How to explain this quote from "The Survivors"?

[Unimatrix Q]

An often overlooked quote from "The Survivors", for which i never found a good explanation for in line with the other episodes and movies that pretend that money doesn't exist anymore at least since the end of the 23rd century/beginning of the 24th century:

"RISHON: Kevin and I first saw each other on a ship at sea. He was a starving student with this threadbare suit and mismatched shoes. I was travelling with my parents who did not like the way that he kept hanging around. Two hours after I met him, I asked him to marry me. And he knew I was serious. I don't think that he has ever recovered from that day. "

 

[at Quark's]

An often overlooked quote from "The Survivors", for which i never found a good explanation for in line with the other episodes and movies that pretend that money doesn't exist anymore at least since the end of the 23rd century/beginning of the 24th century:

"RISHON: Kevin and I first saw each other on a ship at sea. He was a starving student with this threadbare suit and mismatched shoes. I was travelling with my parents who did not like the way that he kept hanging around. Two hours after I met him, I asked him to marry me. And he knew I was serious. I don't think that he has ever recovered from that day. "

Perhaps this sea wasn't on a Federation world? Or perhaps it was on a Federation colony that hadn't fared so well in the past, similar to how Tasha Yar's colony Turkana IV didn't turn out a paradise, either?

 

[Orphalesion]

Personally I'd just go with "script error"

 

[Unimatrix Q]

Perhaps this sea wasn't on a Federation world? Or perhaps it was on a Federation colony that hadn't fared so well in the past, similar to how Tasha Yar's colony Turkana IV didn't turn out a paradise, either?

Apparently they were both coming from Earth.

"DATA: Botanists. Originally from the aquatic city New Martim Vaz in Earth's Atlantic Ocean. Residents of the Rana Four colony for five years. You, ma'am, are eighty two years of age and a composer of Tao classical music. You, sir, are eighty five years of age and a specialist in symbiotic plant life. You have been married for fifty three years. I memorised the colony register on the way to Rana Four, in the event that such information would be needed."

"KEVIN: Very well. For what it's worth. I am a Douwd. An immortal being of disguises and false surroundings. I have lived in this galaxy for many thousands of years although until today, no one has known my true identity. Once, while traveling in human form, I chanced to fall in love with an Earth woman. I put aside my powers and became her husband. Our life was happy and rich. Eventually we came to this planet to live our final years. Now she is dead. She never knew what I really was. "

 

[at Quark's]

Apparently they were both coming from Earth.

"KEVIN: Very well. For what it's worth. I am a Douwd. An immortal being of disguises and false surroundings. I have lived in this galaxy for many thousands of years although until today, no one has known my true identity. Once, while traveling in human form, I chanced to fall in love with an Earth woman. I put aside my powers and became her husband. Our life was happy and rich. Eventually we came to this planet to live our final years. Now she is dead. She never knew what I really was. "

Yes, I know Rishon came from Earth, but that doesn't necessarily mean they were on earth when they met. Rishon could have had the 24th century equivalent of a tourist trip to a developing country with her parents at the time.

 

[Unimatrix Q]

Yes, I know Rishon came from Earth, but that doesn't necessarily mean they were on earth when they met. Rishon could have had the 24th century equivalent of a tourist trip to a developing country with her parents at the time.

Maybe but i think Rishon would have said it if she met Kevin somewhere else.

And wouldn't Data mention if he was from a colony or lived there for some time?

 

[Orphalesion]

Maybe but i think Rishon would have said it if she met Kevin somewhere else.

And wouldn't Data mention if he was from a colony or lived there for some time?

Well you're not gonna get a perfectly fitting answer, because it's a TV show. So either you can come up with some headcanon explanation, such as at Quark's or you accept it as a flawed script.
Or do you want yet another discussion on whether the Federation uses money or not?

 

[Unimatrix Q]

Well you're not gonna get a perfectly fitting answer, because it's a TV show. So either you can come up with some headcanon explanation, such as at Quark's or you accept it as a flawed script.
Or do you want yet another discussion on whether the Federation uses money or not?

There are already so many discussions about this on TrekBBS, so i guess another one wouldn't hurt

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Young Kevin is indeed described as a "starving student", but it doesn't say why.

