How would you change the show?

[Anwar]

Just checked Jetrel and Jetrel actually made them believe that a) Neelix was dying from metremia and b) he might be able to synthesize an antibody with the help of Voyager's transporter technology, which may have sounded less far-fetched than the experiment he actually wanted to do. That makes it sound less frivolous of Janeway to decide to go there, but still, it's committing substantial resources.

Wanting to save a member of their crew is something the majority would agree on though, Maquis and Starfleet.

Still, I'd think that the Federation quickly replacing the Defiant is far more plausible than VOY finding friendly aliens that are willing to either give them another ship or fix their ship (what would the VOY crew have to offer those aliens in return?) But perhaps it could have been done if VOY sacrificed itself for those aliens, who now feel indebted to help them on their way again. Or some such thing.

How about something as utterly contrived as Star Trek Beyond, where the Enterprise was destroyed but they found an old Starfleet ship on the planet to get away in?

Or NuBSG, where they get a bigger stronger better Battlestar but it gets destroyed for idiotic reasons very fast so that Galactica can be the only Battlestar again?

Or Farscape, where Moya is badly damaged and burned but they just happen to have enough energy to get her to the only Doctor that could 100% fix her and they just happened to rob a bank so they just happen to have enough money to pay for treatment?

Compared to that, running into some Q stand-in who fixes the ship is hardly any different.

 

[fireproof78]

Compared to that, running into some Q stand-in who fixes the ship is hardly any different.

They are welcome to try.

Voyager never did. Consequences meant very little so it was difficult to put stock in them, despite them calling out limited resources.

I don't care how other shows did it. Let Voyager try and fail on it's own merits, and not what other shows did.

 

[Oddish]

A lot of whether a change is worthwhile is the effort involved. Writing Maquis tensions, a (real) mutiny, having the ship falling apart, and so many other things people suggested here would take whole episodes worth of work. Briefly mention a new industrial replicator that could fabricate shuttle parts, and the shuttle issue is settled. Mention a fusion reactor that could run on hydrogen (it's everywhere, so power issue solved). Trade with the Yeti for antimatter warheads. Equally easy, five seconds of dialogue. Mention that yeah, that Borg baby's species lives near here, so we returned her to them. I could go on and on.

 

[Sci]

Okay, how about how quickly they repaired that blown off Pylon in "To the Death"?

Again, this thread is about reimagining and improving Star Trek: Voyager, not trying to claim that Star Trek: Voyager is held to an inconsistent standard.

Part of the fundamental premise of Star Trek: Voyager is that it is a ship with very limited resources and therefore problems that could be easily solved as part of Starfleet would not be so easily solved alone in the Delta Quadrant. For the show to subsequently contradict that premise and depict resource limitations as meaningless undermines its own verisimilitude.

 

[FederationHistorian]

Uh huh, and when Voyager did episodes like "Living Witness" and "The Void" and "Scorpion" all they got for "following the premise" was "Meh" at best. No matter what the reception is to those stories today.

First I’m hearing that "Living Witness" "The Void" and “Scorpion” was initially met with ‘meh’. Who are these fans that thought it was ‘meh’?

So even when you write your a$$ off and produce great stories that still only get a lukewarm reception with little to no appreciation, you should just accept that no matter how hard you try and no matter how hard you work, you'll never ever succeed and just keep writing as hard as you can even though you know it will never get anything more than a "Meh, not absolutely awful...I guess." response? For the entire run of the show?

If the fanbase is fickle, yes.

Explain why the ship suddenly has infinite torpedoes, shuttles, and replicator energy.

It's obvious, or should be, that they visited a few worlds along the way that traded with them. But those worlds weren't all that interesting to note due to how transactional those visits were.

 

[Oddish]

Finding out that the Grizabellan Alliance use matter-antimatter weapons and trading for a pallet of compatible warheads... Ok, it's not interesting. So don't devote a 40-minute episode to it, devote 10 seconds. Create similar explanations for other changed premises. If you want peace-love-harmony among the crew, have the problem Maquis jump ship on Planet 37's, problem solved. And these scenes could be really handled well. For instance, have the Borg baby in a carrier on a table in Sickbay. Janeway is oh-so-gentle as she adjusts the blanket on the peacefully slumbering child, then nods and the carrier disappears, beamed to an unseen ship. All it would cost is one transporter FX shot, and you get a nice peek at Janeway's maternal side.

