Jodie Whittaker is the 13th Doctor

Discussion in 'Doctor Who' started by Emperor-Tiberius, Jul 16, 2017.

  1. Professor Zoom

    Professor Zoom Admiral Admiral

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    Of course you are.
    You said I should get used to opposing ideas, to which I bring up, something I assume, you would oppose. Like racism. Do you think someone who is promoting racist ideas should be called out as such or not?

    I do. A racist should be called a racist. Just like some one who is being sexist should be called such.

    Did you think I was calling you a racist? I wasn’t.

    Just to be clear, I’ve only called you sexist. Because, yeah, you’ve sexist regarding the casting of Whitaker. And it’s true, I don’t know you outside of this forum. I only know what you choose to present. Think about that for a moment. I have been reacting to what you have been putting out there.

    That’s actually not what you have said in this thread.

    It hasn’t been done at all yet. You haven’t seen one bit of footage.

    Literally all you have is the idea and a couple of pics. That’s all you have to base your opinion on.
    Fictional science.

    I literally did a few posts ago.

    Lol. And I’m the triggered one.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  2. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    This was your very first post in this thread after Jodie Whitaker's casting was announced:
    This is why people think you're sexist. Your immediate reaction to Whitaker's casting was a declaration that you won't watch the show anymore, and then you ranted on about SJWs and the death of the franchise. You vehemently reacted against the casting of a woman in the role. There is nothing in that post that indicates you are okay with a female Doctor but have an issue with Whitaker herself. If your issues were with Jodie Whitaker specifically, surely you could have conveyed that point instead of complaining about SJWs and the franchise's death.

    If the first post a person makes in reaction to this kind of news is bigoted screed, I'm going to think they're a bigot. And nothing else you've posted on the matter since has convinced me otherwise.
     
  3. starsuperion

    starsuperion Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    so we are all capable of knee jerk reactions.. what's you're point? just like the knee jerk response from any SJW would be to go straight to Sexism.. name calling, and bullying..

    It's always only been the brow beating those not in favor of the Doctor becoming a woman, the way it was done, the PC, SJW, and feminist agenda that was pushed blatantly and the forced nature of it all that is off putting to many fans. Some like me, would have given the new series a chance, until when making our voices heard led to an immediate attack as being sexist, misogynist, and bigoted became the attacks suffered. I was on the fence at first.. not happy, but willing to try to give it a chance. It's those in the media, BBC, and rabid SJW fans who have soiled the pathway back to that, and thus have made it impossible for fans to enjoy the series any longer let alone give Jodie Whittaker a chance. When you're favorite franchise suffers a take over by politically motivated activists who attack you for your views, and bully you into leaving, then wonder why their tactics didn't bring you to support their agenda, and ratings suffer.. they will refuse to look in the mirror at their militant tactics and harsh words.. They will fall back on the "well they are racists, bigots, and sexists" as an excuse.. When it's their insufferable arrogance that caused the divide, and made many who would have otherwise have been open minded, closed off, and now not interested. I should be counted among them.
     
  4. Professor Zoom

    Professor Zoom Admiral Admiral

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    Why do you use someone who wants social justice as a pejorative? Isn't Social Justice a good thing?

    Seriously, reread your posts.

    And how is casting a woman...a single woman... in a show someone "pushing" a "feminist agenda"?
    Would casting a man of color "pushing a diversity agenda?"
    Would casting a white man be "pushing a Whitey Agenda?"

    Seriously, look at the crap you put in your posts. Is it any wonder you've been called out for sexism?

    Yeah.... this totally sounds like "on the fence at first..."

    So, was that your "on the fence at first" or your knee-jerk reaction?

    OHHHHH. So, it's everyone ELSE'S fault. I see.
    Well, I'm a fan. And my enjoyment is still there. I'm excited and curious about Whittaker as the Doctor.
    And, if you don't want to watch: ok. Great! You don't have to watch a "feminist agenda" and we have one less sexist fan. Sound like a win all around.

    Oh, it's political to call out sexists?
    Is it political to call out racists?

    Like, when is it OK to call someone out for horrendous, backward views? What's the line? Like, could I call out Hitler, or would that be just shouting down opposing views? (For the Godwin, by the way!)

