Kirk; not a 'good' guy?

[RobertScorpio]

Before watching BLADE RUNNER (which my friends and I reviewed and you can see the results over in the scifi/forum) we got into a long argument over whether or not Kirk was 'a good guy'.

And I don't mean if he was a force of good, which he was, but was he horndog, rule breaking dude with less than great character traits. I have had this same argument with my wife as well.

I don't think Kirk 'leaving his seed all around the universe" is a person of lower character because of doing that. He is a single guy who likes to have sex. Now, if he were married, and doing this, then yes, he'd have issues. But if he's just out there having sex, then so what?

As for his being a rule breaker? Yes, he did break rules, we all admit that. Did he lie? At times, yes. But I think, over all, kirk is not some dirtball as some make him out to be.

what do you think..Is Captain Kirk a character kids should really look up to??

Rob

 

[Warped9]

Before watching BLADE RUNNER (which my friends and I reviewed and you can see the results over in the scifi/forum) we got into a long argument over whether or not Kirk was 'a good guy'.

And I don't mean if he was a force of good, which he was, but was he horndog, rule breaking dude with less than great character traits. I have had this same argument with my wife as well.

I don't think Kirk 'leaving his seed all around the universe" is a person of lower character because of doing that. He is a single guy who likes to have sex. Now, if he were married, and doing this, then yes, he'd have issues. But if he's just out there having sex, then so what?

As for his being a rule breaker? Yes, he did break rules, we all admit that. Did he lie? At times, yes. But I think, over all, kirk is not some dirtball as some make him out to be.

what do you think..Is Captain Kirk a character kids should really look up to??

Rob

Abrams evidently thought otherwise and hence Chris Pine's dirtbag version of Kirk.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Most children are able to distinguish between figures of fantasy and real human beings when it comes to choosing role models. I'm not always so sure about adults.

 

[scotpens]

From The Making of Star Trek:

James T. Kirk is an idealist, rather sensitive, with a strong, complex personality. Constantly on trial within himself, he feels acutely the responsibility of his position and is therefore fully capable of letting the worry and frustration lead him into error. Ignoring the fact that he is also capable of fatigue, Kirk is often inclined to push himself beyond human limits. When he must give in to fatigue, he then condemns himself because he is not superhuman. The crew respect him, some almost to the point of adoration . . . The young Captain is definitely a man of decision and decisive action.

***************************************
Long ago Captain Kirk consciously ruled out any possibility of any romantic interest while aboard the ship. It is an involvement he feels he simply could never risk. In a very real sense he is "married" to his ship and his responsibilities as Captain of her.

***************************************
The impossibility of a romantic interest aboard ship does not necessarily preclude enjoyments ashore. Away from the confines of self-imposed discipline, Kirk is inclined to play pretty hard, almost compulsively so. It is at least a partial release from the severe regimen he imposes upon himself while aboard ship.

If our fictional heroes didn't have flaws, they wouldn't be human.

 

[Green Shirt]

I don't think Kirk 'leaving his seed all around the universe" is a person of lower character because of doing that. He is a single guy who likes to have sex. Now, if he were married, and doing this, then yes, he'd have issues. But if he's just out there having sex, then so what?

Rob

Anyway, he coulda had a vasectomy after spawning David Marcus. I know I would.

 

[RobertScorpio]

I don't think Kirk 'leaving his seed all around the universe" is a person of lower character because of doing that. He is a single guy who likes to have sex. Now, if he were married, and doing this, then yes, he'd have issues. But if he's just out there having sex, then so what?

Rob

Anyway, he coulda had a vasectomy after spawning David Marcus. I know I would.

if you have the email for ANTONIO CROMARTE, we should send him that advice.

Rob

 

[JiNX-01]

Anyway, he coulda had a vasectomy after spawning David Marcus. I know I would.

I'm with you! Well, except for the part about having a vasectomy, since I can't.

 

[plynch]

Most children are able to distinguish between figures of fantasy and real human beings when it comes to choosing role models. I'm not always so sure about adults.

Good research shows that kids emulate media violence esp. when done by the "good" protagonist.

Back to the OP: We'd have to agree on "good" character, then evaluate Kirk's behavior. My bet - regardless of our criteria, the Captain would have a mixed record. Just like me and you. Peace be with you.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Good research shows that kids emulate media violence esp. when done by the "good" protagonist.

Post proof or retract.

 

[Pauln6]

There is ample evidence that smoking in the media increases the incidence of smoking among the populace. The image of the smoking tough guy and the smoking vamp are very iconic because they've been movie cliches for decades.