Doesn't mean Kevin was broke; perhaps he just devoted so much time to his work that he neglected his appearance and didn't eat much?

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Perhaps Kevin was representing himself as a member of a community who are strong on not using replicators, such as back-to-nature types or actual farmers, visiting Earth from a colony to attend school.

 

[Orphalesion]

Young Kevin is indeed described as a "starving student", but it doesn't say why.

Doesn't mean Kevin was broke; perhaps he just devoted so much time to his work that he neglected his appearance and didn't eat much?

Perhaps Kevin was representing himself as a member of a community who are strong on not using replicators, such as back-to-nature types or actual farmers, visiting Earth from a colony to attend school.

maybe the "Starving Student" look was very trendy among young people when Kevin and Rishon were young. Young people on Earth purposefully losing weight and wearing threadbare clothing as some sort of fashion statement. And Rishon's parents didn't want her to get mixed up with the 24th century version of a hippie or a greaser.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

maybe the "Starving Student" look was very trendy among young people when Kevin and Rishon were young. Young people on Earth purposefully losing weight and wearing threadbare clothing as some sort of fashion statement. And Rishon's parents didn't want her to get mixed up with the 24th century version of a hippie or a greaser.

That's a good one, seriously! Kinda like IRL how hippie clothes have been fashionable in recent decades for the not-actual hippie youth.

 

[Unimatrix Q]

Perhaps Kevin was representing himself as a member of a community who are strong on not using replicators, such as back-to-nature types or actual farmers, visiting Earth from a colony to attend school.

The first point is really good imho and leads to more questions about Earth's economy

But in the case the second one applies, wouldn't Data mention the colony, at some point considering his pedantry and that Troi's mental health is at stake?

 

[Orphalesion]

That's a good one, seriously! Kinda like IRL how hippie clothes have been fashionable in recent decades for the not-actual hippie youth.

It might even have been some sort of rebellion against the over-abundance of a culture where you probably recycle your clothes into the replicator after wearing rather than washing them.
SO Kevin was a rebel(tm) and that's why Rishon fell for him and why her parents didn't like him hanging around

 

[CorporalCaptain]

But in the case the second one applies, wouldn't Data mention the colony, at some point considering his pedantry and that Troi's mental health is at stake?

Not if the information wasn't in the database that he memorized.

It might even have been some sort of rebellion against the over-abundance of a culture where you probably recycle your clothes into the replicator after wearing rather than washing them.
SO Kevin was a rebel(tm) and that's why Rishon fell for him and why her parents didn't like him hanging around

Yeah, "The Way to Eden" and "Up the Long Ladder" can't have provided us with the only examples of people yearning to lead a primitive life in the Federation. Heck, the colony in "This Side of Paradise" looked like a 20th century Earth farm!

edit - https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Neo-Transcendentalist

 

[Qonundrum]

Might have been a term of endearment or colloquialism by that point, since the meanings and definitions of words change over time - some do so several times per century, in fact. Plus, it's not like his house was loaded with his works of art to begin with.

Fanwanky headcanon aside, what Orphalesion said more readily sums it up. It's a script boo-boo and one worthy of early season one like where they went to the oily massage planet where the security chief, too hornball to keep even a modicum of common sense, says it's a fine and dandy place to bring down entire families, says the doctor, before hearing just what they do all the doo-dah-day down there (never mind not changing her mind after hearing everyone else chime in on how "eveready" everyone is down there with their hats dropping everywhere...

 

[Tim Thomason]

The first point is really good imho and leads to more questions about Earth's economy

But in the case the second one applies, wouldn't Data mention the colony, at some point considering his pedantry and that Troi's mental health is at stake?

Not really. Data isn't being thorough. He's reciting facts from the "colony register" as he explicitly says, not going into the biographies of the two Uxbridges.

