Is warp drive in the Kelvin universe much faster than the prime timeline?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by The Rock, Aug 1, 2018.

  1. The Rock

    The Rock Captain Captain

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    I'm assuming it is, because the view of the starfield during warp in the movies looks like the Enterprise is hauling ass way faster than any of the ships did in the prime universe (especially since the Enterprise kept swerving all over the place during those exterior shots during warp).
     
  2. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    That's question asked and answered, I guess — "thread over" in one post.

    But wait...

    When did it do that? All the clips I've checked show the Enterprise traveling in a straight and steady line while at warp. Maybe some specific examples would be good.
     
  3. The Rock

    The Rock Captain Captain

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  4. M'Sharak

    M'Sharak Definitely Herbert. Maybe. Moderator

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    Just the one scene, then? No other examples, either from this movie or from the other two films?
     
  5. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    As for "faster or not?", we have a nice benchmark in that an Enterprise flies from Earth to Vulcan in two universes. In ST:TMP, Scotty says it will take four days. In the 2009 movie, it takes however long Kirk sleeps under McCoy's sedation, plus the time he spends running the corridors of the vast ship, disoriented, before reaching the bridge and arguing with everybody for a couple of minutes. But no longer than a single day, as Chekov in a PA refers to events preceding the launch and yet taking place within 24 hours (or else he would need to specify that the hours he quotes in Zulu Time format refer to some other day altogether).

    Is the 2009 ship four or perhaps ten times faster than the 1979 ship? Apparently so, on this stretch of travel. But the 2009 ship is in a real hurry, while the 1979 ship was ferrying a passenger after a ship-straining ordeal and was yet to perform a proper shakedown. Emergency dashes are entitled to being ten times faster than cautious cruising, I guess.

    We have few other points of comparison. In ST:ID, it's also less than a day to the Klingon border and back, the first leg being at stealthy cruising, the second at all-out, monsters-on-our-heels emergency dash. But the Klingons were close in ENT already, and lamentably the TOS timeline ship never performed this exact journey on screen, for our comparison comfort.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  6. The Rock

    The Rock Captain Captain

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    I can't find any other scenes on YT, lol.
     
  7. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    [​IMG]
    It's all speed of plot.
     
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  8. Damian

    Damian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think that's what it comes down to frankly. If they need to be there in 2 hours, they're there in 2 hours. If not it might take a week. Star Trek unfortunately never had much consistency with that sort of thing.

    In TFF it took the Enterprise what, maybe a day or two at most to get to the center of the galaxy (if not a few hours) and yet it would normally take Voyager 70 years to get home from the other side of the galaxy without any help.
     
  9. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    To be fair, in TFF a madman claimed they would go to the center of the galaxy. Kirk said "no can do", and for all we know, he got it right. The heroes did hit the snag that Kirk claimed would block the attempt: the impenetrable Great Barrier. There's no telling where they hit it, and quite possibly it lay just a short hop from Nimbus III.

    And then the madman took them through the impenetrable barrier, and met a God full of lies. That the meeting would have taken place at the center of the galaxy sorta depends on us trusting that God. We would IMHO be better off not doing so.

    All the Kelvinverse movies have their shares of travel time problems, most of them not even something the avid fan spots through careful comparison across the decades of Trek writing, but internal to the movie in question.

    2009: Earth to Vulcan is a short hop. Yet Nero spends ages doing the reverse run, in a ship he thinks is fit to chase after Spock's little vessel which is declared "our fastest".

    ST:ID: Klingon space to Earth is a short hop. Yet random blasting at the hero ship makes her stall exactly at Earth's doorstep, a spot neither of the sides in the fight would voluntarily choose. The manner of stalling would only work statistically if the ship moved at the pace of a space snail.

    ST:B: Yorktown to Altamid takes a short while at what looks like walking pace. Even this astronomical impossibility isn't the problem, though - but the ease and speed at which the reverse journey takes place, supposedly still under the very same constraints of extreme navigational hazards, but this time without the help of the hero ship's super-duper navigation systems or heroic crew.

    Yet all of those can be handwaved away, as already partially demonstrated. Trek writing simply is loose enough that we can rattle the results and see the pieces fall in place, rather than the place fall in pieces.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  10. valkyrie013

    valkyrie013 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Warp in Star Trek is "Speed of Plot" but in general has "Rules" .. Watching Voyager just makes me kringe.. at warp 9, you cover 3 light years in 24 hours, so 8 hours a light year, yet many times its 5 minutes to cover 5 light years.. ugh..

    Or in Enterprise, Warp 5 is around 1 light year a Day.. and they usually stick to it, but as said.. "Plot" is king.

    Now, the new Disco "Anomoalies" that are spread across the galaxy.. if they visit.. all of them.. Now thats a violation period.
     
  11. Pubert

    Pubert Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It was a pretty big scene. They are at warp and swerving. When I saw that scene I figured it was a new way to show the warp corridor. The corridor was being likened to a river with edies. They literally were shot out of the corridor.
     
  12. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Well Discovery has the spore jump-drive, which is a violation in and of itself, but within Discovery's version of Trek it works.
     
  13. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Kang, now with ridges Premium Member

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    What's it violating again?
     
  14. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    It renders the entire premise of Deep Space Nine and Voyager moot.
     
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  15. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Kang, now with ridges Premium Member

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    In what way?
     
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  16. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    You already know. Even if it was the most classified thing in the multiverse, Janeway's crew would have reinvented it from scratch. They obliterated physics with their transwarp 10 infinity salamander drive.
     
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  17. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Kang, now with ridges Premium Member

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    Would they? Why not just replicate the Kelvan modifications from "By Any Other Name" or what ever Sybok did in Final Frontier? Their database must be crammed with "shortcuts" they never uses. Though strapping Harry to the spore drive "cradle" might have been fun.
     
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  18. Tenacity

    Tenacity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Is warp drive in the Kelvin universe much faster than the prime timeline?

    Perhaps the star systems are closer together in the Abrams-universe, instead of say 16 light-years to Vulcan, Earth and Vulcan are a mere third of a light-year in separation.

    This would allow for much fast transist times.

    Some fans have conjectured that warp speeds are faster inside star systems than in interstellar space, which would cut down on times even more because the ship would spend a greater percentage of it's journey in the two star systems and less in interstellar space.
     
  19. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Those were external modifications. Discovery is Starfleet designed tech. Even if it's officially banned (as "Will You Take My Hand" establishes, but I imagine S2 will work around), that would never ever stop Janeway.
     
  20. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Kang, now with ridges Premium Member

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    Why would the source matter? It's part of Federation history.
    Apparently something did. Either she didn't have access to the specs or a key component.