Kira in charge of the Defiant

[Bad Thoughts]

Being that DS9 is a Bajoran station and Starfleet are there at the invitation of Bajor, the Starfleet command structure would not apply. Who does what and who has what authority would be a matter of diplomacy, which is to say by whatever written agreement Starfleet has with Bajor. Consequently, DS9 would be structured and managed more like NATO or a UN peace keeping mission. It would explicitly be different from other Starfleet missions, at it would evolve organically with the situation, thus be sui generis.

 

[Timo]

Starfleet essentially did appoint a supervisor to Sisko. After a variety of Admirals from nearby starbases had given Sisko direct orders, he got a permanent big brother from Admiral Ross. It's just that Starfleet dared not station this supervisor aboard DS9, as this would have tipped off the Bajorans to the fact that their Emissary was just a pawn in a bigger game. (Okay, no need for "tipping off" - Bajorans aren't stupid. "Rubbing in the face" was the expression I was looking for.)

It would explicitly be different from other Starfleet missions, at it would evolve organically with the situation, thus be sui generis.

Which may well be what separates a "deep space station" from a "starbase" in practice! If you call it a "starbase", you have to stick to certain rules. If you choose another name, you have more leeway for opportunism.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[MacLeod]

Or it could be that the Deep Space Stations fall outside of Federation Space.

 

[Timo]

Which may be much the same thing...

But yes, having Deep Space Stations be "extra-Federal" installations is great for explaining why they are only up to #9 after centuries of Starfleet operations: every time the UFP expands to embrace a DSS, it gets turned into a proper starbase and is given an appropriate number, and the old DSS number is freed for reuse.

We know it's not impossible to have Admirals on DS stations; there's a reference to one in command of DS3 in "Interface". That Sisko was a lowly Commander is thus probably good indication that the whole DSS thing is diverse and full of surprises as regards appropriate rank.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[davejames]

I think what stands out more is when the DS9 crew leaves on the Defiant, they essentially left the command structure at the station empty. I'm sure there's a secondary crew and other senior staff on the station that's not part of the main cast, but from my perspective none of the senior staff remained to deal with possible emergencies.

Ha, yeah that always seemed odd to me as well. With the importance of the station and the continual threats facing it, you'd think Starfleet wouldn't want the entire command crew taking off on missions to the Gamma Quadrant all the time.

As for Kira, I didn't mind her commanding the ship, but I do wonder how she could be remotely qualified for it. Captaining a starship seems like something that would require a lot of training and experience, and service on other ships-- and isn't something you could just pick up through a few online courses.

Obviously she handled herself well and seemed to have good instincts, but I can't exactly imagine her captaining the Enterprise D, for instance, or dealing with some of the crises Picard had to. She was a bit too much of a blunt instrument for that.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Which may be much the same thing...

But yes, having Deep Space Stations be "extra-Federal" installations is great for explaining why they are only up to #9 after centuries of Starfleet operations: every time the UFP expands to embrace a DSS, it gets turned into a proper starbase and is given an appropriate number, and the old DSS number is freed for reuse.

Timo Saloniemi

Correspondingly, assignments and hierarchy probably reflect the project of integrating the uniformed services of the applicant world into Starfleet. It would probably be counterproductive to place them on the lowest rungs of the hierarchy; rather they should be brought up to speed as quickly as possible.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I think what stands out more is when the DS9 crew leaves on the Defiant, they essentially left the command structure at the station empty. I'm sure there's a secondary crew and other senior staff on the station that's not part of the main cast, but from my perspective none of the senior staff remained to deal with possible emergencies.

Ha, yeah that always seemed odd to me as well. With the importance of the station and the continual threats facing it, you'd think Starfleet wouldn't want the entire command crew taking off on missions to the Gamma Quadrant all the time.

On the other hand, it does suggests that the command crew isn't the only competent ones on the station if it's still there when they get back.

As for Kira, I didn't mind her commanding the ship, but I do wonder how she could be remotely qualified for it. Captaining a starship seems like something that would require a lot of training and experience, and service on other ships-- and isn't something you could just pick up through a few online courses.

She could have received her training while she was on Deep Space Nine. But if Starfleet (or the Bajoran Militia) also had something like Officer Candidate School, she could have become a command officer in just three months (IIRC, they used to call OCS graduates "90-day Wonders" back in World War II).

Obviously she handled herself well and seemed to have good instincts, but I can't exactly imagine her captaining the Enterprise D, for instance, or dealing with some of the crises Picard had to. She was a bit too much of a blunt instrument for that.

I think we're looking at different ships with different missions, with Picard perfectly suited for the Enterprise-D and Kira for the Defiant.

