It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV shows

[BDuncan]

I'm unsure about the 4 season Enterprise TV series (if it'd pay to own it on BluRay), but where the original 1960s ST TV series was shot on 35 mm film, if you're a hardcore Trek TV series fan who already has all 21 DVD box sets of the TNG, DS9 and Voyager TV shows, you'd want to retain them if Paramount decide to milk Trek fans with Blu-Ray DVD sets of those shows, as someone made the sensible comment below on the AICN.com site.


TNG Bluray is far off.
by JettL93 Aug 7th, 2009.
The TNG show was edited on video with a native resolution of 480i ; in order to make a true 1080p high definition transfer, they'd have to go back to the original film negatives for each episode and re-edit every single pice of footage back to how it was originally edited 20 years ago, not to mention the issue with special FX shots that were filmed right from the begining at 480i (it's the same as why we didn't get a ST : TMP directors cut) as editing and storing on Video was cheap back in the 80's, so TV studios jumped at the chance to use it, but it seriously fucks up the chance of getting a HD transfer of a lot of shows. TNG, DS9 and Voyager all suffered from this, which means the chance of seeing them on Blu Ray is doubtful unless Paramount is willing to pump million of dollars into reconstruction for each episode, which I doubt they'd do.

 

[KiraDax]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

The more I read about this the more annoyed I get.

I could understand the cheap tech being used exclusively if nothing better were available, but to go from something of better quality to something of lesser quality just because it was 'new' and would save money, and not even have another version available for archiving...

With TNG this would even have been understandable, since home playback wasn't as widespread then. But by the time DS9 and VOY rolled around, they should have had an idea where the market was going and foresight to prepare.

Further proof that Paramount never cared a whit for 'old' Trek beyond crippling it.

 

[Falcor5]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

The more I read about this the more annoyed I get.

I could understand the cheap tech being used exclusively if nothing better were available, but to go from something of better quality to something of lesser quality just because it was 'new' and would save money, and not even have another version available for archiving...

With TNG this would even have been understandable, since home playback wasn't as widespread then. But by the time DS9 and VOY rolled around, they should have had an idea where the market was going and foresight to prepare.

Further proof that Paramount never cared a whit for 'old' Trek beyond crippling it.

It especially does not make sense for the last couple seasons of Voyager. The last season of Voyager was still edited on VHS but then just a few months after Voy ended when ENT started up they were using HD equipment for ENT. This means they easily could have done this earlier for Voyager but were to cheap to make the switch. Even if just the last season of Voy was done in HD think of the cost savings between that and someday redoing that season so it can be in HD. The small savings they had by not switching to HD would not even be a drop in the ocean in comparison to that cost!

 

[Chrisisall]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

Further proof that Paramount never cared a whit for 'old' Trek beyond crippling it.

I have no love for the suits, but that's a little unfair, I think. Going cheap on the editing allowed more $ for sets & makeup and was likely more a producer's decision than a studio one, IMO.

 

[barnaclelapse]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

The more I read about this the more annoyed I get.

I could understand the cheap tech being used exclusively if nothing better were available, but to go from something of better quality to something of lesser quality just because it was 'new' and would save money, and not even have another version available for archiving...

With TNG this would even have been understandable, since home playback wasn't as widespread then. But by the time DS9 and VOY rolled around, they should have had an idea where the market was going and foresight to prepare.

Further proof that Paramount never cared a whit for 'old' Trek beyond crippling it.

I don't think they were specifically trying to cripple it. That just doesn't make sense.

I think they were just lazy as hell.

 

[trevanian]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

It wasn't crippling or laziness. If you read up on the decision as made back then (the TNG Cinefex issue is a good start), it was a matter of whether they could afford to make the series at all (and not even getting into how many airdates they'd miss if they went the slower optical route.) Peter Lauritson goes into a ton of detail about all this.

Post on TNG would have taken forever, and it would have cost way too much to do, if they hadn't gone this route back then. And they made this decision thinking there would be no foreign broadcast of TNG because of resolution being so crappy, so they were even willing to eat that end (which they didn't have to do in the end), so the cost savings going this route was that huge.

