I'd probably be pretty grumpy with that sort of crowd too. Thankfully we saw it at a small neighborhood theater that caters to a more mature audience rather than a metroplex. I think I saw one or two kids, everyone else was in their 20's and older.
Kylo Ren RUINED! [SPOILERS] HELP ME PLEASE
- Thread starter TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME
- Start date
I'd probably be pretty grumpy with that sort of crowd too. Thankfully we saw it at a small neighborhood theater that caters to a more mature audience rather than a metroplex. I think I saw one or two kids, everyone else was in their 20's and older.
This was exactly my thought as well...Kylo/Ben could be a faux badass being the only Force user among the regular officers/Stormtroopers but he was never trained enough to reach the level of a true Jedi/Sith...once he faced another Force user in Rey, he crumpled. Love love love the fact that he's not just a direct Vader substitute...and that he's not just BWAHAHAHA evil too...
Can't wait to see the parallel training sequences with Rey/Luke and Kylo/Snoke...
Hey, that's an interesting comparison. I hadn't considered that. And the Kenobi thing could be interesting as well. But how would they explain that? She's his granddaughter?
I don't know if I want to see a movie with both Rey and Ren training though. I liked that when we were introduced to Vader and Maul both were fully cooked, capable villains. It appeared that way with Ren at first, when he stopped that blaster bolt in mid-air-his most bad ass scene. And also when he showed some mastery of the Force when he used it to pull information from Dameron. But things started devolving when he used his lightsaber to trash that room in a tantrum. He didn't even strike down the guy who delivered the bad news. I mean come on, he's supposed to be Vader's grandson for goodness sakes. They are going to have to do more to up Ren's threat potential. He's the weakest dark side Force user-for a main character-in any of the films so far.
I thought the character was handled really well myself. Unlike whiny annoying Anakin in the prequels, Kylo actually came across as someone who was genuinely angry and tortured by a conflict within him-- which has made him both very unpredictable and incredibly dangerous as a result.
And he was also pretty damn fearsome in that final lightsaber battle as well, nearly killing Finn and Rey at several points despite having a hole blasted in his side.
Obviously he's not at the level of a Vader yet, but I can definitely see the potential there after some more training, and now that he's apparently vanquished the good side that was in him.
And he was also pretty damn fearsome in that final lightsaber battle as well, nearly killing Finn and Rey at several points despite having a hole blasted in his side.
Obviously he's not at the level of a Vader yet, but I can definitely see the potential there after some more training, and now that he's apparently vanquished the good side that was in him.
Anakin was removed from his mother and inducted into a cult at the age of 8. Then when he went back to find his mother it was to find her tortured and dying.
Kylo was raised by two loving parents.
Now I'm going to assume that Han Solo left both Kylo and Leia to go off and do cowboy things because Leia being a leader and all that was stifling his frontier ways. She says she sent him away to be trained, presumably Han had already taken off. Probably she didn't have enough time to give him the one on one attention he needed. Both Han and herself were very confident people, if he was socially challenged they may not have understood what his needs were since they did not relate to them personally.
Kylo was raised by two loving parents.
Now I'm going to assume that Han Solo left both Kylo and Leia to go off and do cowboy things because Leia being a leader and all that was stifling his frontier ways. She says she sent him away to be trained, presumably Han had already taken off. Probably she didn't have enough time to give him the one on one attention he needed. Both Han and herself were very confident people, if he was socially challenged they may not have understood what his needs were since they did not relate to them personally.
Hey thanks calling me a kid (at an advanced kid's age of 40)
I just don't like the character and especially the actor they've chosen. When he's unmasked and standing in front of Solo his "pained" expression just looks like he needs to go badly to the toilet or is struggling to push it out.. Driver was just the wrong actor for a weak role.
I get that he was wounded by Chewie and not at the top of his game but he goes up against two non-trained people while he has some experience even if not to the level of Darth Vader or any of the old, fully trained Jedi Knights.
The fight also suffered from generally weak writing as he's beaten by Rey who just half an hour ago suddenly learned to manipulate minds, can suddenly use Telekinesis (against someone who has shown to be pretty good at it in the beginning of the movie) and is now fighting with a Lightsabre as if she knows how and actually deals him a bad face wound (all this at a time where Jedi and the Force have passed on to myth status and there were probably no manuals lying around how to use the Force).
It all makes zero sense and presents him as weak and incompetent.
That's my view so please knock off insulting people that have a different view than yourself.
Actually from what I saw, Rey wasn't wielding the lightsaber in all that practiced or disciplined a way, and seemed to be relying more on anger or the Force than anything else.
In fact the impression I get was that Kylo hadn't really faced down anyone with the Force before, and was pretty much caught off guard and completely unprepared for how strong she was.
Whatever the case, I certainly didn't think it diminished his character or the threat that he could ultimately pose. And plus I really like the idea that Rey and Kylo will both be training harder in order to fight each other in the future, and that Kylo isn't already established as a major Vader-level villain from the get-go.