I say make these explanations and get rid of a couple inside jokes that weren't funny. It never really made sense for the Doc to not have a name after "Lifesigns", and Harry's 7-year ensignhood was stupid and impossible to justify. And none of these changes would be a difficult fix.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

I'm doing a Voyager rewatch right now and the writers' attitude to resource problems bothers me more in the episodes where they are after some vital element or component for the ship, because I can sense how utterly disinterested they are in whether the crew gets hold of it or not. Sometimes they fail to acquire it and the characters aren't even bothered. It affects nothing.

It's like writing a heist movie where the audience isn't supposed to care if anyone gets away with the loot! Except I do, I can't help it, and the lack of any catharsis at the end is frustrating!

 

[Oddish]

It's like writing a heist movie where the audience isn't supposed to care if anyone gets away with the loot! Except I do, I can't help it, and the lack of any catharsis at the end is frustrating!

I'm with you. I remember watching what looked like a heist type movie featurung dirty money with Steven Seagal... but the government recovered the money. Haven't watched another Seagal movie since. Of course, it may also be because most of Seagal's recent movies have been DTV crap.

 

[at Quark's]

It never really made sense for the Doc to not have a name after "Lifesigns"

Agreed. He should have settled on a name at some point, not drag it on for the full seven years. I do like the small inside joke the writers made about that in the very last episode (Endgame) though:

LANA: Joe has a real flair for romantic gestures.
PARIS: Joe?
EMH: I decided I couldn't get married without a name.
PARIS: It took you thirty three years to come up with "Joe" ?

 

[Oddish]

Some early changes in the senior staff lineup.

After CARETAKER:
Captain: Janeway
First Officer: Chakotay
Security: Tuvok
Operations: Pete Durst
Helm: Paris
Engineering: Joe Carey
CMO: The EMH

FACES: Pete Durst is murdered by the Vidiians. His highest ranking subordinate is now chief of operations, despite being a newly minted Starfleet graduate.

Captain: Janeway
First Officer: Chakotay
Security: Tuvok
Operations: Harry Kim
Helm: Paris
Engineering: Joe Carey
CMO: The EMH

THE 37's: As expected, the most difficult of the Maquis defect from the ship's company. Completely unexpected, they are joined by Joe Carey. By now, B'Elanna has calmed down and gained a reputation as being a trusted and capable officer who won't go randomly breaking noses.

Captain: Janeway
First Officer: Chakotay
Security: Tuvok
Operations: Harry Kim
Helm: Paris
Engineering: B'Elanna Torres
CMO: The EMH

By having Harry have to take up a job he wasn't ready for and spend some time in over his head, and forcing B'Elanna to work within the Starfleet command structure, growth opportunity for both characters is exponentially greater.

 

[Anwar]

First I’m hearing that "Living Witness" "The Void" and “Scorpion” was initially met with ‘meh’. Who are these fans that thought it was ‘meh’?

This very board, back around 2006 or do.

If the fanbase is fickle, yes.

Do fickle people deserve anything? No they do not.

Some early changes in the senior staff lineup.

After CARETAKER:
Captain: Janeway
First Officer: Chakotay
Security: Tuvok
Operations: Pete Durst
Helm: Paris
Engineering: Joe Carey
CMO: The EMH

FACES: Pete Durst is murdered by the Vidiians. His highest ranking subordinate is now chief of operations, despite being a newly minted Starfleet graduate.

Captain: Janeway
First Officer: Chakotay
Security: Tuvok
Operations: Harry Kim
Helm: Paris
Engineering: Joe Carey
CMO: The EMH

THE 37's: As expected, the most difficult of the Maquis defect from the ship's company. Completely unexpected, they are joined by Joe Carey. By now, B'Elanna has calmed down and gained a reputation as being a trusted and capable officer who won't go randomly breaking noses.

Captain: Janeway
First Officer: Chakotay
Security: Tuvok
Operations: Harry Kim
Helm: Paris
Engineering: B'Elanna Torres
CMO: The EMH

By having Harry have to take up a job he wasn't ready for and spend some time in over his head, and forcing B'Elanna to work within the Starfleet command structure, growth opportunity for both characters is exponentially greater.

