I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis again
- Thread starter GalaxyX
- Start date
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
The whole battle sequence is amazing graphic wise. I can see where most of the leftover budget (after Patrick and Spiner stole their cuts) went to.
I loved the speech Picard gives Shinzon. He should have accepted it. Having Shinzon reject Picard's offer did not flow with the scene.
The whole battle sequence is amazing graphic wise. I can see where most of the leftover budget (after Patrick and Spiner stole their cuts) went to.
I loved the speech Picard gives Shinzon. He should have accepted it. Having Shinzon reject Picard's offer did not flow with the scene.
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
Eeep. You're brave. I haven't seen it since the first and only time. It was just so, so, badly done
Sign me ...
T/W shipper and so much about Nemisis annoyed me that Troi not ending up with Worf was actually pretty far down on the list.
Eeep. You're brave. I haven't seen it since the first and only time. It was just so, so, badly done
Sign me ...
T/W shipper and so much about Nemisis annoyed me that Troi not ending up with Worf was actually pretty far down on the list.
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
Ya that must have eaten up alot of the budget. It really was pretty well done.
So I am just curious was Nemesis as bad as you remember, better, or worse?
Ya that must have eaten up alot of the budget. It really was pretty well done.
So I am just curious was Nemesis as bad as you remember, better, or worse?
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
Yeah, that's always irked me a bit. It seemed like he didn't quite understand how bad it was. He was probably glad to have been beamed off the ship, saved him some embarrassment.LMAO!!!!!
I just saw the whole sex scene. It was pretty bad, but I usually don't like sex scenes in movies (there's enough porn out there for people, I don't need it shoehorned in my movies). The mind rape was creepy and pointless.
But what made me burst out laughing was Picard "Permission denied. If you can endure more of the assaults you'd greatly help us". Pardon me but I must stand up and go HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH
What?????? you're asking a rape victim to endure being raped again for the benefit of your Captain??? Who wrote this shit?? Obviously someone with Troi rape fantasies apparently. This whole scene was just uncalled for
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
I hate the whole wedding scene. It's just goofy and painful and forced. I remember being at the theater and feeling embarrassed and I was surrounded by other Star Trek fans!!!
What really sucks about Nemesis is that the idea and basic storyline are very promising. Picard has clone and questions about who we really are can be discussed. The Romulans, a race not seen much in the movies at all, is used so there is new stuff to learn about, etc.
It is like they tried and worked hard to come up with the original concept of the movie but when it came to the real writing they just gave up and threw some crap together.
The worst part is that 1/3 if not 1/2 the movie is devoted to the battle at the end. The CGi and everything is great but it just goes on way too long. The movie was short to begin with but when the battle lasts that long I get the feeling they just are filling time with cool explosions because the story just isn't strong enough.
So in short, the movie showed a lot of promis but the execution of it sucked and we got the lame product that resulted.
I hate the whole wedding scene. It's just goofy and painful and forced. I remember being at the theater and feeling embarrassed and I was surrounded by other Star Trek fans!!!
What really sucks about Nemesis is that the idea and basic storyline are very promising. Picard has clone and questions about who we really are can be discussed. The Romulans, a race not seen much in the movies at all, is used so there is new stuff to learn about, etc.
It is like they tried and worked hard to come up with the original concept of the movie but when it came to the real writing they just gave up and threw some crap together.
The worst part is that 1/3 if not 1/2 the movie is devoted to the battle at the end. The CGi and everything is great but it just goes on way too long. The movie was short to begin with but when the battle lasts that long I get the feeling they just are filling time with cool explosions because the story just isn't strong enough.
So in short, the movie showed a lot of promis but the execution of it sucked and we got the lame product that resulted.
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
^^^ I totally agree.
The wedding scene could have worked at the end of the movie, shorter and without the lame jokes.
Anyway, I'm about to finish watching the movie. As usual, comments will be posted, and after I see it all I will recap some of my thoughts.
^^^ I totally agree.
The wedding scene could have worked at the end of the movie, shorter and without the lame jokes.
Anyway, I'm about to finish watching the movie. As usual, comments will be posted, and after I see it all I will recap some of my thoughts.
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
You know, this movie is becoming a pain to watch. Even the action sequences are so lifeless.
I burst out laughing at Shinzon's "Hard to port!!" command. It reminded me of that Nemesis Pictorial on the Stardestroyer site: "What was that? Oh yes, turn left! I mean, HARD TO PORT! Even though we're not moving with our main engines, so we'll just sort of wallow around like a beached whale ..."
You know, this movie is becoming a pain to watch. Even the action sequences are so lifeless.
