Is Disney "Star Wars" universe imploding?

[Kibbin]

And as I've suggested elsewhere, there is something about Rey, something bigger than we know with her connection to the Force. I hope JJ takes the time to explain it in IX. I really do, because I do think its important. And if, to some, that continues her being a Mary Sue... so be it.

And that is ultimately where we shall split. I have no faith that JJ has anything planned that is greater for Ray and no explanation. He is a fan of mystery boxes. Ray is thus. Some hand waving and a growing sense of something going on and no plan as to anything more than that.

 

[Campe]

And that is ultimately where we shall split. I have no faith that JJ has anything planned that is greater for Ray and no explanation. He is a fan of mystery boxes. Ray is thus. Some hand waving and a growing sense of something going on and no plan as to anything more than that.

Next December, one of us will be right. And both of us will move on with our lives.

 

[Tuskin38]

Maybe he went to Obi-Wan's place where he found lightsaber parts and Jedi journals we saw in TLJ?

According to the new canon he was told (very little) about the construction of a Jedi's lightsaber. But acting on that knowledge he used the force to find the parts he needed, and he did find some in Obi-Wan's hut shortly before ROTJ.

https://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Luke_Skywalker's_green_lightsaber#Construction

The deleted scene in ROTJ where you see him finishing his lightsaber in a cave is apparently canon now.

 

[Awesome Possum]

Yep! Cause Rey is good at everything. No explanation needed. If you want one, we'll apply some twisted logic and Throw Luke and Anakin back in your face because they're male, and insinuate you're sexist for even bringing up the issue. No questions! We are the artbitrators of truth on this board don't you know.

Who are you trying to convince? We saw the movie, you haven’t said a single accurate thing. You keep pushing this pathetic narrative that comes purely from your imagination.

 

[Awesome Possum]

100% accurate.

 

[fireproof78]

I would say the prequels are as bad as the sequels and vice versa both in writing and characterisation. I've gone into more detail on that somewhere else so I won't bog this thread down with it again. However we are told Ani can fly we see that. We are not told he can fight so we don't see him win a fight until, once again we have a gap and can fill it in for ourselves.

Yet, Rey's ability to survive on a hostile planet is not considered enough of a gap to fill it in? That's the part that boggles my mind. It's not like Rey is lounging around that AT-AT singing songs. She is having to fight to survive. Her skills are presented as part of the text of the work.

 

[TrickyDickie]

Yep! Cause Rey is good at everything. No explanation needed. If you want one, we'll apply some twisted logic and Throw Luke and Anakin back in your face because they're male, and insinuate you're sexist for even bringing up the issue. No questions! We are the artbitrators of truth on this board don't you know.

If you're going to bandy this drivel about, at least have some command of the language that you're using to make your insults. The word that is particularly egregious in your rant is "arbitrators". In that context it would be 'arbiters'.

 

[fireproof78]

If you're going to bandy this drivel about, at least have some command of the language that you're using to make your insults. The word that is particularly egregious in your rant is "arbitrators". In that context it would be 'arbiters'.

 

[TrickyDickie]

Unfortunately, that pretty much sums up the outings of the Pittsburgh Pirates of late.

 

[Ralphis]

My totally-late-to-the-party response to this thread is that even the New England Patriots lose a game every now and then. Disney-LucasFilm was bound to have a couple of hiccups eventually. If Episode IX and whatever the first movie released from the batch of upcoming Benioff/Weiss or Rian Johnson movies comes first doesn't do well at the box office, then I would wonder if maybe if Disney's ability to use the Force has diminished. I think it's a little premature to declare Star Wars dead, or imploding.

 

[TrickyDickie]

Slight further digression here:

Did You Know?

Egregious derives from the Latin word egregius, meaning "distinguished" or "eminent." In its earliest English uses, egregious was a compliment to someone who had a remarkably good quality that placed him or her eminently above others. That's how English philosopher and theorist Thomas Hobbes used it in flattering a colleague when he remarked, "I am not so egregious a mathematician as you are." Since Hobbes' day, however, the meaning of the word has become noticeably less complimentary, possibly as a result of ironic use of its original sense.

It has flipped, over time, in the opposite way from "sick".

 

[Spot261]

And that is ultimately where we shall split. I have no faith that JJ has anything planned that is greater for Ray and no explanation. He is a fan of mystery boxes. Ray is thus. Some hand waving and a growing sense of something going on and no plan as to anything more than that.

No hand waving, just presenting a story and the characters that populate it without having to literally explain and spoon feed everything in the dialogue.

Frankly if this genuinely isn't about sexism (which it is), then your faux argument boils down to "it wasn't explained clearly enough for me". I'm sorry that you aren't a fan of Star Wars taking a more adult view of it's audience and doing what good storytellers have always done. Nonetheless the best case you have offered is TLJ fails somehow by virtue of presenting information in a variety of ways and judiciously knowing when an intelligent audience can fill in the gaps.

