I don't understand the hate Disco gets / still gets.

[The Wormhole]

NO ONE liked or trusted Burnham, she had direct conflict with Saru and Detmer,

I wouldn't say Michael had direct conflict with Detmer, the two of them just bumped into each other in the mess hall and had an awkward moment. By the time the Harry Mudd Groundhog Day Time Loop episode rolled around (just four episodes later), we see Detmer smile and nod her head at Michael as she walks by, so it's obvious those two were back on friendly terms already.

 

[TedShatner10]

I feel much the same way. They have been smacked around and treated like shit enough that they will not step out of the safe and secure. It isn't just being told "You made a bad product." That is at least changeable. They were told "You ruined Star Trek." "You destroyed something great!" "You don't get it, don't understand it, don't respect it. No one has every done this before."

The transparant/blatant review bombing aimed at DSCO and PIC is obscuring all the legitimate reviews, creative feedback, and constructive criticism, although at the same time DSCO being a much different show now and SNW being a TNG revamp in TOS' skin may have had far more to do with all the creative rumblings in the writer's room when DSCO's S2 was first streamed...

 

[cooleddie74]

DSC stuck the landing this year a lot better than PIC did. And I mean a lot better. DSC was simply the better series this year and it was the series' best season thus far. Species 10-C was one of the best things to happen to the show.

 

[TedShatner10]

PIC had a much better S1 mind you, swings and roundabouts, though its 2nd season felt like the producers blatently shaking up things for its 3rd, final season.

 

[fireproof78]

The transparant/blatant review bombing aimed at DSCO and PIC is obscuring all the legitimate reviews, creative feedback, and constructive criticism, although at the same time DSCO being a much different show now and SNW being a TNG revamp in TOS' skin may have had far more to do with all the creative rumblings in the writer's room when DSCO's S2 was first streamed...

I think it comes down to stability. Discovery had known the first two seasons, as well as getting the stuffing kicked out of it. It could do no right, as Lord Garth aptly notes, because it was the only target. Now that there are several Trek shows the producers feel less on the defensive and far more free to explore what they want to rather than tip toeing around.

I am highly doubtful there will ever be something Discovery Season 1 or Picard Season 1 again. The review bombing and out and out hatred expressed leaves deeper wounds than perhaps will be admitted, save for in the safe way the shows are produced.

 

[Phoenix219]

I'm going to go out on a limb here. After watching the latest SNW and taking some time to mull it over, the NuTrek I've enjoyed the most overall is .. Star Trek Discovery S1 - up until the Mirror arc went south.

I think Discovery was on to something, but they moved further away from it's original concept once season 2 rolled around and the writers took a fresh stab at the story after wrapping up what Fuller had left them.

I haven't disliked Discovery from the get-go; I think I've been particularly harsh because there was a lot of potential at the outset.

It's a pity, because I'm starting to think they've overcorrected with SNW.

It had so much potential. Mirror Lorca could have been an actual reformist actually seeking to bring Federation ideals to his Empire.... or at least it could have been the dangling question. He did bad things..... with good intentions. The Emperess should have played on her connection to Michael. It should have been a big tug of war between the two of them, the big gamble. The Emperess that looks like her mother figure, or the guy that she thought was her Captain, who has been lying the whole time, but with good intentions. They could have showed that a "dark human" and a "light Terran" were really not so different at all. I hope Prime Lorca is the exact same way we saw Mirror Lorca.

The end of the Mirror Arc should have been Lorca being installed as the new leader of the Empire, promising reforms, but the last shot of him is revealing a secret panel, and using the Tantalus Device to remove an opponent.

 

[fireproof78]

It had so much potential. Mirror Lorca could have been an actual reformist actually seeking to bring Federation ideals to his Empire.... or at least it could have been the dangling question. He did bad things..... with good intentions. The Emperess should have played on her connection to Michael. It should have been a big tug of war between the two of them, the big gamble. The Emperess that looks like her mother figure, or the guy that she thought was her Captain, who has been lying the whole time, but with good intentions. They could have showed that a "dark human" and a "light Terran" were really not so different at all. I hope Prime Lorca is the exact same way we saw Mirror Lorca.

The end of the Mirror Arc should have been Lorca being installed as the new leader of the Empire, promising reforms, but the last shot of him is revealing a secret panel, and using the Tantalus Device to remove an opponent.

I'm sure some fan somewhere will write this up.

 

[Phoenix219]

1. Black woman lead.
2. Features the gays prominently.
3. It's a Star Trek prequel (originally) that plays loose with continuity.