I think that movies can have a limited influence on people's behaviour. However, I don't think flawed heroes are bad; their flaws make them more interesting! I do worry a bit if their flaws are not acknowledged as flaws though. I just finished watching the Watchmen (no pun intended) and it really is a masterpiece when it comes to depicting seriously flawed heroes.

 

[Anji]

Remember, all they showed was Kirk kissing the girls, anything beyond that happened in the viewer's imagination.

Becides, protagonists of that era always beat up the bad guy and then kissed the girl. You guys are looking too deep into this.

 

[Iowagirl]

Kirk saved the Universe on a regular basis, he was most loyal towards his crew and his friend - always ready to sacrifice his life for them, he liked the girls and - don't forget - they liked him, didn't they, he was always willing to even treat his enemies with respect, he had a great sense of humor, he could be a manipulatory, arrogant jerk if he had to be - but hey, that doesn't make him bad, but even more...interesting. Kirk was a good guy, for sure.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Remember, all they showed was Kirk kissing the girls, anything beyond that happened in the viewer's imagination.

Becides, protagonists of that era always beat up the bad guy and then kissed the girl. You guys are looking too deep into this.

Mirimanee didn't get pregnant by herself.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Before watching BLADE RUNNER (which my friends and I reviewed and you can see the results over in the scifi/forum) we got into a long argument over whether or not Kirk was 'a good guy'.

And I don't mean if he was a force of good, which he was, but was he horndog, rule breaking dude with less than great character traits. I have had this same argument with my wife as well.

I don't think Kirk 'leaving his seed all around the universe" is a person of lower character because of doing that. He is a single guy who likes to have sex. Now, if he were married, and doing this, then yes, he'd have issues. But if he's just out there having sex, then so what?

As for his being a rule breaker? Yes, he did break rules, we all admit that. Did he lie? At times, yes. But I think, over all, kirk is not some dirtball as some make him out to be.

what do you think..Is Captain Kirk a character kids should really look up to??

Rob

Abrams evidently thought otherwise and hence Chris Pine's dirtbag version of Kirk.

He's a "dirtbag" because?

 

[T'Girl]

He's a "dirtbag" because?

Abrams version of Kirk is a dirt bag because of the way he used green Gaila to down load his computer virus into the Kobysi Maru simulator. This was different than Roddenberry's Kirk doing something like this to complete a mission. Kirk going to Gaila was solely for personal advantage. In time it is likely that the virus would have been traced back to her communications. Dirtbag.

Kirk prime was a good guy. He certainly was a guy in every way. He was one of the boys. I've alway found him to be a positive cowboy style role model, brave, honorable, driven.

On the moral scale of light and darkness, Kirk is a optimistic shining light.

 

[plynch]

Post proof or retract.

Who are you to give me a command?

 

[Warped9]

Post proof or retract.

Who are you to give me a command?

He is the resident "enlightened" know-it-all whom we're all supposed to accept whatever he says as decree or fact.

 

[Brutal Strudel]

James Kirk's character flaw during TOS and into TMP was not his promiscuity (which is over-sold anyway): even on those rare occasions where he "used" a woman (Lenore Karidian, Shana), it was for high stakes and it was done with apparent regret. No, the central flaw Kirk suffered from was obsessiveness. While this could make him into a bit of a dick at times, it never stopped him from being a good guy. His dedication to duty, to the ideals of the Federation and to his friends, his willingness to take risks and make sacrifices--if Kirk is not a hero then there are none.

 

[Nerys Myk]

He's a "dirtbag" because?

Abrams version of Kirk is a dirt bag because of the way he used green Gaila to down load his computer virus into the Kobysi Maru simulator. This was different than Roddenberry's Kirk doing something like this to complete a mission. Kirk going to Gaila was solely for personal advantage. In time it is likely that the virus would have been traced back to her communications. Dirtbag.

Kirk prime was a good guy. He certainly was a guy in every way. He was one of the boys. I've alway found him to be a positive cowboy style role model, brave, honorable, driven.

On the moral scale of light and darkness, Kirk is a optimistic shining light.

Thats from a deleted scene. In the movie Kirk acted alone. Maybe it was cut so Kirk wouldn't look like a dirtbag.

 

[Brutal Strudel]

Indeed. And another deleted scene, which made Kirk look like a dirt- and douche-bag had him mistaking another green girl for the (quite probably dead) Gaila and getting through an entire long-winded apology before realizing that he had the wrong girl. A "They all look alike to me" joke is a little beneath the Jim Kirk I idolized as a kid, especially when he'd made love to one of them.