The Premiere episode of Voyager should've been the season finale, and when it ends with Janeway going to sleep the whole thing would begin a flashback to "Caretaker" so we'd see how they got to where things were in the finale.

IE, show B'Elanna and Harry in those positions in the "future" and then in the flashback (which is the entire season up to that last episode) we see that others were in those positions before them leaving us wondering how the changeover happened.

 

[fireproof78]

Do fickle people deserve anything? No they do not.

The only thing an audience "deserves" is entertainment and bearing out the premise as presented. That's it.

 

[Anwar]

The only thing an audience "deserves" is entertainment and bearing out the premise as presented. That's it.

If they're just going to be apathetic to everything and show no appreciation, meanwhile praising every other TV show out there like it's a Godsend, then they shouldn't be surprised their attitude earns them apathy in return.

You try to be nice and friendly and all you get is abuse, you try to extend your hand out and it gets smacked away, you try to pet the dog and it tries to tear a chunk of you off in return...then the one you're trying to appease simply isn't worth your efforts.

 

[Danja]

Finding out that the Grizabellan Alliance use matter-antimatter weapons

"Grizabellan Alliance"?

Somebody saw Cats.

For instance, have the Borg baby in a carrier on a table in Sickbay. Janeway is oh-so-gentle as she adjusts the blanket on the peacefully slumbering child, then nods and the carrier disappears, beamed to an unseen ship. All it would cost is one transporter FX shot, and you get a nice peek at Janeway's maternal side.

Where would they beam it to? They're in the middle of the Delta Quadrant.

Harry's 7-year ensignhood was stupid and impossible to justify.

Maybe Janeway wasn't all there mentally?

Prolonged isolation can do things to one's mental health.

 

[Anwar]

I mean, the real reason Harry never got promoted was because the writers didn't want to waste time on Garrett Wang and his constant screwups. That was the whole reason he was gonna get killed in "Scorpion", so they could finally be rid of him.

 

[fireproof78]

If they're just going to be apathetic to everything and show no appreciation, meanwhile praising every other TV show out there like it's a Godsend, then they shouldn't be surprised their attitude earns them apathy in return.

You try to be nice and friendly and all you get is abuse, you try to extend your hand out and it gets smacked away, you try to pet the dog and it tries to tear a chunk of you off in return...then the one you're trying to appease simply isn't worth your efforts.

Nope. So write stories of interest to you and designed to entertain. And try not to take it personally because this is a highly impersonal process. The writers are not trying to insult the audience and the audience is not a hostile monolith.

 

[Dee1891]

I don't see any need to change it. If there are reasons to change it, then there are reasons to change the other Trek shows as well.

 

[Sci]

If they're just going to be apathetic to everything and show no appreciation, meanwhile praising every other TV show out there like it's a Godsend, then they shouldn't be surprised their attitude earns them apathy in return.

"Star Trek: Voyager cannot fail -- it can only be failed by its audience!"

 

[fireproof78]

I don't see any need to change it. If there are reasons to change it, then there are reasons to change the other Trek shows as well.

Yes there are.

 

[Oddish]

Where would they beam it to? They're in the middle of the Delta Quadrant.

Fair question. As the scene I described plays, Janeway v.o.'s:

JANEWAY: "Captain's log, supplemental. Harry's recovering in Sickbay, and the rest of the away team is safe and sound. We were able to determine the Borg infant's species and return her safely to her people. As for the drones, the Doctor's removed most of their implants, leaving us with four very troubled children."

Maybe Janeway wasn't all there mentally?

Prolonged isolation can do things to one's mental health.

Certainly, Janeway dealt with a lot. But there was no evidence presented that she had a vendetta against Harry, or any other person on the ship.

I mean, the real reason Harry never got promoted was because the writers didn't want to waste time on Garrett Wang and his constant screwups. That was the whole reason he was gonna get killed in "Scorpion", so they could finally be rid of him.

Fine. Snuffing him could have worked really well, if done right. But once they made the decision not to kill him, they should have handled the character more appropriately.