The facts are thus: profession (botanist and composer), place of origin (New Martim Vaz, Earth), years of residency (five), ages (85 and 82), marriage date (53 years). This could've been presented in a simple line item like thus (amongst hundreds of others):

• Uxbridge, Kevin (b. 2281), botanist, specialist in symbiotic plant life, joined colony in 2361. Formerly of New Martim Vaz, Earth. Married to Rishon Uxbridge (m. 2313)
• Uxbridge, Rishon (b. 2284), botanist, composer of Tao-classical music, joined colony in 2361. Formerly of New Martim Vaz, Earth. Married to Kevin Uxbridge (m. 2313)

That they came from the aquatic city of New Martim Vaz is known, but that is before they moved to Rana IV. They were married for 48 years before moving to Rana IV, and they may have spent that time in New Martim Vaz. That doesn't state where they were from originally. In 2313, Rishon was about 29 years old and Kevin was (claiming to be) 32 years old. If they had a whirlwind romance, as Rishon suggests, and married right away, then Kevin appeared to be a "starving student" in his early 30s. No wonder her parents were a little annoyed.

Rishon may have been born elsewhere on Earth, and Kevin may have claimed to be from Gault or Izar, but they met on a "ship at sea", and perhaps professionally as botanists eventually wound up in the sub-Atlantic city of New Martim Vaz, probably doing underwater botany stuff. They're clearly in retirement during "The Survivors", after a lifetime together, and who knows where they moved about. Data didn't have time to give us a play-by-play, and probably didn't have easy access to one either.

 

[Unimatrix Q]

Not really. Data isn't being thorough. He's reciting facts from the "colony register" as he explicitly says, not going into the biographies of the two Uxbridges.

The facts are thus: profession (botanist and composer), place of origin (New Martim Vaz, Earth), years of residency (five), ages (85 and 82), marriage date (53 years). This could've been presented in a simple line item like thus (amongst hundreds of others):

• Uxbridge, Kevin (b. 2281), botanist, specialist in symbiotic plant life, joined colony in 2361. Formerly of New Martim Vaz, Earth. Married to Rishon Uxbridge (m. 2313)
• Uxbridge, Rishon (b. 2284), botanist, composer of Tao-classical music, joined colony in 2361. Formerly of New Martim Vaz, Earth. Married to Kevin Uxbridge (m. 2313)

That they came from the aquatic city of New Martim Vaz is known, but that is before they moved to Rana IV. They were married for 48 years before moving to Rana IV, and they may have spent that time in New Martim Vaz. That doesn't state where they were from originally. In 2313, Rishon was about 29 years old and Kevin was (claiming to be) 32 years old. If they had a whirlwind romance, as Rishon suggests, and married right away, then Kevin appeared to be a "starving student" in his early 30s. No wonder her parents were a little annoyed.

Rishon may have been born elsewhere on Earth, and Kevin may have claimed to be from Gault or Izar, but they met on a "ship at sea", and perhaps professionally as botanists eventually wound up in the sub-Atlantic city of New Martim Vaz, probably doing underwater botany stuff. They're clearly in retirement during "The Survivors", after a lifetime together, and who knows where they moved about. Data didn't have time to give us a play-by-play, and probably didn't have easy access to one either.

"DATA: Botanists. Originally from the aquatic city New Martim Vaz in Earth's Atlantic Ocean. Residents of the Rana Four colony for five years. You, ma'am, are eighty two years of age and a composer of Tao classical music. You, sir, are eighty five years of age and a specialist in symbiotic plant life. You have been married for fifty three years. I memorised the colony register on the way to Rana Four, in the event that such information would be needed."

Wouldn't previous places of residence be a part of colony registers?

 

[Tim Thomason]

"DATA: Botanists. Originally from the aquatic city New Martim Vaz in Earth's Atlantic Ocean. Residents of the Rana Four colony for five years. You, ma'am, are eighty two years of age and a composer of Tao classical music. You, sir, are eighty five years of age and a specialist in symbiotic plant life. You have been married for fifty three years. I memorised the colony register on the way to Rana Four, in the event that such information would be needed."

Wouldn't previous places of residence be a part of colony registers?

Your guess is as good as mine. I'm assuming not, if we take him literally, because two octogenarian scientists living in one place for their first 77+ years of life and then moving to one other seems unlikely, especially when Rishon reveals that she met Kevin while traveling.

And if they were from some other places (although Kevin describes Rishon as an "Earth woman," limiting her place of origin), and those were recorded on the register, Data didn't feel it necessary to go into that. This was before Troi's ailment, and Data was just repeating identifying information (although, he went a little overboard of course).

 

[Mudd]

It's an inconsistency.

There, explained.