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Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we love

Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

And contrary to popular belief that Berman is ignorant of Trek continuity and wilfully contradicts it as he pleases, he actually rejected at least two attempts to bring the Gorn onto Enterprise because it contradicted what was established about them in Arena.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

I've never understood the "Berman ruined ST" hate. Just keeping the series afloat in any way shape or form for nearly 50 years is a tremendous accomplishment. I think a lot of people are naïve about the tremendous number of working parts behind the scenes that go into making just a single one-hr episode, much less 700 and 12 movies and all the other aspects of the ST brand.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

I agree about the music, that was just something Berman saw wrong... Nonetheless, scores for episodes like The Visitor did stand out; I guess Berman was not always opposed of melodic, emotional music...

I do am glad that the whole 'Berman destroyed Trek' attitude is somewhat nuanced by many opinions in this thread...
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

Rick Berman took care of the realities that put the fantasy of STAR TREK on T.V. and I'm grateful that he took Gene Roddenberry's concerns to heart. Imagine Disney discarding Walt's influence(s) entirely. Something of his vision has to be preserved and respected and that's what Rick did with Gene's ideas for TNG. He could've pushed the show to be edgier, sexier and more exciting, frankly, and I'm convinced that The Next Generation cast was up to the challenge. And yes, Gene Roddenberry had a lot of help putting the show and the ideas behind it together. But at the end of the day it's Gene's approval that mattered. And TNG has Gene's stamp all over it.

People talk about how great STAR TREK was, once Roddenberry left, but imagine trying to produce and direct RICHARD III, with Shakespeare in the office and how that might cause headaches for the production team. Same thing with George Lucas and STAR WARS, the chokehold he had over it for so many years. But without people like these, their creations would've never gotten started to begin with. Rick Berman likely would've never thought up STAR TREK had it not existed. But he turned out to be the perfect heir apparent for Gene Roddenberry.

And when Rick was charged with creating sequel series to TNG, there were some great ideas he had. I'd call him a genius for it, why not? Unfortunately, his creativity didn't blossom the way that it should've and he ended up losing his "stuff." Every artist loses their stuff, though. It's just life. But his dedication to this franchise was remarkable. Personally, after TNG, I would've said, "that's it. I've made my statement with this show, let me go and do something else." TNG is the most satisfying sci-fi series to ever hit television. Nothing even comes close ...
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

I look at Rick Berman as a pragmatist who knew how to keep the Trek "product" streaming. You need someone like that as a check and balance to mavericks who want to push the boundaries beyond what the powers that be would accept. However, when he got full control, what you wound up with in Trek was sort of a predictable mediocrity, perhaps typified by the Berman aural-wallpaper soundtracks so typical of TNG-era shows. There were too few truly standout episodes and a lot of middle-of-the-road fare. The hit-to-miss ratio of post-TOS shows never even matched TOS 3rd season, IMHO.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

He was a businessman who thought he could be creative. He was wrong. And instead of sticking to the business end and finding creative spirits to create the creative part, he clung like a fucking remora and sucked all the life out of it. The only thing he "created" was blandness and frustration.

Nothing illustrated that better than "These Are the Voyages", a steaming dump-truck-load of shit dropped on our heads after a season of relative sunlight.

This.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

HO.

LEE.

SHIT.

Where did you get that avatar, Allstar???

Don't remember. I've had it a while. Used to be my Facebook profile pic.

I always wanted Picard to visit Jor-El on Krypton and discuss the Prime Directive.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

It might help if I had a blow-by-blow on Berman's tenure.

Wasn't he considering writing a book about his Trek experiences? It would be nice to get his POV.

Is there a book I can read that candidly speaks about Berman's role in Trek?
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

^ No book yet. Berman said as late as 2011 he was still writing his Trek Memoir. You can however watch this interview about him talking about all the Trek projects he was involved in.

[yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9HcSB9WDTQ[/yt]
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

The geniuses behind the Trek I love were Gene Roddenberry, Gene Coon, Bob Justman, Herb Solow, Dorothy Fontana...
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

I've never understood the "Berman ruined ST" hate. Just keeping the series afloat in any way shape or form for nearly 50 years is a tremendous accomplishment. I think a lot of people are naïve about the tremendous number of working parts behind the scenes that go into making just a single one-hr episode, much less 700 and 12 movies and all the other aspects of the ST brand.

THIS sums up how I feel.

I love TOS and the TOS films.

I also love TNG, DS9, VOY, and ENT.

Does that era have its stinkers? Yeah, sure. But I think the collective good episodes far outweigh the bad ones. That is literally 25 seasons of Star Trek, so it IS hard to not get to a point where you are out of ideas.

Calling Berman a genius might be overstating the case, but Berman should get credit for helping to keep the franchise afloat from the late 1980s to 2005. I don't hate Berman, just appreciate what he did for Star Trek.

Personally, I would take Berman over Abrams or Orci any day.
 
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Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

I disagree with some of Berman's choices, but I do agree that he gets too much of the blame and not enough of the credit.

I pretty much agree with this. I think Berman is unfairly berated and his contributions are definitely under-rated - perhaps not quite as much as the OP, but I do agree with the stance.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

Personally, I would take Berman over Abrams or Orci any day.

Not so fast.

Abrams did something Berman was unable to do: made Star Trek cool again for the masses and made films with crossover appeal.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

Personally, I would take Berman over Abrams or Orci any day.
Not so fast.

Abrams did something Berman was unable to do: made Star Trek cool again for the masses and made films with crossover appeal.
Ah, but according to some people around here, we don't want Trek to be cool for the masses and have crossover appeal. We want to keep it all to ourselves, in our little Trekkie ghetto. ;)
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

HO.

LEE.

SHIT.

Where did you get that avatar, Allstar???

Don't remember. I've had it a while. Used to be my Facebook profile pic.

I always wanted Picard to visit Jor-El on Krypton and discuss the Prime Directive.

I can't place the Spock image, but McCoy looks like it's from "For the World is Hollow...", and Kirk from "Turnabout Intruder". Either that, or they're just trying for boob grabs.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

^ No book yet. Berman said as late as 2011 he was still writing his Trek Memoir.

He's been talking about that as far back as 2006 or so. I remember there was a thread here on this very forum back in the day, which sadly no longer exists which basically consisted of "Berman bashers" ranting "who would publish such a book? I would only buy it for toilet paper." Meanwhile, the more rational pointed out "even if you only buy it for toilet paper, you've still bought it, and therefore are providing all the reason anyone would need for publishing it." Fun thread.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

I couldn't have been happier with DS9 and TNG. Its when Brannon Braga and Jeri Taylor got involved is where I think things went wrong.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

I couldn't have been happier with DS9 and TNG. Its when Brannon Braga and Jeri Taylor got involved is where I think things went wrong.

Jeri Taylor was involved since TNG season 5, and continued to be involved until Voyager's 4th season. At which point during this seven year period did "things go wrong?"
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

Personally, I would take Berman over Abrams or Orci any day.

Not so fast.

Abrams did something Berman was unable to do: made Star Trek cool again for the masses and made films with crossover appeal.

This.

Personally, I would take Berman over Abrams or Orci any day.
Not so fast.

Abrams did something Berman was unable to do: made Star Trek cool again for the masses and made films with crossover appeal.
Ah, but according to some people around here, we don't want Trek to be cool for the masses and have crossover appeal. We want to keep it all to ourselves, in our little Trekkie ghetto. ;)

True.

And, ironically, then they want to complain why Trek went downhill.
 
Re: Isn't it time we realize Rick Berman was the genius of the ST we l

The obvious solution is Paramount needs to give each of us $50 million so we can all make our own version of how Star Trek should really be.
 
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