    So, again... does this sound like a person who was even remotely "openminded"?

    Listen, to be frank, I'm sorry that you are making this choice... and again... YOU are making this choice to leave. No one has done anything to you, but respond to your posts. You don't like how they are being received. I would love it, if for one moment, you stopped pointing fingers at SJWs and Feminists and Whatever, and took a moment and reflected about what YOU put out into this thread, into OTHER threads.

    What's that joke? If you meet an asshole one day, you met an asshole, but, if you keep meeting assholes all day, you're the asshole? And to be clear, I'm not calling you an asshole. I'm just saying, if many people in this thread, and others, are calling you out for sexist posts, maybe there's something to it.

    But, I suspect, you've dug in your heels, created this narrative that you are a victim in all of this, and how you will miss your favorite show now that it's turned into Doctor "Feminist Agenda" Who... (Seriously, have you been watching Doctor Who in the past 12 years... it's been pretty feminist.) So... there you go. I wish for the New Year, you take a look at your actions.
     
  5. Green Lantern

    Green Lantern Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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  6. starsuperion

    starsuperion Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    It's obvious what you think here.. I see exactly who you are. It's no wonder there are fans who will stay away from the new series, because of attitudes which are generalizations of people who comment in a fashion that can be shallowly picked apart and justify a pejorative and name calling. The essence of bullying. If I were to call you any name in response, it would just be to stoop to your level.

    Here's something to make your little heart content..

    FINE CALL ME SEXIST..
    IT DOESN'T CHANGE THE FACT THAT YOU AND PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE DRIVING FANS WITH OBJECTIONS, WHO WOULD OTHERWISE GIVE THE SERIES A CHANCE, AWAY. THE FACT YOU HAVE A MAJORITY "GROUP THINK " POSSE AND MOB ONLINE DOES NOTHING TO ADD OR HELP THE SITUATION. TRYING TO JUSTIFY THE RATINGS SLIDE IN THE SERIES, AND GENERAL DISINTEREST ISN'T HELPING EITHER. JUSTIFICATIONS ABOUND, AND JUSTIFICATIONS FOR BULLYING AND CALLING SOMEONE A NAME IS FINE FOR SOME..

    as for me, I prefer to live and let live, but the more I say anything negative which has nothing to do with it being a female (even tho preference is now associated with sexism, or internalized what ever that means), the more the response goes right back to the immature name calling and bully tactics. I can't stress enough how people like you are ruining many of the fandoms out there by sheer division. There's a difference between social change, and social justice. You should look at the difference. To sum it up, one is a natural organic way, and usually leads to acceptance and integration that is from people getting there on their own, the other is all about forcing change and usually ends up with a winner or loser, and an "us vs them" mentality, which sours the debate, ends up with name calling and eventually the person who may have been open enough to check something out, is now forced to recoil in fear of being attacked, or just disgusted by the bullying and reinforces their opposition. I see nothing in the countless pages on this thread that would lead me to believe that you or those who do these sorts of name calling attacks has any empathy, or the will to bring people to the table in a mature manner.

    in short, debate is fine. Bringing someone along with a differing point of view is also fine. Attacking someone to force them to adhere to a POV or to admonish them is very Nazi.. and yet I'm sexist and outdated.. SJWism isn't the way to change hearts and minds. It drives people away by it's very divisive nature. You're a bad person. we don't want all people, just the right kind of people.. It's sickening.. and it's a reason there is a divide in many fandoms, let alone Doctor Who. Rationality goes out the window when an SJW is on the scene, because if you aren't with them, even with valid arguments, then you're a pick your pleasure.. Racist, sexist, homophobe, anti- this anti-that.. When people are just people.. They have ideas and perceptions. the Free discussion of the ideas and conversation can change hearts and minds (social change), while attacking someone for their ideas, and calling them names to shut down the debate in order to feel superior, or foster the echo chamber response in mob like lynching tactics (social Justice) only serves to drive people away. This is happening more then ever now.. and I see it will continue.. SJWs view of the world is such that they can't see any other side of a discussion, because they are incapable of admitting there is anything wrong.. to do so would be to shatter the false perception of superiority they try to convey in the obvious responses to my objections.

    if the fandom is to heal, and to the show's ratings are to improve, the inclusion and discussion with those opposed to the blatant social engineering and propaganda of the show's writing needs to be addressed honestly and without the immediate rush to the buzz words of division.. It's immature to do so. It's not going to happen..

    so we will see how well Whittaker does, and the ratings do in 2018. for now, let's table the debate and the childish name calling.. it's kinda old and just keeps making my point, no matter how you justify yourself.
     
