Yes, but it's not goodbye yet with this crew. 
I officially began my journey through all Star Trek on October 9th...
- Thread starter Shalashaska
- Start date
Yes, but it's not goodbye yet with this crew.
But it might be best left as such....
Well you're in luck because you're going to be seeing a lot more of them.
True.
I'm anticipating watching Generations soon, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I'm a little cautious after all I've heard.
Still, it'll be an event of its own just seeing these characters on a big feature film budget and not confined to the same camera angles and visuals that television restricted them to. And I've definitely had enough of those damned black bars on the left and right side of my screen!
Generations is weird. Some parts of it are really really excellent. In part for some of the more cinematic camera angles and shooting. Mainly marred by a few not so excellent moments that it is infamous for. And it has a lot of call backs to TNG episodes. Before you watch that one it may pay to rewatch "Family". (For an added bonus you may want to mentally refresh the B plot of "Thine Own Self" although rewatching it is not necessary or recommended) The movie really is an Easter Egg hunt at times.
Also be warned that as they move forward into the movies, the writers and design people did not maintain perfect continuity with the TV series at all times. It's little details from sets to common or unique specific objects that have been seen before suddenly being radically redesigned. It pays to keep an open mind and just accept it for what it is, a different design team and better budgets, rather than trying to shoehorn it into some rigid in universe continuity. I'm sure we will talk about it at great length after you have seen Generations. It's one that inspires a lot of discussion. Good, Bad and Strange.
But it might be best left as such....
Nah! I'll give them that First Contact would have been a good worthy ending. Insurrection gets a worse rap then it deserves. It's mainly inoffensive. Mainly. And we will burn down the bridge to Nemesis and pee on it's ashes when we come to it.
The one downside to the BluRay version is you can also see the slow deterioration of the Enterprise-D studio model(s) over time. Something that was never that visible in the lower def releases or broadcast. The thin Polystyrene skin of the ship distorts a bit over time so you can start seeing the underlying skeleton beneath it. It adds a bit to the paneling effect and makes the ship look more weathered by the end. It is also really noticeable (at least to we ship and model fetishists
types). It can really be seen in Generations as well. (Although part of that is they pulled the old 6' model out of storage and it had not aged well.) They deliberately left the outcome vague. They do that a lot with Garak. Garak was simply an occasionally recurring background and exposition character up until this point. The Wire marks when they start using him better. And is one of the series best episodes.
If you liked Preemptive Strike and Conspiracy you will largely like the direction and tone DS9 starts heading in from Season 3 onwards. As you are starting to see DS9 is starting to figure out how to play in the grey areas. TNG was often stories about ethics and morality and clear light vs dark. DS9 is about Realpolitik. About the greys. About the tradeoffs and costs.
Also when you set your schedule, All Good Things is not really a 2 part episode. It is more akin to a 2 hour tv movie. Aired originally as a single 2 hour presentation. While they did split it up for later syndication, it isn't like most of the TNG 2 parters that have that natural break point in the middle. So plan bathroom breaks accordingly.
Basically you have to accept that the movies are not the series. They are designed to engage movie goers who may not have seen (or at least closely followed) the show.
would explain some of those "errors"?
Surely the fact that
they have a new Enterprise
Vice versa.
Granted I was in an altered state the first time I saw Nemesis but I thought it was awesome. That first impression stuck, even though I can see it's not perfect I'll watch it any day. Generations isn't a great overall movie but has some epic moments. The only TNG movie I can never get into is Insurrection, it's not bad or anything it just doesn't do much for me. People often say it just feels like a really long TNG episode and that's pretty much how I feel. The problem is that to me it feels like a pretty forgettable/generic TNG episode. First Contact is my favorite though and it was the first TNG thing I ever saw. For many years it was just the TOS era stuff, Kirk only, I never had any interest in Captain Baldy McAccent. Then about 14/15 years ago or so I saw First Contact on cable one morning and decided I needed to check that TNG thing out. Picard is awesome in that one.
You probably forgot but back in Season 1 they did separate the saucer in Arsenal Of Freedom, and without giving much away you will see a saucer separation in one of the films.
Basically at some point not long after Best of Both Worlds Rick Berman canned the regular staff composer and ordered them to use stock music instead. No one is really sure why.