I burst out laughing at Shinzon's "Hard to port!!" command. It reminded me of that Nemesis Pictorial on the Stardestroyer site: "What was that? Oh yes, turn left! I mean, HARD TO PORT! Even though we're not moving with our main engines, so we'll just sort of wallow around like a beached whale ..."
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
Well, they shamelessly stole that impaling sequence from LOTR. Just how stupid did they think the audience was going to be not to catch that?
And Data dies. Wow, practically any hope I had for liking this movie died at that moment.
Well, they shamelessly stole that impaling sequence from LOTR. Just how stupid did they think the audience was going to be not to catch that?
And Data dies. Wow, practically any hope I had for liking this movie died at that moment.
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
Ok, just finished watching it.
I don't know what to say. I almost liked it more than I did the first time I saw it. There's a lot to like. What totally kills the movie is the horribly depressing way it ends with Data's death. Another thing it suffers from is being too much like Generations in its format and formula.
It's like these guys sat down and went thru a checklist:
"Ok guys, what do you think the fans are going to enjoy watching in this one?" "Hey I know, Riker and Troi getting married will be great" "Also let's have a bunch of technobabbly scenes here and there that the fans know and love!"
"And don't forget to have an enemy that is simply misunderstood, etc etc." Oh and the death of Data!! that's going to be a heart wrenching scene!! the fans will eat it up!!
Soooo now that I've talked about the bad stuff in the movie, I'm going to talk about what I feel would have been a much better story to tell.
Of course it would have been nice if Paramount wouldn't have been such dicks and ponied up the cash for a decent action film (So NOW you learn your lesson with Star Trek IX huh assholes?).
It would also have been nice if Patrick Stewart and Brent Spiner wouldn't have been such dicks themselves, and accepted a decent cut for their roles. I'm reminded of Terminator 3, and how Arnie put up the 2 million to do that Crane/Firetruck scene out of his own damn pocket!! He cared that much about the movie, what a class act!
But assuming that we had to stick with the same basic budget, and the same basic storyline, with the same actors, I would have done something like this:
- The intro is fine. Still do the whole Romulan Senate attack, but expand on it. Have the Romulans send several of their D'eridex Warbirds to confront the Schimitar. An expanded battle sequence where the Schimitar friggin' pwns several Romulan Warbirds would have shown how bad ass this guy is (but don't show who he is yet).
- The Romulans knowing they are screwed, cave in and ask the Federation for help. The Titan is dispatched, commanded by Captain Riker (and some no name extras). Have the Titan be a Galaxy Class Ship to make us Galaxy Class lovers happy.
- The Titan gets there not knowing what it's up against, but in hopes of some diplomacy. Riker gets there and finds the Schimitar, but doesn't get attacked. Instead, Shinzon demands to speak to Picard. Riker states that Picard is still in the Alpha Quadrant. Shinzon demands to speak to only Picard, or he will attack the Federation starting with the Titan. Riker communicates with Starfleet. Janeway can still do her cameo.
- The Enterprise gets introduced. Picard is still captain. Data is now #1. Geordi is still Chief Engineer. Troi is still with them. They get the urgent message from Starfleet explaining the whole situation. Picard and company maximum warp to Romulus.
- They get there and Shinzon finally introduces himself on the viewscreen. He is NOT a smug cocky punk, but rather this sad looking character. Everyone on both bridges stands in shock at how much this guy looks like Picard. Picard says his typical line "Why have you committed these acts of aggression? And what do you want with me specifically?" "Shinzon goes, "I think Captain, that is pretty obvious to you, would you like to discuss it over dinner?" Picard reluctantly accepts despite warnings from Riker and the others.
Shinzon explains the whole thing to Picard, the dilithium mine bit, the Remans, etc etc. and tells Picard that he attacked the Romulans as an act of revenge, but he wishes no harm to the Federation and only wanted to meet Picard.
Picard is torn. He cannot accept that this war criminal is a clone of himself and doesn't know what to do.
Shinzon starts having the effects of his DNA breaking down.
Beverly finds out why. He is starting to age rapidly and needs Picard's blood to stabilize. Shinzon still links with Troi, but does it in the turbolift and all he gets to do is lay a forced kiss on her before the interruption. Troi discusses it with Picard and Riker. Picard DOES NOT ask her to endure more of it. Instead he realizes that Shinzon may have no redemption. As he thinks this, he gets beamed out by Shinzon. The whole thing plays out like in the movie, except Picard is able to escape on his own discreetly, no firefight until he gets to the shuttle.