 

[Infern0]

It doesn't make sense at all.

To be honest, the Defiant being Siskos personal starship doesn't make THAT much sense either, even though it's home base is DS9, it really ought to have it's own C/O.

Kira commanding it makes no sense whatsoever, it's a starfleet vessel and she's not starfleet. It's that simple.

US Navy and British Navy might share a port for instance and have an agreement between command officers but a British commander isn't getting on a US Navy ship and taking it out on a mission or vice-versa

 

[Hando]

Is it such a surprise that she could have commanded the ship?

After all there is already a precedent:

T'Pol as XO of NX-01 and Kurn as XO of E-D.

Both of them were not Starfleet, but were XOs, so could have (and did) command a Starfleet starship...

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Is it such a surprise that she could have commanded the ship?

After all there is already a precedent:

T'Pol as XO of NX-01 and Kurn as XO of E-D.

Both of them were not Starfleet, but were XOs, so could have (and did) command a Starfleet starship...

You forgot the glorious service of Riker to the Pagh, who was entrusted to defeat the Enterprise.

US Navy and British Navy might share a port for instance and have an agreement between command officers but a British commander isn't getting on a US Navy ship and taking it out on a mission or vice-versa

Britain will not likely become an American state, as Bajor was a potential member of the Federation. If that process is going forward, the incorporation of the Bajoran military personnel would happen.

 

[Hando]

Is it such a surprise that she could have commanded the ship?

After all there is already a precedent:

T'Pol as XO of NX-01 and Kurn as XO of E-D.

Both of them were not Starfleet, but were XOs, so could have (and did) command a Starfleet starship...

You forgot the glorious service of Riker to the Pagh, who was entrusted to defeat the Enterprise.

I also did not include Worf's service on the Rotarran as we are talking about an Starfleet vessel.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Is it such a surprise that she could have commanded the ship?

After all there is already a precedent:

T'Pol as XO of NX-01 and Kurn as XO of E-D.

Both of them were not Starfleet, but were XOs, so could have (and did) command a Starfleet starship...

You forgot the glorious service of Riker to the Pagh, who was entrusted to defeat the Enterprise.

I also did not include Worf's service on the Rotarran as we are talking about an Starfleet vessel.

But if we are talking about the trust that Starfleet gives to exchange officers and what trust Starfleet requires other governmens give, it is relevant. It suggests that all such exchange officers be able to function fully in the position they are assigned: all exchange XO's must be able to replace the captain.. It suggests reciprocity.

 

[Timo]

Kira commanding it makes no sense whatsoever, it's a starfleet vessel and she's not starfleet.

How would this be different from Sisko commanding a space station that is actually Bajoran property? Sisko is not Bajoran. He has had no training in the Bajoran militia, or in the Bajoran military forces preceding the occupation (if there were any; we never hear of Bajorans of former warrior caste identity, but it could be Cardassians killed all of those early on). He holds no Bajoran rank (not even an honorary one) and wears no Bajoran uniform. Yet he commands this space station whose technical specs are largely unknown to him.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[R. Star]

Kira commanding it makes no sense whatsoever, it's a starfleet vessel and she's not starfleet.

How would this be different from Sisko commanding a space station that is actually Bajoran property? Sisko is not Bajoran. He has had no training in the Bajoran militia, or in the Bajoran military forces preceding the occupation (if there were any; we never hear of Bajorans of former warrior caste identity, but it could be Cardassians killed all of those early on). He holds no Bajoran rank (not even an honorary one) and wears no Bajoran uniform. Yet he commands this space station whose technical specs are largely unknown to him.

Timo Saloniemi

The Bajoran government asked Starfleet to come in being they recently just established their independence and didn't have a formally trained officers, engineers or scientists. There was no training to be had on Bajor, and Starfleet's presence was there to safeguard Bajoran independence. He does hold Bajoran rank, which is Emissary of the Prophets, which basically means he can do whatever he wants. He commands a Cardassian manufactured station which the Federation has technology to adapt to or replicate unlike Bajor.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I have no problems with Kira commanding the Defiant, she was Sisko's XO and its his call who holds the post on the ship as well. I would have liked a little more consistancy though, as Worf is seen in the role of Defiant Numbah One whilst Kira is sitting right there, then in the last episode of S6 she assumes command when Sisko is overcome with the loss of the Prophets.

Plus there is the fact the Bajor is petitioning for UFP membership, which would likely see the Militia fold into Starfleet (well most of it anyway), so it would make sense to get some of its officers trained up on Starfleet systems and designs before that happened.

Personally, I'd rather follow Kira's command than Worf's.