  7. Professor Zoom

    Professor Zoom Admiral Admiral

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    I'm not going to respond to most, because, well... there's no need to, but, I want to respond to one piece...

    1. This is a lovely tactic, accusing me of group think/Nazi, but, we all know that's not true. That's not what I'm doing.
    2. I'm trying to force you to adhere to ANYTHING. You want to believe what you want to believe, that's fine. But, I will call it what it IS. I love debate, I love differing point of views. But, I'm not going to NOT call something sexist to make you feel ok. I'm not going to NOT call something racist to make someone feel ok about their backwards opinions.

    If you had just been upset that it was Whittaker, no one would have given two shits. But, you freaked out because it was a woman. "How dare they cast a woman to play a Fictional Shape Changing Alien?" "How dare they after 13 other white male actors play the role they have a woman?!" "It must be a Feminist Agenda!"

    This is why I called you a sexist.

    Actually, rereading, I want to respond to one other part....

    1. Who was the winner and loser in the Civil Rights Movement? Should have African Americans just let their rights materialize organically?
    2. Who was the winner and loser in the Civil War? Should the Abolitionists have just waited around for the South to give up Slavery?
    3. Who was the winner and the loser in the Gay Rights Movement? Should have Gays and Lesbians just stayed in the closet until Straight America said, "You know, maybe we should allow them to marry?"
    4. Who was the winner and loser in the Indian Independence? Should the Indians have just waited until the British were all "Meh, I'm so bored with controlling this country?"
    5. Who was the winner and loser in the American Independence? Should the Americans have just say on their asses and waited?

    You are speaking from a tremendous place of ignorance and entitlement if you think that social change happens in an "organic" way. There's a lot of hard work. There's a lot of blood spilled--sometimes literally--in order for change to happen.

    But, yeah, you should just go on a rant about how they are changing your TV show for some sort of agenda... Good luck with that.

    PS: I like how you won't "stoop" to my level but effectively call me an SJW (yes, please!) and a Nazi. lol.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2017
  8. Janet

    Janet Awesome Possum has gone to the Good Place Moderator

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    Nothing ever happened because of "organic" change. It had be fought for and those against it said that they should wait, because they don't want change. They want their delusional of superiority and it makes me happy to see that ripped away from them because they never deserved or earned it. They were just lucky to be born into a life that gave them some benefit and now they're crying because it's going to be extended to others and they like being considered special because they pathetically take pride in it.

    So yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing the 13th Doctor, just like I looked forward to the 12th, 11th, 10th and 9th. Her being a woman doesn't change it, she's still going to travel through space and time, beat Daleks and Cybermen and keep me entertained. If you have a problem with that, leave the rest of us alone. We don't want to hear your crybaby shit about how SJWs, feminists and other decent people took away the toy you thought only belonged to you. Go work on your own issues before dragging them into here.
     
  9. Evil Headhunter

    Evil Headhunter The Gourd Doctor Premium Member

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    On a much more fundamental, basic level, and this extends to The Last Jedi, too: What's the point about going on and on and on about how much you hate this change? I think it's pretty clear you're not going to change anyone's mind who doesn't agree, and vice versa. The only thing that's accomplished is you become more upset and those of us who disagree become more annoyed and frustrated every time you bring it up (and it's not just in this thread). I'm not saying you can't talk about it, but instead I'm just asking a basic question: What do you hope gain by agonizing over it in a public forum when there's no hope of any kind of progress in the discussion?
     
