Kirk and Spock's relationship

[Temis the Vorta]

jon1701 said:
This thread makes me sad.

This thread makes me grin like the Joker on prozac.

Women have close relationships and nobody talks about them being lesbians unless they are in fact so.

Oh believe me, the slash fans don't neglect the ladies. Trek just isn't as good at depicting female relationships, but people do what they can with the Bev & Deanna, or Dax & Kira crumbs thrown their way.

 

[RookieBatman]

[insert joke asking what kind of wild new drug "prizac" is]
EDIT: This new ability to Not Mark as Edited is ruining my credibility!

 

[Temis the Vorta]

I was grinning so much I couldn't see what I was typing!

 

[RookieBatman]

If it was that bad, then Prizac must be a really good drug.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

In my judgment, to play being gay or lesbian into a close same gender relationship is more of a male fantasy then a female fantasy.

Women write slash fanfics about guys (and are the original driving force behind K/S and all the slash that was spawned thereafter). Guys don't seem to write slash fanfics much at all, maybe because they'd rather write fanfics about exciting space battles and intergalactic politics and leave the mucky icky relationship stuff (and sex) to the girls, but they're the first to flock to the TV if a hit of lesbianism is suspected, so if we could ever convince guys to write their fair share of slash fanfics, they'd probably find a time travel technobabble way to toss Seven and T'Pol into the decon chamber together.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

RookieBatman said:
[insert joke asking what kind of wild new drug "prizac" is]
EDIT: This new ability to Not Mark as Edited is ruining my credibility!

Hee hee! Serves ya right, wait at least two minutes before playing Spelling Nazi.

 

[Cary L. Brown]

Bow-chica-wop-BOOOOOOOWWWWW....

 

[RookieBatman]

Temis the Vorta said:

RookieBatman said:
[insert joke asking what kind of wild new drug "prizac" is]
EDIT: This new ability to Not Mark as Edited is ruining my credibility!

Hee hee! Serves ya right, wait at least two minutes before playing Spelling Nazi.

Hey, I'm on your side. I was just trying to head off someone from actually making that joke. No need to thank me.

 

[number6]

I think the movie should open with Nimoy and Shatner doing the nasty, hard and heavy..Their wrinkly flesh melding as one..then in mid kiss, Nimoy says "Jim, remember our first time?" Shatner says, "actually I don't.." then Leonard touches Shatner's face saying "My mind to your mind, our minds are merging, our minds are one.." then ripple fade to Zack Quinto exiting the men's room of the Starfleet hotspot, The Horny Horta..the music swirls "Un-tz, Un-tz, Un-tz.."
He pensively sips his mojito as a young Lt. Kirk swaggers into the room with a rum and coke, wearing a velour thong and an evil grin.

 

[indranee]

why are so few people voting and yet so many people mouthing off in this thread?

IMO, people who get defensive at the mere mention of K/S are skirting homophobia at the least. I still remember the virulent garbage toolpackingmama had to put up with over on alt.tv.star-trek. those were them days! haven't been back there in a while.... maybe she still is!

 

[Dale]

I didn't vote because none of the options came even close to expressing my opinion... and I say people who insist on seeing romantic and sexual tension between same-sex characters where it was never written, acted or intended are skirting... um...homophillia.

 

[number6]

I voted, so I will write what I want.

 

[Cary L. Brown]

indranee said:why are so few people voting and yet so many people mouthing off in this thread?

Put an answer that remotely approaches what most of the people actually think, and people will choose that.


The poll was phrased in a way that most political polls tend to be done these days:

"How much do you hate President Bush? (1) A little bit, (2) a lot, (3) a whole bunch, (4) More than you can imagine"

The idea that the premise of the question is fundamentally flawed isn't even addressed. Sorta dishonest, really.

My answer to the poll, had it been an option, would have been "There is NO romantic relationship whatsoever between these characters." And if that was an available choice, 95% or so of the responses would've been that one. Which, I'm sure, is why it was left out in the first place.

Oh, and "mouthing off?" Another "results-oriented" comment. If people comment and agree with the premise, they're commenting, but if they comment and DISAGREE, they're "mouthing off?" (sigh)

IMO, people who get defensive at the mere mention of K/S are skirting homophobia at the least.

