And?
Is Toxic "Star Wars" Fandom Imploding?
- Thread starter Locutus of Bored
- Start date
And you'd expect fewer sexists, racists, and general assholes to follow this show. Which part is confusing??And?
I would not expect that.
On the one hand, I can understand loving something as entertainment that you vehemently disagree with on a political/intellectual level. I love The Dark Knight Trilogy, Dirty Harry and 24 (Well, Seasons 1-5 and Live Another Day, anyway. The less said about the Howard Gordon showran Seasons 6-8 the better.), but I despise their collective conservative neo-fascist themes and the rampant racism and Islamophobia that's ingrained in 24's DNA.
If people were like, "I dig Star Trek and Doctor Who, but I'm not a fan of their politics," I'd be flabbergasted about how anyone can consider themselves to be intelligent, caring and empathetic people and yet be rabidly against a pro-women/pro-minority/pro-LGBTQ/pro-basic human decency "ideology". I'd understand where they were coming from about enjoying something despite its politics, though.
That's not what most of this is. The majority of it, both here and elsewhere on the interwebs, is "Keep the feminist/Black Lives Matter/LGBTQ/etc. etc. etc. liberal agenda out of MY Star Trek and Doctor Who!!!" That's fucking absurd. They've both been heavily political and extremely liberal since the fucking '60s! Doctor Who's original creative team was a woman and a gay man that immigrated from India. Star Trek was founded on accepting "Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations".
Imagine if I went on vicious online rants about how they "better not put the conservative neo-fascist agenda in MY 24!!!" If I harassed Robert Cochran and Joel Surnow on Twitter for "shoehorning torture and offensive racial stereotypes in MY 24!!!" If I hacked Keifer Sutherland and released his phone number, home address and nude photos of him for "committing torture on MY 24!!!"
This has been a major part of these franchises from the very beginning. Fucking absurd!
If people were like, "I dig Star Trek and Doctor Who, but I'm not a fan of their politics," I'd be flabbergasted about how anyone can consider themselves to be intelligent, caring and empathetic people and yet be rabidly against a pro-women/pro-minority/pro-LGBTQ/pro-basic human decency "ideology". I'd understand where they were coming from about enjoying something despite its politics, though.
That's not what most of this is. The majority of it, both here and elsewhere on the interwebs, is "Keep the feminist/Black Lives Matter/LGBTQ/etc. etc. etc. liberal agenda out of MY Star Trek and Doctor Who!!!" That's fucking absurd. They've both been heavily political and extremely liberal since the fucking '60s! Doctor Who's original creative team was a woman and a gay man that immigrated from India. Star Trek was founded on accepting "Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations".
Imagine if I went on vicious online rants about how they "better not put the conservative neo-fascist agenda in MY 24!!!" If I harassed Robert Cochran and Joel Surnow on Twitter for "shoehorning torture and offensive racial stereotypes in MY 24!!!" If I hacked Keifer Sutherland and released his phone number, home address and nude photos of him for "committing torture on MY 24!!!"
This has been a major part of these franchises from the very beginning. Fucking absurd!
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As much as I appreciate the symbology behind that meaning, the phrase always bothers me because the roots go to Gene's desire to make money on Star Trek.
Regardless, art always has multiple layers about it, and Star Trek is no different. The idea that all people should engage something on a political level is, well, baffling to me.
Now, I get the human decency part, and I certainly want to respect all humans and have them be included, but not everyone is aware of a franchise's history.
I find it baffling as well. Thankfully, I do not see the world through a political lens. While I understand many do, I don't see the point of it.
Sure, but when about 80% of the show is based on those politics, I would expect people who disagree with them would have trouble watching them.
I'll confess, I'm also a fan of 24 despite it's politics, but to me it feels like that's one where it's lot easier to ignore the politics and enjoy it as a cool spy/action show.
The politics in Trek just feel a lot more ingrained into the whole fabric of the show and thus harder to ignore than they do in things like 24 or The Dark Knight Trilogy. The way most of these people act, I'm kind of amazed they could stand the sight of characters like Janeway or Sisko.
Wait, which 80% of what show's politics am I supposed to be incensed by? I wasn't paying close attention. But if there's an opportunity for me to affect indignation, it would be a shame if I let it slip away.
Are you entertained when Picard is lecturing you right through the camera about things you don't believe?
Sure.
I don't understand how this is difficult. Entertainment is meant to draw me in to a world. As Tolkien would say "reincarnation may be bad theology in our world but in a subcreation it can explored" (poorly quoted). I don't have to agree with everything to enjoy it.
I know it wouldn't be entertained if I was watching some show with the hero seriously lecturing the audience on the inferiority of women or none races, or something along those lines.
If it was a small part of a story that was not focused on those concepts and moved on quickly I could probably ignore it and move on, but not if it was the big summation that the whole episode had been building too.
If it was a small part of a story that was not focused on those concepts and moved on quickly I could probably ignore it and move on, but not if it was the big summation that the whole episode had been building too.
Sexism is everywhere.
It's one thing to not agree with some things. But if the thing you disagree with is diversity itself...This seems like a rather extreme point of view of political disagreements. I don't agree with everything that Trek preaches. Doesn't mean I can't watch it