If you didn't want this debate now, then you'd've had to wait for a new trek series well into the 90s ... which might not have been a bad thing at all.

 

[KL700]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

I suspected the Enterprise TV series was filmed in HD, so if Paramount issue (and they definitely will sooner or later) a 4 season BluRay box set for it (if you greatly admired that show, as I know many Trek fans detested Enterprise), that and the original 1960s series in BluRay, would be the only two to get in BluRay, not any issued for TNG, DS9 and Voyager.

 

[Ovation]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

They'll be released on Blu-ray eventually, though they will likely be like some series shot under similar conditions--simply "upscaled" and encoded with the more advanced video codecs found on Blu-ray. The image quality could marginally (very marginally) improve if it is done correctly--but any lapse in attention to detail will likely result in a worse, not better, picture.

 

[NIUPonyBoy]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

I'll be happy in finding a reasonable price for all the series's on DVD. To me they are far too pricey.

All the movies I would like to get on BlR.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

Further proof that Paramount never cared a whit for 'old' Trek beyond crippling it.

Balderdash.

With any TV production, the adage is "What corners can we cut to get the most out of our budget and still be seen as hip and innovative by today's audience and advertisers?" For SPFX-heavy shows, it is essential that clever ways are found and tested on the run. No show asks, "How can we waste our budget now to make sure our TV show is still being watched decades into the future?"

I think they were just lazy as hell.

No, they were putting a lot of effort into making their budget stretch as far as possible. A budget that was huge compared to competing first-run syndicated comedies and game shows.

 

[trevanian]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

No show asks, "How can we waste our budget now to make sure our TV show is still being watched decades into the future?"

YOU have to know that is a wholly invalid statement. TOS pretty much redefined the value of stripsyndicated drama, pushing it way up above what anybody thought it might be just during the 70s, so the idea that this was not an enormous consideration when TNG got underway is just silly, and surely not worthy of your usual scholarship.

What I'd really like to find out is where most of the TNG budget went. We've seen more than a couple reports -- from Legato and Moore, and I think possibly vetted in the CONTINUING MISSION book -- that the average vfx budget per TNG ep early on was 75,000 per -- miniscule out of the 1.2 to 1.6 MIL per that the show cost, and a much smaller percentage of the overall than optical fx cost on TOS.

So given that they still had insanely lameass planet sets, less than top-of-the-line guest stars and writers who GR was trying to pay below Guild minimums (see Fontana/Gerrold discussions of early TNG), then WHERE DID THE MONEY GO?

 

[trevanian]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

I'll be happy in finding a reasonable price for all the series's on DVD. To me they are far too pricey.

Buy 'em used. except for MAD MEN season 2, and markdown bin stuff, I almost never buy new DVD. Geez, at Goodwill we sell the unscratched intact TNG season sets for 19.99 and turn 'em over very fast, and those are just about the priciest season sets we have. Oddly enough, DS9 doesn't turn over as fast or sell as well, but that just sez something about popular tastes not jiving with quality. And these are almost all sets that came back to us from the online store, which gets first crack at most of the good stuff and only dumps stuff back on us that they can't sell (god knows why, you'd figure out of print Disney DVDs that go for $50 used on Amazon could sell for a lot still in the shrinkwrap online, but we get those back too.)

 

[USS Triumphant]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

WHERE DID THE MONEY GO?

Don't tell anyone, but the saddest part is the answer to your question:

To make Battlefield Earth, my friend. To make Battlefield Earth.



()

 

[NIUPonyBoy]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

I'll be happy in finding a reasonable price for all the series's on DVD. To me they are far too pricey.

Buy 'em used. except for MAD MEN season 2, and markdown bin stuff, I almost never buy new DVD. Geez, at Goodwill we sell the unscratched intact TNG season sets for 19.99 and turn 'em over very fast, and those are just about the priciest season sets we have. Oddly enough, DS9 doesn't turn over as fast or sell as well, but that just sez something about popular tastes not jiving with quality. And these are almost all sets that came back to us from the online store, which gets first crack at most of the good stuff and only dumps stuff back on us that they can't sell (god knows why, you'd figure out of print Disney DVDs that go for $50 used on Amazon could sell for a lot still in the shrinkwrap online, but we get those back too.)