But again, this clearly isn't the real complaint is it?

 

[JD]

It really is kind of amusing watching these guys try to come up with a legitimate sounding excuses to cover up the real reason they don't like Rey.

 

[fireproof78]

It really is kind of amusing watching these guys try to come up with a legitimate sounding excuses to cover up the real reason they don't like Rey.

Where's the popcorn?

 

[Spot261]

It really is kind of amusing watching these guys try to come up with a legitimate sounding excuses to cover up the real reason they don't like Rey.

It's not that she's a girl, it's about the way she's written, she has, er skills, and er, well the structure of the story and well, Luke should complete his arc and well, he wasn't able to, oh yes he was but it took two films and I'm sure he had at least two more hours training and Anakin was oh so very cute when he was little....

Plus SJWs

 

[fireproof78]

It's not that she's a girl, it's about the way she's written, she has, er skills, and er, well the structure of the story and well, Luke should complete his arc and well, he wasn't able to, oh yes he was but it took two films and I'm sure he had at least two more hours training and Anakin was oh so very cute when he was little....

Plus SJWs

Rey was pretty cute too. But, way overpowered

 

[Kibbin]

Yet, Rey's ability to survive on a hostile planet is not considered enough of a gap to fill it in? That's the part that boggles my mind. It's not like Rey is lounging around that AT-AT singing songs. She is having to fight to survive. Her skills are presented as part of the text of the work.

We've never countered her basic skills just the advanced ones. The idea that she is even above the norm as the main character is fine. But to me she is beyond even that.

If you're going to bandy this drivel about, at least have some command of the language that you're using to make your insults. The word that is particularly egregious in your rant is "arbitrators". In that context it would be 'arbiters'.

No hand waving, just presenting a story and the characters that populate it without having to literally explain and spoon feed everything in the dialogue.

Frankly if this genuinely isn't about sexism (which it is), then your faux argument boils down to "it wasn't explained clearly enough for me". I'm sorry that you aren't a fan of Star Wars taking a more adult view of it's audience and doing what good storytellers have always done. Nonetheless the best case you have offered is TLJ fails somehow by virtue of presenting information in a variety of ways and judiciously knowing when an intelligent audience can fill in the gaps.

But again, this clearly isn't the real complaint is it?

Or I just don't like a movie. Sometimes a bad movie is just a bad movie; a cigar is sometimes just a cigar and before you ask why I keep arguing about it it's because instead of just accepting that someone didn't like a movie you liked or even claiming said person is stupid for not liking a movie you liked you have to play the sexism card. And if I am as you claim just a big thicky then maybe I would appreciate a more streamlinned, upbeat, flashy plot from my flash gordon fanfic

 

[fireproof78]

We've never countered her basic skills just the advanced ones. The idea that she is even above the norm as the main character is fine. But to me she is beyond even that.

Agree to disagree then. I think Rey has demonstrated enormous aptitude, and ability to pick up on things quickly and is consistent with how heroes have been presented in SW since the beginning.

 

[Spot261]

Or I just don't like a movie. Sometimes a bad movie is just a bad movie; a cigar is sometimes just a cigar and before you ask why I keep arguing about it it's because instead of just accepting that someone didn't like a movie you liked or even claiming said person is stupid for not liking a movie you liked you have to play the sexism card

Strange how the majority of the fans, the general audiences and the critics completely disagree with that assessment of it being a bad movie.

But the problem is you either have some ludicrously thin straws to clutch at or it is in fact about gender.

Maybe those ludicrously thin straws are in fact your motivation and you do just have a bad case for claiming it's a bad movie, essentially because it's ever so slightly more cerebral than the norm for the franchise, but you are unfortunately mimicking the same tired faux arguments that are being used to flood Youtube with videos blatantly motivated by sexism. You've had several pages of posts to produce something better and you've simply retreated into ever weaker shreds of your case.

I'm going for the gender card here. Shoot me.

 

[JD]

We've never countered her basic skills just the advanced ones. The idea that she is even above the norm as the main character is fine. But to me she is beyond even that.

Or I just don't like a movie. Sometimes a bad movie is just a bad movie; a cigar is sometimes just a cigar and before you ask why I keep arguing about it it's because instead of just accepting that someone didn't like a movie you liked or even claiming said person is stupid for not liking a movie you liked you have to play the sexism card. And if I am as you claim just a big thicky then maybe I would appreciate a more streamlinned, upbeat, flashy plot from my flash gordon fanfic

The problem with your arguments is the same kind of things people like you are arguing about have been happening in these kinds of movies all the time, but it's never been a problem until they started doing it with women. With men they're awesome baddasses who everybody loves, but when it's a women it's suddenly unbelievable and bad writing.
Even when there is a clear, believable, explanation that is provided over, and over, you refuse to listen and keep repeating youself.