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  10. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    You really don't get it, do you? Your "knee jerk" reaction makes you look sexist. As you have said yourself earlier in this thread, we do not actually know you, we know the persona you have presented to us on this forum, and this persona, upon learning a woman was cast as the new Doctor vehemently reacted against it, to the point of saying you won't watch the show anymore and that the franchise was doomed and pejoratives about SJWs. Then when people reacted to what was very clearly a sexist post, you responded indignantly about misconceptions of diversity until eventually backpedalling and trying to claim you are in fact okay with a female Doctor, just not Jodie Whitaker.

    But okay, so your post is a "knee jerk" reaction and presumably you are now trying to distance yourself from it and claim it doesn't reflect the "real you" or whatever. In that case, look at your first post objectively for a moment. Now that you have the benefit of nearly six months of hindsight, do you see it as a sexist post, or do you still believe it not to be inflammatory and those who call you sexist or bigoted because of it are persecuting you?
     
  11. Triss Merigold

    Triss Merigold Novigrad's Most Wanted Moderator

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    Jesus Christ, somebody's being really mad and emotional over this. Maybe sexist Doctor Who fans need a "safe place" somewhere? ;)

    You have freedom of thought and even freedom of speech. Those freedoms do not include the right to not be called out when you post bullshit.

    I don't understand why we have to explain this every time somebody posts sexist nonsense.
     
  12. starsuperion

    starsuperion Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Wow, so that's now 3 against 1. Yep, like minded group thinkers attack in packs. As if that makes their arguments somehow valid by mob tactics as some kind of consensus. I'm not mad, but if we are calling out people, as if this is some kind of kangaroo court witch hunt, then you guys have serious social justice issues within a fandom discussion..it's been fun, but like Peter Davison, I think it's gotten beyond actual sense and reason. Enjoy the group think, and Borg mentality. Opposing views will always be lynched in unison it appears.

    So, as the 5th Doctor said in his final tweet with SJW trash, Must Dash.:hugegrin:
     
  13. Triss Merigold

    Triss Merigold Novigrad's Most Wanted Moderator

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    The fact that multiple people agree on something, does not mean they are wrong.

    You're the one losing your shit here. Seeing agendas everywhere and feeling oppressed.
     
  14. Professor Zoom

    Professor Zoom Admiral Admiral

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    *sigh*

    That cross you bare must be so heavy.
     
  15. Judge Death

    Judge Death Admiral Admiral

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    Social Justice Warrior is an odd insult given surely that's exactly what the Doctor is?
     
  16. Evil Headhunter

    Evil Headhunter The Gourd Doctor Premium Member

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    Very much so. But it's also unsurprising because a lot of people (not just on this board) have taken to use that term as an insult in the last few years, on the same level as "snowflake" (which is amusing on its own because of its origin and how every side uses it against the other).
     
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  17. Judge Death

    Judge Death Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, it's amusing to see how a lot of the alt right seem the biggest snowflakes of all, it's like people complaining about Discovery being diverse, as if they've never seen Star Trek before.
     
  18. Janet

    Janet Awesome Possum has gone to the Good Place Moderator

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    It’s not their fault that they’re so sensitive. Seeing anyone but white men in power just makes them terribly upset. So they have to go complain loudly online and hope they get backup from other butthurt man children.
     
  19. O_Kav

    O_Kav Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    The original, you might say! :D

    I mean, the Doctor has been fighting mutant Space Nazis stuck inside pepper pots for half a century and Right-wingers are realizing just now that DW as a whole tends to be slightly Left-ish ? :vulcan: Jesus Christ... Four, for example, was an Anarchist who had a side hobby of bringing down oppressive planetary regimes.

    Sometimes I wonder if these people were around the 80s. McCoy's run had blatant criticisms of Thatcher's Neoliberalism. That wasn't even a popular political position during that time, given the fact that Labour was mowed down time and time again by the Tories... And they think that Modern Day Who is far too Leftist ? Come on.
     
  20. Timby

    Timby Anyone who opposes me will be destroyed. Administrator

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    Didn't I give you an infraction for trolling because of your insane ranting about SJW bullshit, and I told you to knock it off?

    *checks thread*

    Yep, back in July. Well, here, have another one, which will give you a daylong ban. I strongly advise you to stay out of this thread when you come back from your vacation unless you have something more constructive to say than complaining about SJWs and being ganged up on or political correctness or whatever.