Shinzon, now looking older, screams at the viewscreen that if Picard does not come back, he will destroy the nearest planet, which has a pre warp civilization, and to show he means business jumps to warp to the planet.
Both the Enterprise and the Titan warp in pursuit, unsure of what to do. On route they are met with several D'eridex Warbirds. The Romulans are offering to help! Picard gladly accepts and feels that 2 Federation Ships and 3-4 Romulan Ships might have a chance at stopping Shinzon.
They get to the planet to find Shinzon firing at the surface. They waste no time and all 5 ships start blasting away. All 5 ships take a beating, and the Romulan ships start to break down, as well as the Enterprise and the Titan. They manage to drop shields on one side of the Schimitar. They sneak some Federation and Romulan forces in (Riker and Data among them) and have their corridor fight with the Remans on their ship. Data manages to free Picard, but Shinzon comes in at the same time with some Remans. Data fights off the Remans, and Shinzon fights Picard. In the fight they jump into the transporter and are beamed down to the planet by accident.
They have beamed to what looks like a military compound on the planet, with primitive looking dune buggies. Shinzon realizes he doesn't have a communicator, so he jumps into a Dune buggy and speeds away. Picard has no choice but to do the same to follow him. A chase ensues with natives from the planet following them both shooting their machine guns. The Remans track Shinzon and beam him back up to the Schimitar, and the Enterprise does the same with Picard.
Both back on their ships, Shinzon shows up on the viewscreen, now looking as old as Picard (with Patrick Stewart playing him) and starts pounding on the Enterprise, punches a hole thru the Shields and beams out Deanna. He threatens to finish what he started with her unless Picard beams over again and their forces stand down.
Shinzon starts groping on Deanna again while she's tied up, and Picard gives up and beams over. Shinzon right away takes him over to the medlab, but on the way starts having convulsions. Picard takes him and tries to save him but it's too late for him. As Shinzon is dying he screams out a self destruct sequence which activates. Riker and Picard both stay, Riker to look for Deanna, and Picard to look for Data.
Riker finds Deanna and unties her, and they kiss for a moment and then run to the nearest transport pad, and beam out.
Picard can't find Data, and can't disable the self destruct. As he's looking for Data he gets captured by some Remans who are about to kill him when Data shows up and kicks their asses. Having only seconds to go, and more Remans on their tail, Data screams at Picard to get to the transporter pad while he is keeping the Remans busy. Picard at first doesn't want to do it, but Data insists and Picard does and beams away.
Picard back on the Enterprise struggles to find Data's signature to beam him off the ship, but alas, it's too late, the Schimitar blows up into a million pieces, Data along with it. Everyone has their somber scene, sad at the death of their friend. The Romulans say their piece. Picard and crew goes to meet them in the shuttle bay, and alas, Data steps out of a shuttle, alive and well. Troi cries tears of happiness. Riker and Geordi look massively relieved. The Romulans explain that their were able to get their sensors back up on time, and scanned the Schimitar seconds before it exploded and rescued their Romulan party that was still alive, finding no human life sign, but detecting Data's Positronic systems, beamed him out in the nick of time.
Everyone has a moment of relief, hugs abound all around, even from the Romulans. Riker and Troi make an announcement: They have decided, right there that they are going to get married.
Cut to the Wedding scene. Everyone is there. Picard says his lines about friendship. Riker says a word about how when Troi was captured, the thought of never seeing her again broke him, and how he would never let her get away from him again, etc etc.
Data can sing his gay song while everyone applauds. Wesley appears. Picard in surprise looks at him and said "Wesley! It's been a long time, how are your adventures treating you?" to which Wesley responds "Well Captain, we can discuss it at length some other time, but I came because I couldn't stay away from such a momentous occasion of my friends joining in marriage"
Everyone's faces light up, and Wesley sits down to speak with Guinan, Geordi, Worf, and company as the Camera pulls away from them and well see that in the wedding, there are Romulans present as guests, enjoying a good time with the rest of the people there, and the Camera keeps pulling away again to show the Enterprise in Spacedock, and Music and Credits roll.....
Ok, just finished watching it.
I don't know what to say. I almost liked it more than I did the first time I saw it. There's a lot to like. What totally kills the movie is the horribly depressing way it ends with Data's death. Another thing it suffers from is being too much like Generations in its format and formula.
It's like these guys sat down and went thru a checklist:
"Ok guys, what do you think the fans are going to enjoy watching in this one?" "Hey I know, Riker and Troi getting married will be great" "Also let's have a bunch of technobabbly scenes here and there that the fans know and love!"