I love it.

FYI, nobody here is "getting defensive" and nobody is showing FEAR of homosexuality, so the term "phobia" is a total misnomer.

But it's proven to be an effective tactic to silence opposing viewpoints... associate terms of weakness with the other side of the argument, implying greater strength behind the side you happen to support. A DISGUSTING tactic... a DISHONEST tactic... but still, an effective tactic.

Nobody here is afraid of homosexuality... and as far as I can tell, nobody has said anything against homosexuals. The issue is the bizarre desire to claim that straight people, or straight fictional characters, must be "really gay" in order to support an agenda.

Shatner isn't gay. Nimoy isn't gay. Roddenberry wasn't gay. The characters were on 1960s TV, prior to today's political-correctness climate, so the likelihood that they were intentionally portrayed as being gay is so slim as to be basically nonexistent.

That means that this sort of idea rises up entirely within the imagination of a very small group of people who either (1) have overactive fantasy lives or (2) have an agenda and are trying to use popular and familiar characters to promote that agenda.

As for me... we know that Kirk was straight, we know that Spock was straight, and we know that McCoy was straight, we know that Chapel, Chekov, and Scotty were straight. All that was clearly established through the on-screen behavior of the characters. We know that Sulu, at some point, had a daughter (making him, at most, bisexual).

So attempts to rewrite these characters to be something other than what they were PORTRAYED as is clearly a load of crap.

No "phobia" involved in saying that!

 

[seigezunt]

indranee said:
why are so few people voting and yet so many people mouthing off in this thread?

IMO, people who get defensive at the mere mention of K/S are skirting homophobia at the least. I still remember the virulent garbage toolpackingmama had to put up with over on alt.tv.star-trek. those were them days! haven't been back there in a while.... maybe she still is!

I didn't vote, because there wasn't an option I agree with. I'd say "sticks with canon: leaves everything up to the fangirl's fevered imagination."

I agree with you, tho, that some of the backlash against slash (backslash?) is tinged with homophobia. Not so much the comments in this thread, though.

 

[David cgc]

dalehoppert said:
I think the relationship between Kirk and Spock should be treated as it always has been... without any gay subtext other than that projected onto them by certain members of the audience.

Come on. I don't buy the slash stuff one bit, but even I can see there's something odd about Kirk getting a massage from his hot yeoman and assuming that Spock did it.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

RookieBatman said:

Temis the Vorta said:

RookieBatman said:
[insert joke asking what kind of wild new drug "prizac" is]
EDIT: This new ability to Not Mark as Edited is ruining my credibility!

Hee hee! Serves ya right, wait at least two minutes before playing Spelling Nazi.

Hey, I'm on your side. I was just trying to head off someone from actually making that joke. No need to thank me.

Oh all right. Your fruit basket is in the mail!

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Number6 said:
I think the movie should open with Nimoy and Shatner doing the nasty, hard and heavy..Their wrinkly flesh melding as one..then in mid kiss, Nimoy says "Jim, remember our first time?" Shatner says, "actually I don't.." then Leonard touches Shatner's face saying "My mind to your mind, our minds are merging, our minds are one.." then ripple fade to Zack Quinto exiting the men's room of the Starfleet hotspot, The Horny Horta..the music swirls "Un-tz, Un-tz, Un-tz.."
He pensively sips his mojito as a young Lt. Kirk swaggers into the room with a rum and coke, wearing a velour thong and an evil grin.

Abrams wanted to do this, but the Fire Marshall vetoed it. It would cause injury and possible loss of life due to the resulting stampede for the exits.

 

[CommanderRaytas]

I don't mind slash at all. If it makes people happy, why not write about it? No one's forcing you to read it.

Still, it shouldn't be an issue in the movie. Innuendoes that basically mean nothing, like Temis said, are okay. Anything else would be boring to the slash fans and weird for the rest.

This whole K/S thing is like Sam/Frodo. They loved each other, yes. But it was completely platonic. Anything else shown in the movie would kind of annoy me, I think. We are all capable of loving people without wanting to throw them on a bed and have our wicked way with them.