How is/isn't Discovery Star Trek?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by seigezunt, Sep 11, 2018.

  1. Groppler Zorn

    Groppler Zorn Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    See, I could understand Sarek not mentioning Sybok since he was the product of a previous (presumably failed) marriage and then Sybok drank the Kool Aid... so I could understand why he was never mentioned until Kirk dreamed him up while he, Spock and McCoy slept around the campfire in Star Trek V.

    But why would neither of them mention Michael? Yes I know Vulcans, etc etc but she was in Starfleet. She and Spock have being a first officer in common. She stopped Sarek from doing a genocide. She gave a speech that nobody wanted before the whole Starfleet command council.

    Maybe Michael is so famous that the mere mention of her name by Spock would have induced eye rolls to the point where Bones would have had an epidemic on his hands.

    #OMGSpockstopnamedroppingyourfamoussister
     
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  2. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    [​IMG]
     
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  3. Vger23

    Vger23 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Any time someone stakes the claim that Star Trek is "a thinking person's television show" I stop reading and move on.
     
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  4. dahj

    dahj Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Spock was very "I'm a proper Vulcan boy" at that time, he even avoided mentioning his mother was human, until they met her he only said "one of my ancestors married a human (but great-great-grandma T'Loon was always a bit crazy)" :p
     
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  5. Captain Kris Kringle Pike

    Captain Kris Kringle Pike Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Nah. Way more fun than anything Borg related :techman:
    My read on Sarek and his family (I will not generalize to all Vulcans) is thus: Sarek doesn't speak of family matters or connections, period. Why would Sarek acknowledge himself doing something heinous? Why would he acknowledge Starfleet when he disapproves of their actions, and what he became as a result?

    I think it makes greater sense that he would want to move on rather than remain in that uncomfortable reminder that he had the potential to be just as vicious and violent as the Starfleet he looks down upon.
     
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  6. King Bob!

    King Bob! The King of Kings Premium Member

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    I find Small Universe Syndrome tedious. Whether it be the Borg related to V'Ger, or a generic Starfleet Admiral being a generic asylum prisoner.
     
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  7. Captain Kris Kringle Pike

    Captain Kris Kringle Pike Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    To each their own. :shrug:
     
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  8. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Admiral Admiral

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    They can do all of that and more, and it will still be Star Trek. There is nothing you can do about it.
     
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  9. Burning Hearts of Qo'nOs

    Burning Hearts of Qo'nOs Commodore Commodore

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    This would be my take too. But there's always a chance that Michael's story ends in tragedy or a deep loss for Sarek. He's already been shown in DSC to be pretty damn emotional about his little human daughter, so it may be that it ends up too painful for him to talk about her in general. Spock might carry his jealousy for the rest of his life, never having the affection from Sarek that Michael got (but didn't really get to enjoy either, lol....oh Sarek)
     
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  10. Groppler Zorn

    Groppler Zorn Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    And yet, Michael was brought up as (essentially) a Vulcan girl. Amanda was the only member of the Sarek clan to behave even remotely like a human. And 2/5ths of them were human!

    I wonder whether it’s less about Spock being “Vulcan” and more about Jim’s rule of “no talking about famous relatives on the bridge”.

    But seriously I tend to agree with you. Although I want to learn more about grandma T’Loon now...

    So Sarek’s philosophy is basically “sorry not sorry” and he just gets over it? Hehe...

    I tend to agree with your interpretation here though, based on what we’ve seen of Sarek - even if we only go on TOS, TSFS, TVH, TUC and TNG.

    On a related note - I sometimes marvel at the lengths we go to in order to rationalise things like this in Star Trek. But then again I wonder why Hermione didn’t use the time turner to go back and kill Lord Voldemort, so what do I know about fandom :lol:
     
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  11. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    How often do Star Trek characters ever talk about their families when they're not plot-relevant? Or right. Never.

    When in any episode or film was Micheal ever plot-relevant? Oh right. Never.

    Get over it already.
     
  12. jaime

    jaime Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Especially with some kind of fungal growth getting in the way.
     
  13. Refuge

    Refuge Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It's going to be weird when Michael and her beloved brother meet up :lol:. Then fast forward to TOS and we all know there is nothing about her that resonates. I mean she is human. All those times McCoy chided Spock for being so Vulcan when he was half Vulcan. Yet his Mum and his sister were human. Oh Spock, you could've shared your understanding of humans with experiences from your own family. Happy memories about sis and you. You know like when she scraped her knee and water came out of her eyes and you told her how blood clots and forms a scab and then her knee would in all logic - heal. And she laughed and you raised your eyebrow. :vulcan:
     
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  14. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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    cept i feel like Burnham tried earlier in her life to be more Vulcan than the Vulcans. There's only hints of it.
     
  15. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The notion that Star Trek is 'thinking persons' television is laughable considering how toxic, reactionary, juvenile and downright narrow-minded and afraid of change the majority of the fanbase is. Yeah Trek, explored some important issues, but 90's trek was often pretty ham-fisted in how they went about it. I mean they couldn't even talk about homosexuality or introduce a gay character for crying out loud. Once TNG went off the air trek and focused more on anomalies of the week, boring space politics, wars, and self-contained action/technobabble stories. They did in fact come to rule the show, and this is part of why 90's trek died. The notion that trek was exploring topical, socially relevant issues in each episode is total nonsense.

    Also canon is whatever the showrunners want it to be. They can change things as they see fit to suit the story they want to tell. If that means that Spock gets an adopted human sister, then so be it. Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it 'non-canon'.
     
  16. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    Star Trek was never thinking person's television because it did all the thinking for you. If it wasn't [literally] wearing the metaphor on its face, Kirk/Picard/ whoever gave you the answer during summation.
     
  17. Captain Kris Kringle Pike

    Captain Kris Kringle Pike Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    As Spock would say, "It is a private matter."

    I certainly do not share every detail with my co-workers regarding my family. And I work in community health.
     
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  18. eschaton

    eschaton Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'm not saying that Trek always did a great job at being "Issue TV." But I'm at a loss to think of another non-anthology sci-fi show which has ever even really attempted to do "message" shows on a regular basis. Didactic moral lessons are basically a key part of the Trekkian format - and have been from the beginning. It's one of the reasons why the shows are so family friendly for the most part - because the theme of each episode is so explicit a precocious eight year old can pick up on it, and the show to some extent really does want to teach us something.
     
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  19. Refuge

    Refuge Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Mere existence and being next of kin is hardly private information. I don't think my brother shared much about his family but we were still on record.
     
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  20. Captain Kris Kringle Pike

    Captain Kris Kringle Pike Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Depends on the job. I am very cautious about that information, aggressively so. I have yet to see evidence that Vulcans are caviler or forthcoming regarding their family relationships, Spock especially.
     
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