Um...what?
Utopian:
adjective
- modeled on or aiming for a state in which everything is perfect; idealistic.
"a utopian ideology"
Is it time to put Star Trek to rest?
- Thread starter Dar70
- Start date
Utopian:
adjective
Shockingly, an ideal society CAN have imperfect people.
The response was to the statement that they might not think the Federation isn't perfect. Which, if it's utopian implies at least some thinking that it is perfect. And, certainly Picard presents it as such, and that humanity has evolved to a far higher ideal, and looks down on others. If that isn't thinking they're near perfect not sure what thinking it is perfect is looking like.
But, I never thought TNG did a good job with that. TOS appeals more to me.
ENT, DSC Seasons 1 and 2 and SNW also dial heavily into the "we're a helluva lot better off than we were after World War III and First Contact but still have pervasive and lingering issues" narrative. Yeah, Earth in 2155 or 2258 is the best it's ever been, but still has a long way to go.
I'm sure the word Utopia can be used to define a society as absolutely perfect, but I'm pretty sure it can also be used to define a society that has achieved certain ideal conditions or standards of perfection, some of which I described previously, and that society may not consider itself as absolutely perfect.
Let me try taking this in a different direction and see if I can explain what I'm talking about.
I am a conservative Republican. Many would classify me as very conservative. I have been as far back as I can remember. I literally was listening to Rush Limbaugh in junior high school.
About as long as I can remember following politics and holding conservative views, I have also been a Trek fan. My older cousin took me to see TVH in the theater in 1986 and the rest was history. I spent my formative years watching reruns of TOS, catching up on the first three films, and seeing all of Berman-era Trek as it aired.
And through all of that, I never felt unwelcome in Trek fandom. Not once. Sure, Trek leaned left. So does a lot of entertainment. Who cares? It didn't affect my enjoyment of it and I didn't feel out of place as a fan at all.
Today? I really feel like I'm not welcome in fandom anymore. This board makes me feel that way constantly, any time politics enters the chat. There is a palpable hatred for conservatives, not just a disagreement. And I feel that a lot of that is also coming through from the writers, producers, and actors who are making Trek today.
That is why, in spite of Trek always being liberal, it feels different to me today. I feel like I am no longer wanted in this group of fans. Like the folks making the product would honestly prefer that people like me not be watching. Like many of you here would prefer I wasn't part of these boards.
And that just makes me sad.
I am a conservative Republican. Many would classify me as very conservative. I have been as far back as I can remember. I literally was listening to Rush Limbaugh in junior high school.
About as long as I can remember following politics and holding conservative views, I have also been a Trek fan. My older cousin took me to see TVH in the theater in 1986 and the rest was history. I spent my formative years watching reruns of TOS, catching up on the first three films, and seeing all of Berman-era Trek as it aired.
And through all of that, I never felt unwelcome in Trek fandom. Not once. Sure, Trek leaned left. So does a lot of entertainment. Who cares? It didn't affect my enjoyment of it and I didn't feel out of place as a fan at all.
Today? I really feel like I'm not welcome in fandom anymore. This board makes me feel that way constantly, any time politics enters the chat. There is a palpable hatred for conservatives, not just a disagreement. And I feel that a lot of that is also coming through from the writers, producers, and actors who are making Trek today.
That is why, in spite of Trek always being liberal, it feels different to me today. I feel like I am no longer wanted in this group of fans. Like the folks making the product would honestly prefer that people like me not be watching. Like many of you here would prefer I wasn't part of these boards.
And that just makes me sad.
Not in TOS. The whole "No money" thing didn't even come about until TVH, prior to then there was no reason to believe the Federation was post-scarcity. And people striving to better themselves? In TOS? Right off the bat, we had Pike contemplating leaving Starfleet to become a space pimp. There was also McCoy regularly making bigoted comments about his superior officer, and Scotty was known for his passion of alcoholic beverages. Please point out who in TOS strived to better themselves.
Is it Trek that feels different? The fandom the feels different? Both?
Well, yeah. This goes back to the point that the Federation was not depicted as utopian until TNG (or TMP as someone noted above). This reflects Roddenberry's shifting attitude in regards government and society.
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That has a lot to do with how the GOP party leaders and a not insignificant portion of their followers act, especially after they’ve doubled their money down on the current despotic POTUS over the last decade.
Go back in time to 1525, todays society would look pretty Utopian in comparison. Utopia is all relative, before the Burn the UFP might consider the TNG and TOS era as uncivilised.
As someone who considers herself a combination of liberal and centrist, I would not want this board to lose its political diversity among the fans. Echo chambers are boring places to be.
Captain Braxton referred to late 20th century Earth as "post-industrial barbarians" and compared pre-warp humans to Cardassians. As late as the 29th century it seems a lot of humans saw previous centuries of history, even those with warp drive and large starships, as primitive.
I agree with Braxton.
Somewhere between aspiring to greatness and having delusions of grandeur.
Rebelling against whatever society happens to look like? Yeah, that sounds about right ("right" as in "typical" or "expected", not "good"). Doing so in their own little ways - some privately entertaining wild ideas, others making snide remarks into the vacuum or indulging once in a while - I suppose they find it to be a release after having to outwardly maintain the standards of society as best as possible.
Rebelling against whatever society happens to look like? Yeah, that sounds about right ("right" as in "typical" or "expected", not "good"). Doing so in their own little ways - some privately entertaining wild ideas, others making snide remarks into the vacuum or indulging once in a while - I suppose they find it to be a release after having to outwardly maintain the standards of society as best as possible.
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So it just all makes sense.
Well, they had two choices.
Admit they fucked up massively, or cast out unbelievers and retreat to an echo chamber.
I've always felt that from fans, regardless of politics.
The most extreme persecution of all is against people who think DS9's Dominion War arc is shit.
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