"And don't forget to have an enemy that is simply misunderstood, etc etc." Oh and the death of Data!! that's going to be a heart wrenching scene!! the fans will eat it up!!
Soooo now that I've talked about the bad stuff in the movie, I'm going to talk about what I feel would have been a much better story to tell.
Of course it would have been nice if Paramount wouldn't have been such dicks and ponied up the cash for a decent action film (So NOW you learn your lesson with Star Trek IX huh assholes?).
It would also have been nice if Patrick Stewart and Brent Spiner wouldn't have been such dicks themselves, and accepted a decent cut for their roles. I'm reminded of Terminator 3, and how Arnie put up the 2 million to do that Crane/Firetruck scene out of his own damn pocket!! He cared that much about the movie, what a class act!
But assuming that we had to stick with the same basic budget, and the same basic storyline, with the same actors, I would have done something like this:
- The intro is fine. Still do the whole Romulan Senate attack, but expand on it. Have the Romulans send several of their D'eridex Warbirds to confront the Schimitar. An expanded battle sequence where the Schimitar friggin' pwns several Romulan Warbirds would have shown how bad ass this guy is (but don't show who he is yet).
- The Romulans knowing they are screwed, cave in and ask the Federation for help. The Titan is dispatched, commanded by Captain Riker (and some no name extras). Have the Titan be a Galaxy Class Ship to make us Galaxy Class lovers happy.
- The Titan gets there not knowing what it's up against, but in hopes of some diplomacy. Riker gets there and finds the Schimitar, but doesn't get attacked. Instead, Shinzon demands to speak to Picard. Riker states that Picard is still in the Alpha Quadrant. Shinzon demands to speak to only Picard, or he will attack the Federation starting with the Titan. Riker communicates with Starfleet. Janeway can still do her cameo.
- The Enterprise gets introduced. Picard is still captain. Data is now #1. Geordi is still Chief Engineer. Troi is still with them. They get the urgent message from Starfleet explaining the whole situation. Picard and company maximum warp to Romulus.
- They get there and Shinzon finally introduces himself on the viewscreen. He is NOT a smug cocky punk, but rather this sad looking character. Everyone on both bridges stands in shock at how much this guy looks like Picard. Picard says his typical line "Why have you committed these acts of aggression? And what do you want with me specifically?" "Shinzon goes, "I think Captain, that is pretty obvious to you, would you like to discuss it over dinner?" Picard reluctantly accepts despite warnings from Riker and the others.
Shinzon explains the whole thing to Picard, the dilithium mine bit, the Remans, etc etc. and tells Picard that he attacked the Romulans as an act of revenge, but he wishes no harm to the Federation and only wanted to meet Picard.
Picard is torn. He cannot accept that this war criminal is a clone of himself and doesn't know what to do.
Shinzon starts having the effects of his DNA breaking down.
Beverly finds out why. He is starting to age rapidly and needs Picard's blood to stabilize. Shinzon still links with Troi, but does it in the turbolift and all he gets to do is lay a forced kiss on her before the interruption. Troi discusses it with Picard and Riker. Picard DOES NOT ask her to endure more of it. Instead he realizes that Shinzon may have no redemption. As he thinks this, he gets beamed out by Shinzon. The whole thing plays out like in the movie, except Picard is able to escape on his own discreetly, no firefight until he gets to the shuttle.
Shinzon, now looking older, screams at the viewscreen that if Picard does not come back, he will destroy the nearest planet, which has a pre warp civilization, and to show he means business jumps to warp to the planet.
Both the Enterprise and the Titan warp in pursuit, unsure of what to do. On route they are met with several D'eridex Warbirds. The Romulans are offering to help! Picard gladly accepts and feels that 2 Federation Ships and 3-4 Romulan Ships might have a chance at stopping Shinzon.
They get to the planet to find Shinzon firing at the surface. They waste no time and all 5 ships start blasting away. All 5 ships take a beating, and the Romulan ships start to break down, as well as the Enterprise and the Titan. They manage to drop shields on one side of the Schimitar. They sneak some Federation and Romulan forces in (Riker and Data among them) and have their corridor fight with the Remans on their ship. Data manages to free Picard, but Shinzon comes in at the same time with some Remans. Data fights off the Remans, and Shinzon fights Picard. In the fight they jump into the transporter and are beamed down to the planet by accident.
They have beamed to what looks like a military compound on the planet, with primitive looking dune buggies. Shinzon realizes he doesn't have a communicator, so he jumps into a Dune buggy and speeds away. Picard has no choice but to do the same to follow him. A chase ensues with natives from the planet following them both shooting their machine guns. The Remans track Shinzon and beam him back up to the Schimitar, and the Enterprise does the same with Picard.
