How would you rather have seen Enterprise-D go down?
- Thread starter NewHeavensNewEarth
- Start date
It's funny, I'm a strong proponent of the notion that not everyone (or every ship) gets to have a "heroic death" (witness Tasha Yar), but the E-D's destruction just feels so ridiculously preventable that it still irks me.
I'd be much happier if its destruction was still pointless but we at least felt like Our Heroes put up a decent fight first.
I'd be much happier if its destruction was still pointless but we at least felt like Our Heroes put up a decent fight first.
Was there really any need to destroy Enterprise-D?
Yes, because the script necessitated the ship to blow up and the saucer section to crash on the planet.
Now with that said, the biggest flaw (of many) of Generations is that Picard could have chosen to go back in time to at least before the ship was destroyed, and deal with Soran then. That way we still could have seen the crash, but it would then have gotten a reset button and never happened. But instead Picard chooses the dumbest point in time to return. Granted he wasn’t aware of the Enterprise’s destruction, but so what. The ship stayed destroyed because they just wanted another one.
One, It shouldn't have been destoryed, as said before, Not a big fan of the Ent E.. Atleast it wasn't destroyed like the Kelvin enterprise.. that was just.. bad writing.. and sad.
Two, How to improve the death scene
Torpedo hits, Geordi calls and says main power is out, all I have is batteries.. then worf saying, All I have is minimal phasers, no match for the bop. then Riker says evasive manuvers, and it would be slow like it showed.
then played out like it did.. with them having power for 1 torpedo.
But yeah, If I was worf, i would have unloaded and showed clear on that bop.. with Riker pulling him away from the consule saying.. there dead worf! stop firing!
Two, How to improve the death scene
Torpedo hits, Geordi calls and says main power is out, all I have is batteries.. then worf saying, All I have is minimal phasers, no match for the bop. then Riker says evasive manuvers, and it would be slow like it showed.
then played out like it did.. with them having power for 1 torpedo.
But yeah, If I was worf, i would have unloaded and showed clear on that bop.. with Riker pulling him away from the consule saying.. there dead worf! stop firing!
Picard didn't know the ship was destroyed though, right? The battle occurred after Picard was on the planet.
But yes, they wanted a new ship that they could create that would look better on the big screen, both inside and outside (although I think it looked pretty good in the film with the slight alterations they made).
I liked that the Enterprise D was taken out by the enemies being smart instead of being overwhelmed by a superior enemy but everything after the Duras sisters getting the shield frequency should have been written better, they never even tried rotating the shield frequency and only fired one phaser once before going into discussion mode while the klingons kept firing through their shields.
To get around that the first hit should have been critical, why not blow up one of the Enterprise's nacelles with the first hit taking iut a bunch of systems, they could then rotate the shield frequency every few seconds but the damage would be done. They start evacuating everyone into the saucer because of some radiation leak from the nacelle or whatever (to get around the question why they don't just eject the core), separate the ship and crash the stardrive into the klingons.
To get around that the first hit should have been critical, why not blow up one of the Enterprise's nacelles with the first hit taking iut a bunch of systems, they could then rotate the shield frequency every few seconds but the damage would be done. They start evacuating everyone into the saucer because of some radiation leak from the nacelle or whatever (to get around the question why they don't just eject the core), separate the ship and crash the stardrive into the klingons.
I didn't have an issue with the Kelvin E's destruction...it put up a pretty good fight to survive given the overwhelming odds it was facing...not in terms of weapons, but in terms of not actually blowing up and such.
But was it really absolutely necessary for the saucer to land on the planet? I think it's a bad script if it involves destroying Enterprise-D. And even if it didn't, it's still bad....
Some have mentioned the timing Picard chose after he left the nexus. He chose to confront Soran. Some might wonder why not go further back in time before anything went wrong? Why not go 50 years back and relive your life? Assuming it was possible to choose the timing, the movie wasn't exactly specific on how nexus works.
Lets face it, it's a horrible movie.
I don't remember the last time when I watched it and I plan to stay away from it, possibly for the rest of my life, it's that bad.