Those are the three reasons people hate it so passionately, with one or two switching places depending upon preference. Three only takes precedence (and in some cases 1 and 2 ignored completely) with the more ...special... Trek fan who MUST watch EVERYTHING and reference their complete set of The Official Star Trek Fact Files frequently throughout.

Everyone else just... doesn't watch what they don't like

I don't have any obsessive files, books, lists, or memorized knowledge, but this is *absolutely* the reason for me - I fell in love with TOS in the 80s, grew up immersed in it, and my return to the fandom after at least 10-15 years away was because of TOS fan films. I truly wish / think they could have respected the "time period" aesthetics a lot better. I loved Axanar, until the antics of its production team shat away all the good will they had earned. A series of historical shorts done in that style, sticking to canon looks and styles, could have been groundbreaking.

Re: DSC, the design of the Klingon ships, the weird blue uniforms, etc, threw me off from the very beginning. (The uniforms are fine as an interim between ENT and TOS, but the show should have been set 30-50 years prior for this to work.)

 

[fireproof78]

A series of historical shorts done in that style, sticking to canon looks and styles, could have been groundbreaking.

And would have only been sold to a small group of fans.

 

[TedShatner10]

I am highly doubtful there will ever be something Discovery Season 1 or Picard Season 1 again. The review bombing and out and out hatred expressed leaves deeper wounds than perhaps will be admitted, save for in the safe way the shows are pWhile Lorca got wasted as a Terran charicature, the Terran Empire stuff in DSCO generally stood tge test of time better than the attempted Klingon revamp...roduced.

I definitely think the overly negative enraged fanboi response to DSCO's troubled first season was a painful inspiration for DSCO as it exists now and the very inception of SNW in DSCO's second season.

I'm not sure about PIC (I think it was fallout from Chabon's creative imput and issues).

While Lorca got wasted as a Terran charicature, the Terran Empire stuff in DSCO generally stood the test of time better than the attempted Klingon revamp...

 

[Dee1891]

I don't regard "DISCOVERY"'s first season as "troubled". It's the only season of this series that I had truly enjoyed. I would have enjoyed Season Two, if it were not for the prolonged appearances of Pike and Spike. Talk about overrated characters.

 

[fireproof78]

I don't regard "DISCOVERY"'s first season as "troubled". It's the only season of this series that I had truly enjoyed. I would have enjoyed Season Two, if it were not for the prolonged appearances of Pike and Spike. Talk about overrated characters.

It's troubled from a BTS perspective.

And Spock overrated?

Pike has always been my favorite but I knew that was an unusual opinion. But, Spock? That's a new one.

 

[plynch]

Not overrated. Just overdone. Done. To. Death.

DSC S1, brand new protagonist, AND SHE’S SPOCK’S SISTER!
S2: SPOCK’s HERE! And more TOS legacy characters. And his ship.
SNW: ongoing soap opera about SPOCK and his girlfriend.

Though I love Ethan Peck as Spock.

 

[fireproof78]

Not overrated. Just overdone. Done. To. Death.

DSC S1, brand new protagonist, AND SHE’S SPOCK’S SISTER!
S2: SPOCK’s HERE! And more TOS legacy characters. And his ship.
SNW: ongoing soap opera about SPOCK and his girlfriend.

Though I love Ethan Peck as Spock.

To each their own.

Spock is better than almost all other Trek characters combined, with the few exceptions. More of him is never a problem for me.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

It's troubled from a BTS perspective.

Which member of BTS troubles you, in particular? Jungkook? Jimin? RM? Suga? It's Suga, isn't it? He's the bad boy.

 

[cooleddie74]

At least he's not a BTA man.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[Locutus of Bored]

That's a deep cut, Zammis.

 

[cooleddie74]

 

[Richard S. Ta]

I don't regard "DISCOVERY"'s first season as "troubled". It's the only season of this series that I had truly enjoyed.

If you read into the amount of drama, rewrites, direction changes, personnel changes etc. that happened behind the scenes, then 'troubled' is an understatement. Whether or not you liked it is immaterial in view of the fact that the production process was far from smooth. It's amazing how well it all turned out in retrospect.

I enjoy Season 1 of DSC, but it was troubled in terms of what happened off-screen.

 

[DigificWriter]

I enjoy Season 1 of DSC, but it was troubled in terms of what happened off-screen.

Not everyone is going to agree that production shakeups fit the definition of 'trouble'.