HEROES 3x12 "Our Father" Discuss and Grade

[Hermiod]

Oh well, so much for that. The great and powerful Bryan Fuller has proven to be just a guy who has no more idea what he's doing than anyone else they've already got.

I disagree. I think he hit the nail right on the head. These past two seasons, I just didn't care about the characters. The writers had just been adding more and more people with powers, more twists, and so the show became flat and cliche.

So they take two of their main characters' powers away to fix that. In fact, arguably, they're the two main characters.

 

[paudemge]

I actually liked micah and his powers.
And who's to say that Sylar doesn't have the haitians powers, can't he get powers like peter did?

 

[Hermiod]

^He can now. He copied Elle's without touching her, though that may be a one off.

 

[The Habs Fan]

I've finally seen this episode and I give it Above Average.

Finally, a great episode after a string of mediocre ones. Sylar and Hiro's plots were the best. Peter unfortunately still annoys me.

 

[Cky]

I enjoyed the episode, I love Heroes and it's the first TV series (minus Doctor Who) that I will sit down and watch. I must admit this series is really turning out brilliantly.

But a few things I don't like about Heroes, and it showed more in this episode and the last, is Sylar's failed redemption, each time I see him I want him to be good now, and Claire, just everything about the whiney bitch annoys me.

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Right so now Hiro has no powers as well as Peter, I imagine the only way they can get powers back is via the Formula but how can they possibly get back their specific ability? it wouldn't surprise me if by the end of this series they end up with abilities but different ones.

 

[Hermiod]

^Exactly what I've been saying for weeks, they will end up with much weaker powers.

 

[Snaploud]

We really have no idea why one individual will get one power over another, so anything's possible. Peter and Hiro could get new powers or the same powers. *shrugs*

 

[Professor Zoom]

Oh well, so much for that. The great and powerful Bryan Fuller has proven to be just a guy who has no more idea what he's doing than anyone else they've already got.

I disagree. I think he hit the nail right on the head. These past two seasons, I just didn't care about the characters. The writers had just been adding more and more people with powers, more twists, and so the show became flat and cliche.

So they take two of their main characters' powers away to fix that. In fact, arguably, they're the two main characters.

Fuller has nothing to do with what is going on right now. He's been working on Pushing Daisies.

 

[stj]

Fuller has his own problems with serialization. But he seems to appreciate the importance of ordinary people in the first season. Foisting some superpowered floozy on the character because, well special people date special people, just ignored the fact that Matt Parker who loved his wife even though she cheated on him was far more interesting. Good sign, in my opinion.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Oh well, so much for that. The great and powerful Bryan Fuller has proven to be just a guy who has no more idea what he's doing than anyone else they've already got.

Granted, Kring was "saying all the right things" not so long ago. I feel like a sucker for falling for that now. But Fuller's got himself a real-live track record. Pushing Daisies nails issues such as consistent characterization and logical plot arcs, and very rarely falters even a little bit. And the dialogue is the wittiest on TV (only high-end cable shows like Dexter can compete in that department.) Heroes desperately needs wittier dialogue or even decent dialogue.

The reason Pushing Daisies got cancelled is that it's too "soft" - it lacks a solid sense of what's at stake. Or I should say, they didn't hit the what's-at-stake hard enough early enough in the season because frustratingly enough, the plotline has developed solidly in that direction now that it's too late.

Heroes doesn't lack a what's-at-stake - it's inherent in the premise - so Fuller's one noticeable weakness, to be too indirect and whimsical, should be neutralized on this show. Fuller has some huge strengths, but I'm not sure it's such a good idea to let him have full creative rein, since his sensibilities are so much at odds with what the viewing public wants, damn their eyes and all other body parts for being so literal-minded and lacking in attention span.

I imagine the only way they can get powers back is via the Formula but how can they possibly get back their specific ability?

We don't really know how the formula works. It could simply tap into whatever the person's "latent ability" is, which might relate to that metaphor thing Fuller was talking about. The ability comes from who the character is, and their place in the story.

Peter's mimic ability seems right for him, but needs to be given a huge downside to inhibit him from using it. Hiro needs different powers or none at all or to be written off the show.

 

[Mallet]

We don't really know how the formula works. It could simply tap into whatever the person's "latent ability" is, which might relate to that metaphor thing Fuller was talking about. The ability comes from who the character is, and their place in the story.

Didn't Mohinder say that they could give whatever power they wanted to each person?

 

[Messianni]

We don't really know how the formula works. It could simply tap into whatever the person's "latent ability" is, which might relate to that metaphor thing Fuller was talking about. The ability comes from who the character is, and their place in the story.

Didn't Mohinder say that they could give whatever power they wanted to each person?

Mohinder is also a complete dunce.

 

[Hermiod]

Granted, Kring was "saying all the right things" not so long ago. I feel like a sucker for falling for that now.

Fuller's not saying the right things, though. Peter's got one episode to get his powers back before the chapter ends or we are very much in X-Treme X-Men/Rogue territory. Not an experience I want to go through again.

Hiro needs different powers or none at all or to be written off the show.

