Plus he teams up with Spidey in the 70s as well then they retcon his first appearance as being (unwillingly) under the influence of drugs.
Is Daredevil Closer to a "costumed hero" or a "superhero"
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Plus he teams up with Spidey in the 70s as well then they retcon his first appearance as being (unwillingly) under the influence of drugs.
Well, my question wasn't really about Batman, it was about Iron Man. Is Iron Man is just well-equipped as well?
But I see someone else brought this up. However, my point is just that it's silly to draw such lines. Not everyone (in fact, almost no one) can pull off being Batman either. One doesn't need to be exposed to cosmic rays to be a superhero.
Batman's cosmic rays = his parents' murder.
That right there is the not-so-healthy blurring of fantasy and reality that I mentioned earlier. It's hard to have an argument on this topic with somebody who actually thinks that.
To answer your question: You're "anyone"...try it.
Indeed, drug retcon notwithstanding, Spidey and the Punisher had come to terms with each other by the end of that first story. It was a recurring element in those days for somebody who thought they were the good guy to go after Spidey because they thought he was a murderer (Iceman, Luke Cage, etc.).
I was talking about in comics, not the real world.
Are there any characters that don't count as superheroes? Is someone like Nick Fury a superhero?
I don't see why not. What's your problem with him being a superhero? It sounds like your only objection is you don't want too many of them.
It's not that I don't want them to be. I just always pictured superheroes to be a different class of heroes. While Batman, Nick Fury, and John Constantine are heroes, Daredevil and Superman are superheroes. Give Daredevil Batman's gear and he could do all the things that hero could do, and he has radar sense to boot.
Though I'll except concensus beliefs and count them all as superheroes.
Though I'll except concensus beliefs and count them all as superheroes.
There's a phrase in French that's borrowed into English, that I think applies to the question of what superheros are, which is je ne sais quoi. Superheros without superpowers per se, like Batman, Green Arrow, and the Question, still all have a certain je ne sais quoi that makes them superheros.
I think that what makes a superhero is that they do whatever it takes to accomplish good deeds beyond what people can accomplish in their absence. However, having said that, there are probably exceptions to what I said, which is why it's so hard to define, and hence, je ne sais quoi.
It's really more like, you know it when you see it. Also, like so many things, it's best defined by the examples that exist in media, rather than by trying to think up a definition that will ultimately exclude legitimate examples (descriptive versus prescriptive definition).
I think that what makes a superhero is that they do whatever it takes to accomplish good deeds beyond what people can accomplish in their absence. However, having said that, there are probably exceptions to what I said, which is why it's so hard to define, and hence, je ne sais quoi.
It's really more like, you know it when you see it. Also, like so many things, it's best defined by the examples that exist in media, rather than by trying to think up a definition that will ultimately exclude legitimate examples (descriptive versus prescriptive definition).
Right back at you:I was talking about in comics, not the real world.
. Even in the comics, there are masses of ordinary people who need to be saved by extraordinary people like Batman. Ask Dick Grayson how easy it is to become Batman...he had issues for years because he didn't measure up to his mentor's standard.Even within a comics continuity chock full of people with superhuman abilities, Batman is an extraordinary individual with extraordinary abilities who uses extraordinary methods. It's just an in-story conceit that characters like him are said to have no powers...they're just as extraordinary as the characters who are supposed to have superhuman powers.
Within his world, he might not be considered one, though one could give him a label like "super-spy". But from our perspective, he's somebody who operates on a superheroic level in a superhero universe.
Right back at you:I was talking about in comics, not the real world.
Even within a comics continuity chock full of people with superhuman abilities, Batman is an extraordinary individual with extraordinary abilities who uses extraordinary methods. It's just an in-story conceit that characters like him are said to have no powers...they're just as extraordinary as the characters who are supposed to have superhuman powers.
Within his world, he might not be considered one, though one could give him a label like "super-spy". But from our perspective, he's somebody who operates on a superheroic level in a superhero universe.
He's might not be a superhero but he's certain not 'normal' given that he's must be nearly a hundred and still active due to super-science intervention.
Indeed
Conan O'Brien to the contrary, Batman's superpower is not that he goes to the gym a lot, it's that he's very, very rich.
Because guns are what millions of people have. If this was the twelfth century, it would indeed be arrows and swords. But not claws.
Agree that Punisher isn't a superhero because anyone can pick up a gun. Disagree that costumes, code names, different identities are essential to being a superhero. And I would add that the skill set is usually alleged, frequently not even shown. Superheroes like Batman, Green Arrrow, Hawkeye and Black Widow routinely avoid the threat of being shot, usually without even a commonplace kevlar vest. That is a superpower, even if it isn't openly acknowledged. The so-called explanation of their superior skill is just, in the phrase upthread, an in-story conceit.
Unlike Daredevil, who officially has his radar superpower, Iron Man really is a borderline case, taking the armor literally. But Tony Stark disappears, and the armor is Iron Man. That's why villains have never rushed to their chemical weapons stores. Or even simply upped the ante, seeking a weapon with enough concussion to harm a man inside.
Very nicely put. For characters who don't have openly acknowledged superpowers, their sangfroid comes from their unofficial but infallible power not to get shot. In my opinion.
Wait, what? Everything I've said was in reference to comics and movies. Saying "Right back at you", I assume you meant the reality of fantasy? Me and my friends talk about Superman verse Goku (and other random characters) all the time. How is that unhealthy?Right back at you:I was talking about in comics, not the real world.
There was nothing in your post to put your statement in that context. Taken on its own, it was an incredibly silly/reality-impaired thing to say. I was the one who should have been using an eye-roll when you posted it.
Reality-impaired? It would be great if you linked something I said to that, that would remotely imply that I am reality-impaired.
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Marvel and DC share the copyright on "Super-Hero", so Marvel and DC characters are "super-heroes" and other publishers heroes are "costumed heroes".
Problem solved.
Problem solved.
You seem to be losing track of what we're talking about. I'll refresh your memory.
This "conversation" is just running in circles at this point, so don't let me take you away from your patrol of Gotham City tonight.
If you think I'm patrolling Gotham, you have reality issues. I never said real life. Here's that full sentence:
Did you really think I meant a person in the real world could fight Darkseid?
Trademark, not copyright. Entire works are copyrighted; titles, words, and logos are trademarked. And that just means that the trademark owner has the exclusive right to use the term in titles or advertising. Other creators besides DC and Marvel are free to use the word "superhero" in the dialogue of a story (as I did in Only Superhuman) as long as they don't put it in the title or in an advertising slogan. (And the trademark doesn't seem to be enforced that much. The cover blurb and promotional quotes for Only Superhuman mention superheroes more than once, and nobody from DC or Marvel complained about it.)
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