I never see boxed DVD sets at the Goodwill near me. The 'resale' shops usually don't get sci-fi stuff as I have been looking for the reboot BSG for a good minute.

 

[trevanian]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

I never see boxed DVD sets at the Goodwill near me. The 'resale' shops usually don't get sci-fi stuff as I have been looking for the reboot BSG for a good minute.

Sorry, I figured if we got them that everybody else did too. We never get new GALACTICA or DEXTER, but lots of Goodwills are now buying some product from TARGET, and our store got three seasons of WEEDS and other current stuff just last week, and they had us price it at obscenely low numbers (all the WEEDS sets sold before our mandatory 3-day wait to buy, mainly cuz they were going for $7 and $9 per season, and these were unplayed sets that just had the shrinkwrap torn on them.)

 

[jefferiestubes8]

It won't pay to own BluRay of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

I'm unsure about the 4 season Enterprise TV series (if it'd pay to own it on BluRay),

if you're a hardcore Trek TV series fan who already has all 21 DVD box sets of the TNG, DS9 and Voyager TV shows, you'd want to retain them if Paramount decide to milk Trek fans with Blu-Ray DVD sets of those shows,

BDuncan
You should really read the full thread discussions of
(starting at post #18)
STNG continues on in Bluray..with great packaging!

Star Trek TNG Remastered?

DS9 should get Remastered

Star Trek: Enterprise seasons Blu-ray spec. features wishlist


TNG, DS9, Voyager were all shot on 35mm film.
FYI Star Trek Enterprise was shot on 35mm film for seasons 1-3 and telecined to HD. Season 4 was shot on HDCAM 1080/24p video and mastered to HDCAM.

also check out this thread
Can't Stomach Blu-Ray

Your thread in the General Trek discussion is just way too broad and general and even a little confusing with the title. DVD and Blu-ray are two different video formats. Yes DVDs will work for 25 years.
If you want a better looking visual go for a Blu-ray from the original elements such as TOS.

 

[Chrisisall]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

TNG, DS9, Voyager were all shot on 35mm film.

It was my understanding that TNG was edited & FX-ed on video- and the rest were not. Is this wrong? VOY looks great on DVD, where TNG looks very "soft."

 

[jefferiestubes8]

TNG,DS9 and Voyager production

TNG, DS9, Voyager were all shot on 35mm film.

It was my understanding that TNG was edited & FX-ed on video

TNG, DS9, VOYAGER were all shot on 35mm film and edited & mastered on video.
All of the visual efx elements were composited on videotape. Possibly _SOME_ of the stock shots ILM did may have been composited via film.

Chrisisall you should read the thread Star Trek TNG Remastered?

 

[KiraDax]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

Let me rephrase. They weren't deliberately trying to cripple it, but they weren't going out of their way to help it either.

After TNG, there was no concerted effort on Paramount's part to regenerate Trek's creativity, popularity, or long-term durability. DS9 and VOY in particular were both handled as 'in the moment' vehicles...not geared for wide audience or expansion. The franchise limped along, nothing more.

Their efforts with ENT were a little better, for what that was worth, but it wasn't until XI that someone woke up, smelled the coffee they'd been drooling in, and said 'hey, maybe we should try to make this stuff viable for real now'.

Still, I'm amazed at the sheer lack of forethought they put into archiving the footage.

 

[trevanian]

Re: It won't pay to own BluRay DVDs of the TNG,DS9 and Voyager TV show

After TNG, there was no concerted effort on Paramount's part to regenerate Trek's creativity, popularity, or long-term durability. DS9 and VOY in particular were both handled as 'in the moment' vehicles...not geared for wide audience or expansion. The franchise limped along, nothing more.

It's easy to say that in retrospect, but when people bitched about ModernTrek back then, they often got shouted down or assaulted by TNGers who had a righttolifer's kind of zeal. And I think DS9 was actually a really good try.

But the idea that creativity would be the key to wide audience or expansion ... I disagree with that even more strongly. If it were true, then FIREFLY would be the hit of this century, and HBO wouldn't have cancelled DEADWOOD and CARNIVALE in midstream.