The same or killed off for me. No presto-changeo just because a person's powers are inconvenient for the writers. If you can't tell interesting stories about a guy who can stop time, teleport and time travel then go be an accountant or a brick layer because you lack the imagination to be a TV writer.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

We don't really know how the formula works. It could simply tap into whatever the person's "latent ability" is, which might relate to that metaphor thing Fuller was talking about. The ability comes from who the character is, and their place in the story.

Didn't Mohinder say that they could give whatever power they wanted to each person?

Mohinder is also a complete dunce.

Good old Mo, he'd probably give people the opposite power from what he intended. But I thought this formula/catalyst/sparkly gold cloud thangy was something old, that they used to give Nathan his useless flying power, that daddy was so unimpressed by.

Or is the formula different from the sparkly gold cloud? I can't be bothered to keep track because I agree with Bryan Fuller that such things are meaningless gimmicks not worthy of sustained attention.

Peter's got one episode to get his powers back before the chapter ends or we are very much in X-Treme X-Men/Rogue territory.

You may as well be speaking Swahili. I'm looking forward to Peter staying unpowered for the better part of this season. I know damn well it's going to end someday, may as well enjoy it while it lasts. Just hope the writers make good use of it and don't waste this opportunity like they tend to do.

 

[Caligula]

We don't really know how the formula works. It could simply tap into whatever the person's "latent ability" is, which might relate to that metaphor thing Fuller was talking about. The ability comes from who the character is, and their place in the story.

Didn't Mohinder say that they could give whatever power they wanted to each person?

Seth Brundle believed his telepods could transport living organisms without any lasting side-effects. We saw what happened to him....

 

[Sakrysta]

I don't feel like monkeying with the quote tags, but to answer your question, Temis, there were two halves of the formula - the half that Kaito had, and the one the Haitian was transporting when the Matt/Daphne/Hiro/Ando crew showed up. THEN somewhere along the way we were told that there was a third element that was needed to make the formula work the way it should - the mysterious "catalyst" that was safeguarded within a person. So presumably, without the catalyst, the formula either does nothing, or (more likely) royally messes with a person's system, ala Mo-zilla.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

I don't feel like monkeying with the quote tags, but to answer your question, Temis, there were two halves of the formula - the half that Kaito had, and the one the Haitian was transporting when the Matt/Daphne/Hiro/Ando crew showed up. THEN somewhere along the way we were told that there was a third element that was needed to make the formula work the way it should - the mysterious "catalyst" that was safeguarded within a person. So presumably, without the catalyst, the formula either does nothing, or (more likely) royally messes with a person's system, ala Mo-zilla.

Wow, they certainly did not manage to convey that notion in the clear and succinct manner required by serialized TV plotlines. And someone should have realized it's way too much gobblydegook to cram into a storyline anyway, and simplified it drastically before integrating it into the plotline. Or better yet, just tossed it. It's too much of a macguffin, just something to toss into the plot to have the characters chase around after. Really, who cares? Chase one thing, chase three things, chase a hundred things. How about expending all that effort on the characters instead?

If anyone still doesn't know why the ratings have tanked, this is it: too much effort spent on crap nobody cares about.

 

[DWF]

I don't feel like monkeying with the quote tags, but to answer your question, Temis, there were two halves of the formula - the half that Kaito had, and the one the Haitian was transporting when the Matt/Daphne/Hiro/Ando crew showed up. THEN somewhere along the way we were told that there was a third element that was needed to make the formula work the way it should - the mysterious "catalyst" that was safeguarded within a person. So presumably, without the catalyst, the formula either does nothing, or (more likely) royally messes with a person's system, ala Mo-zilla.

Nikki, her sister and Nathan all turned out fine, Suresh just isn't much of a scientist and it shows in his work.

 

[Hermiod]

You may as well be speaking Swahili.

Rogue starts off with her ability to absorb powers temporarily.

Then, she absorb's Ms. Marvel's and her powers stick for good.

Then she absorbs a Skrull girl which causes her to randomly manifest powers she'd absorbed in the past.

Sage then gives her the ability to choose which abilities she manifests and she single handedly defeats an alien invasion with those powers. She becomes a one-woman army to the point where the rest of the characters aren't even necessary anymore.

Then she gets a sword through the chest and all of her powers go completely.

We then had to sit through issue after issue of Rogue trying to prove she can be a hero without powers. Sound familiar ? Admittedly, she did a lot better job of it than Peter has here.

Then, inexplicably, her original power returns (the fact that she was now a regular in Chuck Austen's book and not Chris Claremont's anymore is not a coincidence).

Then she absorb's Sunfire's powers and gets those permanently, and then finally after all of that she gets reset again.

Chop, change, chop, change. All the time, never stopping. People wanted to see Rogue written out back then, and now I think the same of Peter. Just write him out, he's useless.

There's plenty of pretty boy actors you can bring in to the show to replace him.

Nikki, her sister and Nathan all turned out fine, Suresh just isn't much of a scientist and it shows in his work.

No, when they gave Nikki, Tracy and Nathan their powers they had access to Ishi Nakamura, and thus the catalyst.