Spoilers Johnathan Frakes is spoiling stuff again (Season 2)
- Thread starter Tuskin38
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I agree, T'Kuvmas whole plan rested on the Shenzou calling for backup and then just sitting there as they usually do until the rest of the Klingons and Starfleet ships arrived.
If the battle had been started when it was just the Shenzou Vs the Sarcophagus ship it would have been over before the rest of the Klingons could have arrived, either it would have been a very one sided David (Shenzou) Vs Goliath (Sarcophagus) situation and the Klingons would have realised that immediately and left in disgust, or the Starfleet ship would have destroyed the Sarcophagus ship and T'Kuvma somehow and then left before the rest of the Klingons arrived, as we saw in the episode the Klingon houses really couldn't give a toss about T'Kuvma or his crusade.
It would have completely diffused and negated T'Kuvmas plan to bring the various Klingon houses together in glorious battle as that was the only way to bring them together in common cause.
You can't have a great battle that triggers a war if one side doesn't turn up or if it's just between two ships as that's just a skirmish.
Its funny really, sometimes the most titanic events can be triggered or potentially stopped by the actions of one person in the right place at the right time.
We have seen many instances through history of an individual triggering such events, makes me wonder how many times the reverse has happened and none of us will ever know.
Not seeing a lot of crossover on their CVs.
His enthusiasm for Trek and us fans in particular - you can see it in his interviews. He loves being Riker, I think. Or at least he knows how to have fun with it, for sure.
Oh please, Burnham is a textbook Mary Sue.
She shows up on the Discovery, she quickly rises to the inner circle, she's obvious the Captain special favorite, her presence is essential to repeated successes.
She's (just happens to be) beautiful, intelligent, well spoken, posed.
She's raised in a prominent Star Trek family, connected to Spock, Sarek and Amanda.
She a technician on the Discovery, yet she regularly consults with Admirals.
She's the center of the entire series.
I lost tract of how many times she personally saved the day, and she saved the Federation and the Klingon homeworld.
Which items on the official Mary Sue check list hasn't her character met?
Being the lead in a TV show doesn't make the character a Mary Sue.
Frakes is basically one of the statesman of the Trek franchise. He can quite literally do as he pleases without fear of consequences. Indeed, he could take a piss all over a CBS executive, and the executive would thank him for the privilege.
How is she an idealized or perfect character considering she mutinied, was stripped of rank, and went to prison, and is constantly struggling with her identity, morality, and how she communicates with others? Which writer is she supposedly an avatar and wish-fulfillment for considering the large writing staff that contributes to her characterization? Mary Sue actually means something other than "female character I don't like", and it's too often been used as an unfair and sexist catchphrase (not saying you're being sexist, just saying in general) for female lead characters who exhibit traits that are no more extraordinary than many of their male counterparts who don't receive the same kind of criticism.
This. Burnham is a lead character, not a Mary Sue. She's the centre of the story, but what lead isn't?
As for the sexism angle, how often do you see Jack Bauer being called a Mary Sue?
"James Bond is a Mary Sue. I mean, he's expert at everything: spying, seducing, driving, boating, gambling, picking the right wine . . . and he saves the day every single movie! It's like he's the star of the series or something!
"And don't get me started on Batman . . . "
"And don't get me started on Batman . . . "
"James Bond is a Mary Sue. I mean, he's expert at everything: spying, seducing, driving, boating, gambling, picking the right wine . . . and he saves the day every single movie! It's like he's the star of the series or something!
"And don't get me started on Batman . . . "
Or Buckaroo Banzai.
Only if he has time to prepare."James Bond is a Mary Sue. I mean, he's expert at everything: spying, seducing, driving, boating, gambling, picking the right wine . . . and he saves the day every single movie! It's like he's the star of the series or something!
"And don't get me started on Batman . . . "
Or Doc Savage.
Or, closer to home, how many times did Kirk personally save the day, overhaul a planet's entire society overnight, stop Khan, V'Gr, the whale probes, the Doomsday machine, etc, while being the only cadet to ever beat the Kobiyashi Maru test. And get the girl 90% of the time.
Heck, you could argue that the Enterprise is the U.S.S. Mary Sue given how many times it's the only ship in the sector when it matters.
Or, closer to home, how many times did Kirk personally save the day, overhaul a planet's entire society overnight, stop Khan, V'Gr, the whale probes, the Doomsday machine, etc, while being the only cadet to ever beat the Kobiyashi Maru test. And get the girl 90% of the time.
Heck, you could argue that the Enterprise is the U.S.S. Mary Sue given how many times it's the only ship in the sector when it matters.
That's nonsense. Her arc is based on validating her being vindicated, culminating in heroic glory... and a boring bloody speech.
I will admit that speech at the end was awkward and seemed so out of place for the situation.
Are we sure her last name isn't Archer?
So, Star Trek?
Did we watch the same show? I'd say that the episodes themselves strongly dispute that.
The last episode is basically Burnham admitting, "Oops, I saw these people are bad, but now that I see them living and being human beings, and I can't hate them." She very clearly concedes that her judgment to that point has involved a bias for Klingons--she did not previously even think of Kronos as someone's home.
I'd say that's a pretty definite case of Burnham being wrong.
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