Both back on their ships, Shinzon shows up on the viewscreen, now looking as old as Picard (with Patrick Stewart playing him) and starts pounding on the Enterprise, punches a hole thru the Shields and beams out Deanna. He threatens to finish what he started with her unless Picard beams over again and their forces stand down.
Shinzon starts groping on Deanna again while she's tied up, and Picard gives up and beams over. Shinzon right away takes him over to the medlab, but on the way starts having convulsions. Picard takes him and tries to save him but it's too late for him. As Shinzon is dying he screams out a self destruct sequence which activates. Riker and Picard both stay, Riker to look for Deanna, and Picard to look for Data.
Riker finds Deanna and unties her, and they kiss for a moment and then run to the nearest transport pad, and beam out.
Picard can't find Data, and can't disable the self destruct. As he's looking for Data he gets captured by some Remans who are about to kill him when Data shows up and kicks their asses. Having only seconds to go, and more Remans on their tail, Data screams at Picard to get to the transporter pad while he is keeping the Remans busy. Picard at first doesn't want to do it, but Data insists and Picard does and beams away.
Picard back on the Enterprise struggles to find Data's signature to beam him off the ship, but alas, it's too late, the Schimitar blows up into a million pieces, Data along with it. Everyone has their somber scene, sad at the death of their friend. The Romulans say their piece. Picard and crew goes to meet them in the shuttle bay, and alas, Data steps out of a shuttle, alive and well. Troi cries tears of happiness. Riker and Geordi look massively relieved. The Romulans explain that their were able to get their sensors back up on time, and scanned the Schimitar seconds before it exploded and rescued their Romulan party that was still alive, finding no human life sign, but detecting Data's Positronic systems, beamed him out in the nick of time.
Everyone has a moment of relief, hugs abound all around, even from the Romulans. Riker and Troi make an announcement: They have decided, right there that they are going to get married.
Cut to the Wedding scene. Everyone is there. Picard says his lines about friendship. Riker says a word about how when Troi was captured, the thought of never seeing her again broke him, and how he would never let her get away from him again, etc etc.
Data can sing his gay song while everyone applauds. Wesley appears. Picard in surprise looks at him and said "Wesley! It's been a long time, how are your adventures treating you?" to which Wesley responds "Well Captain, we can discuss it at length some other time, but I came because I couldn't stay away from such a momentous occasion of my friends joining in marriage"
Everyone's faces light up, and Wesley sits down to speak with Guinan, Geordi, Worf, and company as the Camera pulls away from them and well see that in the wedding, there are Romulans present as guests, enjoying a good time with the rest of the people there, and the Camera keeps pulling away again to show the Enterprise in Spacedock, and Music and Credits roll.....
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
I really like your idea about Riker getting the Titan at the start of the movie. Would have been cool to see it on screen. Plus it would have made for a more exciting battle having more ships involved!
I really like your idea about Riker getting the Titan at the start of the movie. Would have been cool to see it on screen. Plus it would have made for a more exciting battle having more ships involved!
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
I like how even in a fan's revision, Doctor Crusher still gets nothing to do.
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
Well if I were the one writing the script, we would have tossed out this whole Shinzon and his Supership out the windows, and I would have done a straight up Romulan story (which is what we were promised in the first place, one of the reasons I'm pissed the movie turned out the way it did).
I could have something for everyone to do in my movie
Well if I were the one writing the script, we would have tossed out this whole Shinzon and his Supership out the windows, and I would have done a straight up Romulan story (which is what we were promised in the first place, one of the reasons I'm pissed the movie turned out the way it did).
I could have something for everyone to do in my movie
Re: I am going to do what I haven't done in 4 years....watch Nemesis a
I think your revision is pretty good, GalaxyX, while keeping elements that I'm sure the execs would insist be there. Besides, when does Beverly get to do anything? She could always have to take the bridge for some reason... and if there's a Picard clone afoot, shouldn't she have really been the one mind-raped?
I was just musing yesterday that this was written by the same man that gave us "Gladiator." I liked "Gladiator." I mean, what the hell?
I think your revision is pretty good, GalaxyX, while keeping elements that I'm sure the execs would insist be there. Besides, when does Beverly get to do anything? She could always have to take the bridge for some reason... and if there's a Picard clone afoot, shouldn't she have really been the one mind-raped?
I was just musing yesterday that this was written by the same man that gave us "Gladiator." I liked "Gladiator." I mean, what the hell?
Similar threads