The saucer separation is kind of sad in why we never saw that much of it. Aside from it being a clear gimmick. The only model equipped to do it was the original 6' Ent D filming model (along with a close up neck model.). That 6' model weighed about as much as a small car and was a horror to work with. Saucer Separation involved a lot of people doing some very heavy and precarious lifting of some very expensive models. By the third season they had retired the unwieldy 6' model and had built the newer 4' lightweight studio model. This is why after BoBW's the Enterprise looks subtly different to those with sharp eyes. They didn't give the new model the ability to separate (that was part of what added all the unwieldy weight.) The 4' model could be lifted by one person and carried by two. The 4' model also had better anchor points so the ship could be filmed from more angles. It's sad that just at the moment they could film better space scenes with the ship, they got rid of the exciting and dynamic music to back them up.
In another way to mark the end of an era, one of your next DS9 episodes, "The Jem'Hadar" marks the first appearance of a 3d digital CGI model of a Galaxy Class ship. Throughout DS9 they slowly converted most of the existing Studio Models to a digital format. The only exception being the Refit Connie. Which they opted to leave to movies only.
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Arsenal of Freedom showed how tactically silly separation was. In order to make it work, the Enterprise would need to remove itself far, far from the scene to put the saucer somewhere it would be safe under impulse power.
Best of both Worlds?
Best of both Worlds?
Granted, that wasn't it's intended purpose but it was a tactical application of the separation.
Which were subsequently contradicted by Emissary and First Contact: the Borg were far from confused by multiple attackers.Best of both Worlds?
Best of both Worlds?
Granted, that wasn't it's intended purpose but it was a tactical application of the separation.
Best of both Worlds?
Best of both Worlds?
Granted, that wasn't it's intended purpose but it was a tactical application of the separation.
I'd forgotten they did it in Best Of Both Worlds, but they did separate in Arsenal Of Freedom also. When Geordi is in charge he has Logan take the saucer section to safety while he returns to the planet with the drive section.
That wasn't the point.
Riker's strategy was to confuse actually Picard and, counting on the Borg expecting a different strategy all together based on Riker's earlier tactical recommendation. As with everything they had to adapt to something they didn't expect before being able to deal with it.
The point was to have two attackers to confuse the Borg, allowing the Enterprise to board the cube. The plan is in no way easier because of the multiple ships given what we end up seeing of the Borg.
I'm willing to accept that Piller wanted to put out a strategy that could be easily explained in a few seconds to a '90s television audience. In that sense, I can let it pass. That said, separation would be no tactical advantage. The cube would pound the stardrive/battle bridge section to dust until it was ready to carve up the saucer section. Indeed, it did much more at Wolf 359. Dare I say that BOBT exhibited "two-dimensional thinking?"
It wasn't just the saucer separation tactic that was used to distract the Borg, but also the antimatter fireworks show that the saucer put on.
Initially I think that was Shelby's plan, before Wolf 359. When they actually executed the plan it was a deception disguised within another deception. Picard had been briefed on Shelby's plan much to Riker's dismay at the time. So when they separated Locutus (with Shelby's briefing in his memory) thought they were trying to deceive him and focused on the drive section instead. This made it easier to get the shuttlecraft close to the cube. Riker was counting on Locutus thinking it was a deception. I don't think it was that Locutus was confused by 2 targets, it's that in thinking he knew what the plan was he chose to ignore the saucer and focus on the drive section.
Let's be honest. The whole point of Saucer Seperation of the Galaxy class or the later Prometheus "Multi Vector" abilities was to look cool and give some added motion to the models. From a tactical or practical point of view none of it makes any sense. These were always "What can we do that they have never seen before?" rather than "How much sense does it make?"
[Qbelieve t="Griffeytrek, post: 11602055, member: 70219"]Let's be honest. The whole point of Saucer Seperation of the Galaxy class or the later Prometheus "Multi Vector" abilities was to look cool and give some added motion to the models. From a tactical or practical point of view none of it makes any sense. These were always "What can we do that they have never seen before?" rather than "How much sense does it make?"[/QUOTE]
I believe this is consistent with what I have written. The disagreement focuses on whether the attack and boarding of the cube justifies separation as a tactic. Given how much we must squint in order to make sense of the plan, and especially in the light of subsequent episodes and movies, BOBW doesn't exonerate separation. In the context of the episode it is cute and expedient. In the context of the franchise it is anomalous rather than indicative.
I believe this is consistent with what I have written. The disagreement focuses on whether the attack and boarding of the cube justifies separation as a tactic. Given how much we must squint in order to make sense of the plan, and especially in the light of subsequent episodes and movies, BOBW doesn't exonerate separation. In the context of the episode it is cute and expedient. In the context of the franchise it is anomalous rather than indicative.
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