I don't mind the way it was destroyed at all. The saucer separation was greatly underutilized throughout the series, and a crash like that wasn't done before in Trek that I recall. Obviously there is no reason why it had to happen that way, but you can say that about practically anything that happens in fiction.
What I don't like that is how the Enterprise-D was damaged by an ancient Bird of Prey, especially when the whole shield frequency thing just open up too many cans of worms for how we see shields operate in the show. The ship just needed to be more evenly matched with another, better ships, or even multiple ships.
The only thing we know about the Nexus was that you tend to forget anything that happened in the real world. So maybe his thought process was impaired a bit when deciding when to go back? Who knows?
I wouldn't say terrible, but it's definitely disjointed. It would have worked better if they had just kept it totally a TNG film and not added Kirk, et al. in it.Lets face it, it's a horrible movie.
But seeing he Enterprise-D on film is enough for me to re-watch from time to time, at least parts of it, even despite the flaws.
Changing the Generations story only a little so that the sisters have three ships would have probably been the simplest and best way to make the loss feel not so forced and underwhelming. Although Picard and the crew just underestimating the one ship is fairly disappointing but not a really bad development, interesting in a way.
An alternative ending for the Enterprise in "Generations":
They place an abandoned Enterprise-D in the path of the nexus, expecting the ship to be destroyed as it serves to ricochet the nexus away. Instead, the Enterprise gets swept into the nexus, and floats away forever, not destroyed but not retrievable by any sane man (at least more sane than Soran).
With the number of times the Enterprise had faced off against multiple Birds of Prey, it added insult to injury.
They place an abandoned Enterprise-D in the path of the nexus, expecting the ship to be destroyed as it serves to ricochet the nexus away. Instead, the Enterprise gets swept into the nexus, and floats away forever, not destroyed but not retrievable by any sane man (at least more sane than Soran).
With the number of times the Enterprise had faced off against multiple Birds of Prey, it added insult to injury.
IIRC
The season 1 model was later replaced with a bigger model of the ship.
Correct me if I'm wrong here.
Actually, the original six foot model was replaced around season 3 with a four foot midel that was easier to handle, and easuer to get wide shots of. Not a bad idea, but the execution was nonsensical, imho.
The four footer had less graceful lines, particularly around the deflectir dish and saucer rim, and the paneling everwhere was exaggerated. The overall effect of all this made the D a lot more toy-like from certain angles, compared to the gorgeous original model.
When Generations came around, ILM took one look at the four footer and concluded it would look bad on the big screen, so they refurbished the six footer. The D never looked better than in in that film, absolutely beautiful.
As for the way it was destroyed, I would change a few things: First, make its sacrifice something that was in service of the plot, like the original Enterprise. Secondly, I'd depict the shield frequency status being displayed on a console Geordie was using. That way, whenever he changes frequency, the Duras sister adapt in turn.
Lastly, have the D go head to head with a Negh'Var that the Duras sisters stole, because shields or no shields, that Bird of Prey should have been roasted easily.
In an ideal world, I wouldn't have had the D destroyed at all. The E is proportionally nice, but the detailing isn't to my taste.
Wouldn't it be an issue during these times when we see the ship in a region with gravitational shears, or close to something with extreme gravity?In space you don't need balance
Anyway, I would have it heavily damaged. That way they could have it refitted and get away with a movie look...
The biggest flaw is why Soren needed to come up with with hair brained plan at all.
"Why can't he just fly into it with a ship?"
See bullshit excuse why they can't fly j to it with a ship
Meanwhile, I'm the same movie, two examples of flying into it with a ship working perfectly fine (the transports, with Soren feeling ripped away, and Enterprise B, with Kirk)
Well, yeah, or at best just hang suspended in space in a space suit until the Nexus flew into you.
But while that's a flaw, it's not the biggest. Picard specifically chooses a point in time to return to that not only makes no logical sense, he also needs the help of another person (re: Kirk) to help him stop Soran. But if Picard had chosen, say, the day before to go back, not only would he not have needed Kirk (and not caused Kirk to die in the process), he could have just told his command staff on the Enterprise what had happened (since the exact same time displacement had just happened to Picard in "All Good Things..." and his crew would have understood), and then just arrest Soran at the Amargosa observatory. But apparently logic doesn't make for a movie script.
