect, you know, a ship has a much larger mass than a saber.

This isn't hard.

 

[fireproof78]

Sorta like, untrained, Luke force pulled his saber to him in Empire, expect, you know, a ship has a much larger mass than a saber.

Yeah, Force powers coming up like that is neither new nor offensive to the franchise. It's pretty much a part of the DNA. The audience had not seen a person use the Force to pull something to them until ESB.

As you state, this isn't that hard.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

btu she flew. It's called cinematic language
NERD VOICE: welllll.. technically she didn't fly because she pulled the weight toward this this angle blah blah blah."

Cinematic language is different.. you ask the majority of the audience what happened.. they will say she flew

Cinematic language is the same reason we accept sound in space for films like this, because it would feel "incomplete" and maybe not as cool without sound
Its the same reason when a spy uses a silencer on a gun it muffles the sound a lot (like the opening of Inception) because we accept it cinematically... but that isn't what silencers do.

Cinematic language is also a reason a reason the bombs dropping at the start of the TLJ doesn't work, even if Neil deGrass Tyson were to say that the momentum thing would determine that is exactly what would happen.. because too many people just see it as "you can't DROP bombs in space where there is no gravity". Accuracy is not always the hallmark or benchmark of what works in films

 

[Professor Zoom]

btu she flew. It's called cinematic language
NERD VOICE: welllll.. technically she didn't fly because she pulled the weight toward this this angle blah blah blah."

Cinematic language is different.. you ask the majority of the audience what happened.. they will say she flew

It's called You're Looking For Something to Complain About.

Cinematic language is the same reason we accept sound in space for films like this, because it would feel "incomplete" and maybe not as cool without sound
Its the same reason when a spy uses a silencer on a gun it muffles the sound a lot (like the opening of Inception) because we accept it cinematically... but that isn't what silencers do.

Cinematic language is also a reason a reason the bombs dropping at the start of the TLJ doesn't work, even if Neil deGrass Tyson were to say that the momentum thing would determine that is exactly what would happen.. because too many people just see it as "you can't DROP bombs in space where there is no gravity". Accuracy is not always the hallmark or benchmark of what works in films

Yep. That's why the Leia thing works for me. That's why the bombing run works for me.
The movie works for me. Watta ya gonna do?

Me and a whole bunch of other people liked The Last Jedi.

 

[Campe]

One thing to remember in all of this: Star Wars is not science fiction. It’s space fantasy. It starts off with you suspending belief about space wizards, FTL, moon sized super lasers that can destroy entire planets and laser swords. It’s very difficult for me to take any complaints seriously as it pertains to any sort of realism when it comes to this series.