How much of an adjustment will Emperor Georgiou have?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Lord Garth, Dec 19, 2018.

  1. Discofan

    Discofan Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2018
    Location:
    Discofan
    Or being deemed a security risk and be eliminated.
     
  2. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Location:
    Gov Kodos on Mohammed's Radio, WZVN Boston
    Who do you suppose came up with General Order #24?
     
  3. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    And the Borg genocide
     
  4. cultcross

    cultcross We truly were a song of ice and fire Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2001
    Location:
    The Small Council
    People so often do.

    That was mostly a choice to hide the "reveal" we'd all guessed about who the emperor was, but personally I prefer the phasing out of the "ess" titles for women anyway, so Emporer is fine by me.

    Completely agree. We are talking about someone from a brutal, viscious universe where people kill each other to advance and violence is the core of their society, the amount of culturally ingrained thinking and psychological damage would be extraordinary - we saw some of this with mirror Lorca actually - and any storyline where she suddenly has a change of heart and goes good after that much hard conditioning is frankly ludicrous.
     
  5. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    Well even after she was revealed they still used male titles in her full name.
     
  6. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    Earth history has its share of female Emperors and Kings, chiefly because being considered male carries advantages in monarchist setups that, if nothing else, hinge heavily on patrilinear succession. The leader of the Terran Empire might suffer from pressures to be male, too, even when the factual position of power of females in that realm is clearly established. Granted, the extreme sexual stereotypes we have seen don't yet quite cover patrilinearity, but we might still make that assumption if it helps rationalize Georgiou's title.

    It's not as much a matter of her making herself indispensable to S31 or SF Intel or whatnot - but of her making herself a potential embarrassment whose odd disappearance would be as much a risk as her ongoing antics. She's a security risk no matter what - apparently she was hired to do the job of a security risk! Much like Khan in that parallel timeline.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
    Spaceship Jo and Tuskin38 like this.
  7. Kane_Steel

    Kane_Steel Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2007
    Emperor Georgiou is a cartoon character, a caricature if you will.

    So she'll basically be whatever they write her to be. I doubt this will ever be a deep or complex character. She came off as almost a parody or a spoof, in line with how most of the mirror universe dopplegangers were written.
     
  8. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    So there’s no issue here.
     
  9. Jackson_Roykirk

    Jackson_Roykirk Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2007
    Location:
    Pennsylvania, USA
    I don't think being "good" is a job requirement for section 31.

    Having said that, I don't expect Mirror Georgiou to feel the need to stab everyone in the back any chance she gets -- which is required while living in the MU, because everyone is out to stab you in the back (i.e., the Terran Empire in the MU is often a "Kill or be Killed" place).

    Without actually needing to kill or exude evilness to get ahead (or just to stay alive) now that she is in the Prime Universe Federation, Mirror Georgiou may end up being less overtly evil, just like Mirror Lorca could be less overtly evil while he was hanging out in the Prime Universe.
     
    SolarisOne and Gonzo like this.
  10. Gonzo

    Gonzo Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2017
    Location:
    England
    Wouldn't surprise me if she ends up saving the day or maybe even sacrificing herself at some point, returning the favour and second chance she was given.

    Even the MU Lorca did what he did to get home and had no interest in the PU, better to reign in hell than serve in heaven.

    Wont surprise me if we see the PU Lorca at some point either, especially if we get some sort of reset back to the true pure timeline where the war with the Klingons never happened.
     
    Deledrius likes this.
  11. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    I find it very unlikely they'll do that, as the timeline hasn't been altered, so there is no reason for a 'reset'.
     
    gblews and Jackson_Roykirk like this.
  12. Discofan

    Discofan Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2018
    Location:
    Discofan
    Sometime along the way, they'll have to destroy the spore drive... I just wonder how and when they'll do it.
     
  13. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    So far, it's a top secret capability - soon we will find out whether even Captain Pike knows about it. The odds of it remaining secret will go down as time passes, though. In wartime, doing the Lone Ranger act where those rescued had no idea who save them was a breeze. If Pike this season saves Teh Univerze!! with the drive, there will be trouble, though.

    ...Was Starfleet able to keep Kirk's time travel secret in the aftermath of ST4?

    In any case, the more time the writers have for thinking up cool ways to lose the drive, the better.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
    Deledrius likes this.
  14. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
    Location:
    A type 13 planet in its final stage
    It has to be in such a way that can't be discovered or reinvented by the Voyager crew or the Dominion or Borg or anyone, since it's existence would make a joke of DS9 and VOY. I expect to be disappointed:lol:
     
    Deledrius likes this.
  15. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    It did take an unusual mind to come up with it. Humans are basically credited with being the recklessly creative weirdos of the galaxy; there might not be another Stamets within the quintillions the Borg have access to.

    Of course, many a culture and creature in other Trek enjoys instantaneous transportation. Some might rely on Prototaxites stellaviatori or something similar for it.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  16. Discofan

    Discofan Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2018
    Location:
    Discofan
    There's still the question of how they'll lose the Spore Drive... recipe. For one thing, too many people know about it already. Will they kill them all at the end of the series? Otherwise, you'd think Janeway, Tuvok who as all Vulcans is a walking Talking encyclopedia would have mentioned it at some point, like:"Too bad we can't use Spore Drive for such and such reasons..." so that means that not only the technology is lost but even the memory of it is lost as well... which is odd, to say the least.
     
  17. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2001
    Location:
    Land of Enchantment
    It's worth noting that, there was a specific scene showing her invoking/partaking in each of the seven sins.

    Given the show already draws heavily on myth and religion and the main theme of season two, I'm sure this will be presented again in some way - perhaps in contrast to Tilly who's the closest thing to manifesting all the virtues.
     
  18. Midquest

    Midquest Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    It seems to me that one of modern Trek's core tenets that is pretty much anymore is redeemable if they want to be redeemed. On that basis, I expect we will see Prime universe virtues reshape who Georgiou is over time. Yes, she's a vile person who's done abominable things. However, she was born into a universe that teaches even the very best people in the Prime universe to be blindly evil as a means of survival because the alternate is death. It's not clear that she's ever known another way of being. To me, that's a fine but important distinction from being an evil emperor in the Prime universe.

    Sure, she might eventually become the big bad of the series and eventually be destroyed, but the more idealistic, silly, wonderful, absurdly Trekkian thing is that she can be changed.

    There's also the fact that Mirror Georgiou is a fan favorite among pretty much everyone I know who's new to Trek by way of Disco. While that's purely anecdotal, she seems to have captured people's interest, and I think it's the greyness that interests them. And the ass-kicking.
     
  19. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2001
    Location:
    Land of Enchantment
    I just hope they don't pull a Laurel Lance with her.
     
  20. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2011
    They can just classify the Spore Drive and no-one living past the 23rd century except those with high enough clearance (and the long lived species) will know it exists, and I doubt every starship carriers every peace of classified material, that would be an huge intelligence risk, so Janeway wouldn't be able to find it in the database.

    And lots of people know about the Genesis device, but it's never re-created.