In fact the impression I get was that Kylo hadn't really faced down anyone with the Force before, and was pretty much caught off guard and completely unprepared for how strong she was.
Whatever the case, I certainly didn't think it diminished his character or the threat that he could ultimately pose. And plus I really like the idea that Rey and Kylo will both be training harder in order to fight each other in the future, and that Kylo isn't already established as a major Vader-level villain from the get-go.
Nope. Ren's turning to the Dark Side is what pushed them to break up. Han's way to cope was to return to his smuggling days and Leia's way to cope was to lead the Resistance.
It's slightly different, dear.
Ah.. so Kylo destroyed their marriage?
I'm seeing it again in two days, hopefully more sinks in and I can watch it with out the Girls association
I'm seeing it again in two days, hopefully more sinks in and I can watch it with out the Girls association
This.
And particularly the first part;
"Actually from what I saw, Rey wasn't wielding the lightsaber in all that practiced or disciplined a way, and seemed to be relying more on anger or the Force than anything else."
I guess myself and the quoted poster saw a different cut of the film than at least one other poster in this thread?
Luke apparently figured out telekinesis on his own at some point without any training, as shown in the ice cave in ESB. Rey just figured it out sooner.
It seemed to me that Kylo's Force mind probing somehow triggered or accelerated Rey's Force abilities, as she was able to turn it back on him and tell what he was thinking, and after that point she was able to do the mental manipulation thing and then telekinesis a little later in the movie.
Kor
It seemed to me that Kylo's Force mind probing somehow triggered or accelerated Rey's Force abilities, as she was able to turn it back on him and tell what he was thinking, and after that point she was able to do the mental manipulation thing and then telekinesis a little later in the movie.
Kor
Quite possibly, but even Finn, who isn't Force sensitive according to Wookieepedia, put up a decent fight against Ren. I tend to agree with a lot of what I read in FPAlpha's post where Ren is concerned.
It also makes me wonder why Ren doesn't have that training? Why can he only build a crappy lightsaber? Why is Snoke just now saying I've got to complete his training? And if Ren is relatively so unskilled how did he kill Luke's other students?
I think TFA did a disservice with how they presented Ren. He starts out badass and then it devolves. He's not someone I fear now, he's more someone I pity. Not like how Vader was presented in the original trilogy (though more Anakin in the prequels), or how Maul was introduced in TPM. Even Dooku was given proper respect in AOTC.
It also makes me wonder about Snoke. How powerful is he? How much knowledge or training does he have?
It's like Abrams went overboard with a puffed up, overpowered Death Star in Starkiller Base but then soft pedaled Kylo Ren. I want someone who is bad ass, who makes me wonder how are the heroes going to get out of this, not someone who is weaker or relatively equal in abilities. Already Rey kicked his ass with zero to no training. Once Luke trains her, it's a wrap. I hope they bring Maul back for the next one. Maul or Plagueis are really Snoke please.
Reading over some of the posts, perhaps I need to rethink my harsh criticism to some extent of Ren. He did get shot, and he was bleeding. He was injured. Still though he just wasn't that impressive. I didn't like that Rey kicked his ass like that. It was too easy.
As for Anakin, Ren was whiny as well. And at least with Anakin we got to see some of what was driving him. The few times TFA did the exposition thing was giving us more info on Ren and I don't know if it was enough for me to completely buy his internal conflict. Even with Luke they seeded it over two films, and eventually he fought off the dark side. With Ren I don't think the light side is done with him and it will be something tempting him, calling him, throughout this series.
I would like to see more of the impetus to the dark side, the cause of the conflict before I can buy it with Ren. Was he acting out due to his parents' marital problems? Was there something wrong or insufficient in Luke's teaching?
My opinions may change with more information about Ren but right now I'm not a fan.
Kylo Ren seems to have about as much skill as some of the younglings in the Clone Wars. He'd not be able to fight a padawan with much chance of success back in those days. His only advantage might be his other powers and his Skywalker bloodline. Otherwise a young padawan like Ahsoka Tano when we first meet her would be able to kick his butt in a sword fight.
Well I think it's probably because Rey was simply much stronger in the force than the students were, and maybe the strongest since Luke-- or otherwise they wouldn't be centering an entire new trilogy around her.
Maybe he's not as fearsome by the end as he was early on, but he still killed freakin Han Solo, so that still makes him pretty darn hateable and villainous in my book.
I feel it needs to be pointed out that Ren's father is the great Han Solo, his Mother is General Leia, His Uncle is the mythical Luke Skywalker and his grandfather is Darth Vader. Saying he has a lot to live up to is an understatement he cracks under pressure. Every time he messes up it's just a reminder that he's not good enough. He's not a great jedi like his uncle, he's not a great person like his parents, he's not a badass like his grandfather. It eats it up inside that he can't devote himself to either side. He constantly views himself as a failure.
I was underwhelmed by Ren. I hope he's still alive and will be in the next films because he could have been developed a lot more. One of the nice things about the prequels was we got to see Anekin develop into Darth Vader. Kylo Ren came across as a bit of a brat.
